unfortunately not for beginners

[Quasi]

very nice campaign, but it would be nicer if they would leave to the player what is displayed on the F10 map everything or not. Would be yes adjustable via the DCS main menu and thus better suited for beginners. Maybe you could realize this in another version.

Thanks for your work and all the best for the future.

Best regards Quasi

[fastfed]

also where is labels some people need them on for vision issues..

 

 

Can we please allow labels if we want?? I dont understand why any campaign maker would force this stuff on or off, if you dont want full map or labels you turn them off. its easy. 

[Grodin]

You can just tick the option from settings to override mission settings with your own i think.

[Rudel_chw]

1 hour ago, CageyLobster said:

Reflected disabled that ability

 

I get that you hate the guy, but please don't be a tool and take note that this Campaign is not one of Reflected's   

[CageyLobster]

2 minutes ago, Rudel_chw said:

 

I get that you hate the guy, but please don't be a tool and take note that this Campaign is not one of Reflected's   

It was a miss-post.  I apologize.  I don't know how this got here.

[ChillNG]

8 hours ago, fastfed said:

also where is labels some people need them on for vision issues..

 

 

Can we please allow labels if we want?? I dont understand why any campaign maker would force this stuff on or off, if you dont want full map or labels you turn them off. its easy. 

Does the over ride settings feature allow you to do this, assuming it works?

There are mission design reasons I enforce neutral dots, so as not to spoil surprises for the player and maintain the difficulty balance (SAM hunting is ruined a little by a red label telling you where it is) but on the understanding that you can choose to opt out of this through overriding the settings if you need to.

If this isn't the case please let me know.

[Trigati]

Alas overide does not work if mission maker ‘forces’ a setting…it only overrides a normal mossion setting with the clients choice for that feature.

I think ED have not been that clear on how this works but I’ve tested it quite a bit.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ChillNG]

4 minutes ago, Trigati said:

Alas overide does not work if mission maker ‘forces’ a setting…it only overrides a normal mossion setting with the clients choice for that feature.

I think ED have not been that clear on how this works but I’ve tested it quite a bit.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Ah ok, appreciate the clarification.

[Quasi]

...it's just a shame when you can't handle it and then don't want to continue flying the mission/campaign because of increasing frustration.

In addition, it keeps me from buying more campaigns if I lack the game fun.

It is also the case that you can not test fly the campaigns and thus buy a pig in a poke. In addition, the thing is expressly excluded from the exchange.

Of course, the creator of the campaign can do whatever he wants, but we are customers and then stay away.

I personally will not buy another campaign that can not be adjusted in the difficulty scale!

 

Best regards Quasi

Edited October 26, 2023 by Quasi

[ChillNG]

19 minutes ago, Quasi said:

...it's just a shame when you can't handle it and then don't want to continue flying the mission/campaign because of increasing frustration.

In addition, it keeps me from buying more campaigns if I lack the game fun.

It is also the case that you can not test fly the campaigns and thus buy a pig in a poke. In addition, the thing is expressly excluded from the exchange.

Of course, the creator of the campaign can do whatever he wants, but we are customers and then stay away.

I personally will not buy another campaign that can not be adjusted in the difficulty scale!

 

Best regards Quasi

Hi, I was just writing a response to your first post when you sent the above...

Thanks for you thoughts, always appreciated.  I would agree and say yes it's not for beginners, you will need to be comfortable fighting in the F-16 and I do design missions to challenge players and test not just your piloting ability but ability to build and maintain situational awareness.  However, with all that said I like to also give the player lots of guidance, the extensive comms, briefings and documentation will help you build that SA.  If struggling to find a target then you'll often find your fellow flight members will assist you in locating it, sometimes even giving you the exact coordinates, sometimes taking the target for you.  And if you are struggling with a task...well then you can always abort it and move on, failure in a task is not a problem in this campaign, it is a viable way of completing a mission.  I think there are far better ways of helping the player find what they're looking for than just using the F10 map, in fact I would argue that designing in the process of finding targets is a more helpful way of doing it, as it leverages the F-16s systems that are designed for just this thing..would you rather be given the exact coordinates through the mission itself than having to enter the map and write them down?  The risk with this campaign of having all the enemy units on the map is that it undermines the basic premise of the entire campaign - that of SAM hunting, you're supposed to be flying around searching for things, playing cat and mouse and baiting them into firing on you.  It's hard to execute ambushes with SAMS when you can already see them on the map.

Immortal mode is also offered as a player assistance as the campaign can be challenging.

The thing with DCS is it's a broad player base, there are types of campaigns for all players - the trick is to find the creator that builds the thing you enjoy and want.  Which is why I do in fact offer a demo of mission 1 of all my campaigns.

Anyway, thanks for your input, I always welcome the feedback.

Edited October 26, 2023 by ChillNG

[Quasi]

Too bad I did not find your demo version before buying, good for you

Thanks for your time and your answers.

[ChillNG]

Just now, Quasi said:

Too bad I did not find your demo version before buying, good for you

Thanks for your time and your answers.

My pleasure, if you decide to push on with the campaign then please come back to me if you want any further assistance.

[Rudel_chw]

56 minutes ago, ChillNG said:

Which is why I do in fact offer a demo of mission 1 of all my campaigns.

 

Yes, that is in fact a great detail and wish other Campaign authors did the same:

 

 

[ChillNG]

6 minutes ago, Rudel_chw said:

 

Yes, that is in fact a great detail and wish other Campaign authors did the same:

 

 

We've asked ED about it a few times but not happened yet, maybe one day!

[Jayhawk1971]

The hardest thing in the campaign so far has been me hamfisting the Viper's HOTAS. Especially the Mavericks: auto handoff being off (for me at least) has ruined many a good approach (and cost me some points for being late in destroying the target).

One addition to the missions would be really nice: maybe with a future patch, placing an area (marked on the F10 map) with some ground units (say, "Jordanian army staging area") between waypoint 1 and the border of controlled airspace around H4, where the player could find some vehicles to boresight the Mavericks. I feel there's nothing on the ground at H4 far enough away to avoid the parallax effect?

So, for example, player takes off, flies the departure until being handed off, then before reaching waypoint 1 to "start" the ingress phase, he can align the Mavericks without having to worry about flight plan or getting shot at.

Also, +1 on optional labels. Would be nice for those with older VR headsets (red dots would be sufficient in my case).

[Jayhawk1971]

vor 3 Stunden schrieb ChillNG:

However, with all that said I like to also give the player lots of guidance, the extensive comms, briefings and documentation will help you build that SA. 

Yes, the comms are outstanding, providing feedback where the player could become disoriented or not sure whether he's flown far enough/ too far (mission 5, for example). 

[ChillNG]

1 hour ago, Jayhawk1971 said:

The hardest thing in the campaign so far has been me hamfisting the Viper's HOTAS. Especially the Mavericks: auto handoff being off (for me at least) has ruined many a good approach (and cost me some points for being late in destroying the target).

One addition to the missions would be really nice: maybe with a future patch, placing an area (marked on the F10 map) with some ground units (say, "Jordanian army staging area") between waypoint 1 and the border of controlled airspace around H4, where the player could find some vehicles to boresight the Mavericks. I feel there's nothing on the ground at H4 far enough away to avoid the parallax effect?

So, for example, player takes off, flies the departure until being handed off, then before reaching waypoint 1 to "start" the ingress phase, he can align the Mavericks without having to worry about flight plan or getting shot at.

Also, +1 on optional labels. Would be nice for those with older VR headsets (red dots would be sufficient in my case).

Thanks for the thoughts, some good ideas.  Would you find the red dots significantly more useful than the neutral dots?

[Jayhawk1971]

vor 1 Minute schrieb ChillNG:

Thanks for the thoughts, some good ideas.  Would you find the red dots significantly more useful than the neutral dots?

In the current iteration, yes, I suppose. The neutral dots are too blurry at long range, and hardly noticeable at closer ranges with my Vive Pro. This could be a 2.9 thing, though. The red dots have always been more prominent against terrain, and provided a good balance between spotting something, yet not knowing what exactly.

[wowbagger]

Ya, I still don't get it. Players can always turn these things off, no override needed. What they can't do is turn them on. It makes no sense to needlessly limit the audience ... but whatever. It's a dead horse at this point.

[Trigati]

9 hours ago, ChillNG said:

Ah ok, appreciate the clarification.

As a quick follow up...it is still possible for a user to manually remove the mission maker forced overides if they have 7zip and a text editor....and want to do it...although it then it gets corrected with every update but if they feel that strongly about wanting things their way (for whatever reason - and labels for some users seems to be a must for some with visual issues) it is possible to fly your missions with them fully on.

[Quasi]

@Trigati

Then please explain how you do it and what exactly needs to be changed? I opened the *.miz with WinRar but which entries do I have to change in the "mission" or "options" in the text editor?

["optionsView"] = "optview_all", it is not!

 

[ChillNG]

1 hour ago, wowbagger said:

Ya, I still don't get it. Players can always turn these things off, no override needed. What they can't do is turn them on. It makes no sense to needlessly limit the audience ... but whatever. It's a dead horse at this point.

I guess it's been my point of view that it's better for the minority that are asking for it to opt in, rather than force everyone else to opt out at the mission start.  But if the force override isn't working then that changes the discussion.  Always think it's worth the feedback and discussion, I've already opened up allied and weapons views based on your feedback specifically.

1 hour ago, Jayhawk1971 said:

In the current iteration, yes, I suppose. The neutral dots are too blurry at long range, and hardly noticeable at closer ranges with my Vive Pro. This could be a 2.9 thing, though. The red dots have always been more prominent against terrain, and provided a good balance between spotting something, yet not knowing what exactly.

Ok that's fair enough, thanks for the clear explanation of why that would help, I've always felt neutral dots were pretty visible but it's good to hear a different view point.  Given that the override setting isn't working as expected, I'll probably look to change this to coloured dots.

[Trigati]

I don't feel that openly posting a way to circumvent a mission builder's design choices is the right thing to do, not my style at least and would disrespect the effort and vision they have. I just wanted people who really do need to be able to make such changes (for me it's poor visuals that mean without labels I cannot ever see a bandit till well past the merge) that it is simple and possible to do without needing to hassle the mission/campaign builders or to miss out on their great content!

@ChillNG -I  loved OCN so much I purchased 'Weasels' on release day....even though I've never flown the F-16.....thanks for your work! Maybe in a few months of learning the Viper I get to fly it!

[ChillNG]

1 minute ago, Trigati said:

I don't feel that openly posting a way to circumvent a mission builder's design choices is the right thing to do, not my style at least and would disrespect the effort and vision they have. I just wanted people who really do need to be able to make such changes (for me it's poor visuals that mean without labels I cannot ever see a bandit till well past the merge) that it is simple and possible to do without needing to hassle the mission/campaign builders or to miss out on their great content!

@ChillNG -I  loved OCN so much I purchased 'Weasels' on release day....even though I've never flown the F-16.....thanks for your work! Maybe in a few months of learning the Viper I get to fly it!

Thanks, I really appreciate that.  Definitely worth learning the Viper, it's a lot of fun, and Weaseling in it is a blast!  I don't feel it's disrespectful to ask for changes like this, if there's ways of making alterations to the experience and that's what you want to do then that's fair enough, so long as you understand you might not be getting the exact experience that was intended.  It's a shame the force override option doesn't actually do that, as it would be ideal...like I said above, allowing people to opt in to the changes.

[wowbagger]

2 hours ago, ChillNG said:

I guess it's been my point of view that it's better for the minority that are asking for it to opt in, rather than force everyone else to opt out at the mission start.  But if the force override isn't working then that changes the discussion.  Always think it's worth the feedback and discussion, I've already opened up allied and weapons views based on your feedback specifically.

The thing is that if the mission designer doesn't set this stuff it will just take the user's preferences. So people who like to play with it all off anyway, will have it off. They don't need the mission to do it for them. Of course if there is a good mission-breaking-for-all reason to turn something off, that's understandable.

I get that mission designers have a vision of the way their creations should be played. But at the end of the day it's a product, so customers are going to give feedback about what they like, what they don't like, and what could be improved in their view. And whether they will purchase again.

I'm delighted to hear that the external and weapons views are unlocked already! And I totally agree that discussion about this stuff is very valuable. 

There was recently a question asked about why people aren't buying more DCS campaigns. Reasons were given. Then the reply came back about why those reasons didn't match with how the mission designers want to make missions. Which made me feel ... I don't know.

At the end of the day we all want campaign designers to prosper and thrive. I've bought more campaigns than I could possibly play in the next couple of years. But if the campaigns are increasingly not matching with the requirements that life throws at us or one's preferences for what is actually enjoyable... it stops being sustainable. For me the middle ground is making things as open and accessible to as many people as possible. Which means concessions from everyone involved. Don't lock out things just to please a small group of vocal people, when they are perfectly capable of changing that stuff themselves. And on the flip side, players shouldn't whine if there's a mission or two with refueling, or night missions. Maybe no one is perfectly happy, but everyone gets enough to enjoy and the system is sustainable.

 

In any event, congrats on Weasels release!

Edited October 26, 2023 by wowbagger