DCRealistic & SimHaptic DCS Support - Announcement (Resolved)

[rkApps.shop]

UPDATE 3:

It is now confirmed that SimHaptic and DCRealistic are officially support DCS with ED approval. Thanks ED for their time and cooperation, and thanks all for your patience.
 

UPDATE 2:

Good news, everyone! We just concluded a productive meeting with the ED team, and I'm pleased to share some positive updates. Firstly, I'd like to extend my gratitude to the ED team for their time and understanding. We discovered there had been an email communication issue, which has now been resolved, allowing us to have this important discussion.

During the meeting, the ED team thoroughly reviewed DCRealistic and SimHaptic. I'm happy to report that they found no issues with these products, and they are supportive of them being available for use. While this is still in the clarification stage, we expect to receive official confirmation within the next 72 hours.

Thank you all for your patience and support as we move forward!

UPDATE 1:

Hey everyone, thanks so much for your support! Because of this thread and the help of @BIGNEWY, we've been able to connect with ED and are now working on a solution. We'll keep you updated with any news.

---

Dear Pilots,

DCRealistic

We regret to inform you that we must temporarily remove DCRealistic from our store due to a compliance issue with Eagle Dynamics' (ED) End User License Agreement (EULA). According to the EULA, we are not permitted to sell DCRealistic or similar content without explicit permission from ED or becoming an official partner.

For the past month, we have made significant efforts to contact ED to seek the necessary permissions. Unfortunately, we have not yet received a response. This situation is disheartening, as we have invested considerable time and effort into developing DCRealistic, and we know it has been well-received by the community.

For Users Who Have Already Purchased DCRealistic:

If you have already purchased DCRealistic, we sincerely apologize for any inconvenience this situation may cause. Due to legal requirements, we must ask that you discontinue the use of DCRealistic until we can resolve this issue. We are actively seeking attention and resolution with ED and will keep you informed of any developments. If this issue is not resolved within the next month, we will automatically issue refunds to all customers who purchased the product.

SimHaptic

We regret to inform you of some necessary changes to our SimHaptic product. This adjustment is required due to a compliance issue with Eagle Dynamics' (ED) End User License Agreement (EULA). According to the EULA, we are not permitted to include support for DCS World in our product without explicit permission from ED or becoming an official partner.

Changes to SimHaptic

Beginning with the next update, we will be removing DCS support from SimHaptic. We understand this may be disappointing news for some users, especially those who have been enjoying the added immersion in DCS. Please note that SimHaptic was available prior to adding DCS support, and the DCS functionality was provided as a free upgrade. Therefore, users who have already received this upgrade may continue to use the DCS support as it currently stands.

If you know anyone from the ED team who may assist in resolving this situation, please let us know. Your support in connecting us with the right individuals would be greatly appreciated.

For reference, please see the relevant section of the Eagle Dynamics EULA below:
Eagle Dynamics EULA - https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/support/license

Best regards,
rkApps

Edited August 7, 2024 by rkApps.shop

[TFS]

It's a shame to see this, the community additions to DCS are really what ties it all together. Having more and more immsersive additions only benefits the players AND ED as we continue to return.

Without many user made and community made scripts, mods, and software, the game loses much of it's functions. I don't see how this benefits ED, unless they plan to implement and capitalize on such features themselves thus somehow a user agreement issue. 

 

Major example is community scripting of CTLD. Logistics in someway has been broken after the last months patch. There are some servers that are crippled, servers that bring returning players daily, now maybe they have their own CTLD finally. These features and servers bring loads of enjoyment to people who spend a heck of a lot of time and money and keep returning. DCS is basically a hobby in its self. 

So good luck to finding a resolution. Hope it's speedy and clean. Otherwise unfortunate to see this go.  

[Hiob]

@BIGNEWY may be able to make contact to the right persons at ED? Or @Wags

 

And on a personal note: I would beg ED to not put too many hurdles in front of rkApps. Wether you need it or not, it's an enrichment to DCS imho. 

Edited August 1, 2024 by Hiob

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

Oh no...

[A.F.]

I don't understand it! What is the problem?
On the one hand, ED prohibits the use of such apps, on the other hand, they don't manage to make it mandatory for third-party providers to support Leap Motion modules. Will PointCTRL soon be banned too? Or the Slugmouse? Or SSA?….Or because it competes with SSA ?
Everything brings benefits to the game, everything increases immersion - just the way we want it.

Is it because this company charges money for their product?
If you don't want that, then take these guys into your company as a third party supplier and pay them for their great work

Come on ED! Get moving, be reasonable and support the efforts of such creative people to improve the game... if you can't do it yourself!

Edited August 1, 2024 by A.F.

[Baldrick33]

17 minutes ago, A.F. said:

I don't understand it! What is the problem?
On the one hand, ED prohibits the use of such apps, on the other hand, they don't manage to make it mandatory for third-party providers to support Leap Motion modules. Will PointCTRL soon be banned too? Or the Slugmouse? Or SSA?….
Everything brings benefits to the game, everything increases immersion - just the way we want it.

Is it because this company charges money for their product?
If you don't want that, then take these guys into your company as a third party supplier and pay them for their great work

Come on ED! Get moving, be reasonable and support the efforts of such creative people to improve the game... if you can't do it yourself!

 

I believe the issue is that charging for a program utility requires prior ED approval as per the license. 

[A.F.]

vor 4 Minuten schrieb Baldrick33:

I believe the issue is that charging for a program utility requires prior ED approval as per the license. 

Ok. Then they should come to an agreement quickly...for the benefit of us users

[rkApps.shop]

6 minutes ago, Baldrick33 said:

I believe the issue is that charging for a program utility requires prior ED approval as per the license. 

2 minutes ago, A.F. said:

Ok. Then they should come to an agreement quickly...for the benefit of us users

Absolutely, I'm all in. However, the challenge is getting Eagle Dynamics' attention on this matter. We've submitted multiple support tickets but haven't received a proper response / follow up. Any assistance in finding a solution / contact person would be greatly appreciated.

[BIGNEWY]

1 hour ago, rkApps.shop said:

Dear Pilots,

DCRealistic

We regret to inform you that we must temporarily remove DCRealistic from our store due to a compliance issue with Eagle Dynamics' (ED) End User License Agreement (EULA). According to the EULA, we are not permitted to sell DCRealistic or similar content without explicit permission from ED or becoming an official partner.

For the past month, we have made significant efforts to contact ED to seek the necessary permissions. Unfortunately, we have not yet received a response. This situation is disheartening, as we have invested considerable time and effort into developing DCRealistic, and we know it has been well-received by the community.

For Users Who Have Already Purchased DCRealistic:

If you have already purchased DCRealistic, we sincerely apologize for any inconvenience this situation may cause. Due to legal requirements, we must ask that you discontinue the use of DCRealistic until we can resolve this issue. We are actively seeking attention and resolution with ED and will keep you informed of any developments. If this issue is not resolved within the next month, we will automatically issue refunds to all customers who purchased the product.

SimHaptic

We regret to inform you of some necessary changes to our SimHaptic product. This adjustment is required due to a compliance issue with Eagle Dynamics' (ED) End User License Agreement (EULA). According to the EULA, we are not permitted to include support for DCS World in our product without explicit permission from ED or becoming an official partner.

Changes to SimHaptic

Beginning with the next update, we will be removing DCS support from SimHaptic. We understand this may be disappointing news for some users, especially those who have been enjoying the added immersion in DCS. Please note that SimHaptic was available prior to adding DCS support, and the DCS functionality was provided as a free upgrade. Therefore, users who have already received this upgrade may continue to use the DCS support as it currently stands.

If you know anyone from the ED team who may assist in resolving this situation, please let us know. Your support in connecting us with the right individuals would be greatly appreciated.

For reference, please see the relevant section of the Eagle Dynamics EULA below:
Eagle Dynamics EULA - https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/support/license

Best regards,
rkApps

 

Hi, 

please PM me, let me know who you have been in contact with already. 

best regards

bignewy

[rkApps.shop]

8 minutes ago, BIGNEWY said:

Hi, 

please PM me, let me know who you have been in contact with already. 

best regards

bignewy

Done

[Falken2]

What a shame ! I really wish ED and rkApps come to an agreement. I just bought expensive hardware, Haptics Buttkicker, and then I tested and then bought rkApps SImhaptic, because it's much better then the original Buttkicker software. I also tested and wanted to buy DCrealistic just today, which I can't now. 

VR + Buttkicker + SimHaptic + DCRealistic is the best experience of immersion I ever got.

I understand that rkApps earns money thanks to existence of ED. And ED earns money thanks to the existence of Intel, AMD, Nvidia .... etc, ... 

ED should really have a good policy to encourage third parties to improve DCS world environment. And by the way, it might be off topic (or not), I went into DCS because of the Mirage 2000 (I'm french). You see what I mean. I also bought the mudhen/

 

 

 

Edited August 1, 2024 by Falken2
english mistake correction

[PaulXKRS]

Both of these programs greatly enhance the experience of flying within DCS. I'm a recent convert to the world of haptic enhancement. It would be great shame and massive disappointment to see future support prohibited.

[Monkeydonut]

I would like to strongly advocate for ED granting rkApps an official license for SimHaptic.

I've a rather expensive motion rig setup with 4 ButtKicker Minis on it.  SimHaptic is BY FAR the best software I have used for interpreting DCS telemetry and converting it into extremely immersive haptic feedback.  The official software that came with my rig is woefully inadequate for flight simulation and SimHaptic has massively improved my enjoyment of DCS - allowing a deep level of customisation for each aircraft. It's extremely well produced and functions very well.

I would go so far to say that SimHaptic is increasing the amount of money I spend on DCS - it certainly makes me more excited to play - and I can only see a benefit to ED in partnering with companies whose software supports their simulator and makes DCS more enjoyable. Massive thumbs up to rkApps - ED please do the right thing and make them official partners.

[Hiob]

Folks, just to be clear - and avoid unecessary heat:

AFAIK - the only problem so far is, that rkApps had problems in contacting ED on the matter. They deactivated their apps as a precaution to not violate EDs EULAs.

So far ED has neither denied or charged them to make their App available as far as I'm aware off.

Please correct me, but in the meantime, we should just chill.

[PierPaolo]

Please ED, support rkApps.
DCS is not the same without your improvements.
I hope they reach an agreement and ED looks after its variety of clients.
Lately ED does nothing but put stones in the way, rather than speeding it up for a better experience for its users.
Please think about the users, with good intentions everything can be solved.

[KeyserSoze62]

Hope this gets resolved quickly for you @rkApps.shop This is a terrific product and supported by a terrific guy. 

[Slippa]

Hope this gets sorted out soon. I don’t use it personally but appreciate the situation. 

 

 

[Panzerlang]

So...don't update either app and continue to use them.

In other news...ready-meals bought from Tesco may not be cooked in Brand-X microwaves, due to Brand-X not getting Tesco's permission. Or sumfink like dat.

2 hours ago, Falken2 said:

What a shame ! I really wish ED and rkApps come to an agreement. I just bought expensive hardware, Haptics Buttkicker, and then I tested and then bought rkApps SImhaptic, because it's much better then the original Buttkicker software. I also tested and wanted to buy DCrealistic just today, which I can't now. 

VR + Buttkicker + SimHaptic + DCRealistic is the best experience of immersion I ever got.

I understand that rkApps earns money thanks to existence of ED. And ED earns money thanks to the existence of Intel, AMD, Nvidia .... etc, ... 

ED should really have a good policy to encourage third parties to improve DCS world environment. And by the way, it might be off topic (or not), I went into DCS because of the Mirage 2000 (I'm french). You see what I mean. I also bought the mudhen/

 

 

 

 

And ED makes more money because a percentage of users buy it due to 3rd-party products that significantly enhance it. It's a two-way deal, in which one might wonder who should be paying who. Answer...nobody, due to mutual benefit.

Edited August 1, 2024 by Panzerlang

[Baldrick33]

1 hour ago, Panzerlang said:

And ED makes more money because a percentage of users buy it due to 3rd-party products that significantly enhance it. It's a two-way deal, in which one might wonder who should be paying who. Answer...nobody, due to mutual benefit.

 

The risk is that without any agreement the third party product ceases to work and people get cross because they have paid good money. If ED know that upcoming projects may make the third party product obsolete or require significant work they can avoid the customer unhappiness by not approving it or at least having a discussion with the third party of its longevity. How well that process works is another matter but it isn’t that uncommon for paid third party utilities to require endorsement from the developer of the main product.

[Hiob]

4 minutes ago, Baldrick33 said:

The risk is that without any agreement the third party product ceases to work and people get cross because they have paid good money. If ED know that upcoming projects may make the third party product obsolete or require significant work they can avoid the customer unhappiness by not approving it or at least having a discussion with the third party of its longevity. How well that process works is another matter but it isn’t that uncommon for paid third party utilities to require endorsement from the developer of the main product.

Voices of reason.
 

ED is pretty chill about free(!) third party projects obviously - in general. When money gets involved, things change. People will eventually blame ED if a paid third party app ceases to work.

[rkApps.shop]

Hey everyone, thanks so much for your support! Because of this thread and the help of @BIGNEWY, we've been able to connect with ED and are now working on a solution. We'll keep you updated with any news.

[Hiob]

Cool. TY

 

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

2 hours ago, rkApps.shop said:

Hey everyone, thanks so much for your support! Because of this thread and the help of @BIGNEWY, we've been able to connect with ED and are now working on a solution. We'll keep you updated with any news.

Thank goodness, finally some good news. I cannot speak for others, even though I have paid, if there would be a need to pay again just in case, here take my Sterling.

Edited August 1, 2024 by VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants

[PaulXKRS]

6 hours ago, Hiob said:

Folks, just to be clear - and avoid unecessary heat:

AFAIK - the only problem so far is, that rkApps had problems in contacting ED on the matter. They deactivated their apps as a precaution to not violate EDs EULAs.

So far ED has neither denied or charged them to make their App available as far as I'm aware off.

Please correct me, but in the meantime, we should just chill.

I think the objective  was to raise the profile of the issue a bit so that ED contacted rkApps directly. Looks like that has happened, so mission accomplished. Of course I'm sure we'll  now get the usual parade of flamers jumping on the thread...  

[rkApps.shop]

Good news, everyone! We just concluded a productive meeting with the ED team, and I'm pleased to share some positive updates.

Firstly, I'd like to extend my gratitude to the ED team for their time and understanding. We discovered there had been an email communication issue, which has now been resolved, allowing us to have this important discussion.

During the meeting, the ED team thoroughly reviewed DCRealistic and SimHaptic. I'm happy to report that they found no issues with these products, and they are supportive of them being available for use. While this is still in the clarification stage, we expect to receive official confirmation within the next 72 hours.

Thank you all for your patience and support as we move forward!

rkApps

Edited August 1, 2024 by rkApps.shop