Afghan Assets

[Dropship Pilot]

There is a lot of talk about all the bases in Afghanistan but I think we are missing a much more important piece: Afghan People

- One (better more) civilian male(s) and female(s) (with different liveries like with the insurgent pack)

- A civilian crowd to create busy market street (similar to the airshow crowd)

- Unarmed/civilian versions of the armed pickup trucks with cargo and/or people as payload and one or two civilian vehicles typical to Afghanistan (a motorcycle with two civilians/insurgents on it for example).

- An Afghan police officer as well as a typical Afghan police car.

- Afghan Military Soldiers (Rifle, RPG, LMG)

- A loaded pack donkey/mule and one with a rider. 

- A goat (with different liveries to create a herd)

- A few placeable Afghan buildings (those from the Caucasus look really out of place!)

 

I think those assets could really bring the Afghanistan map to life. What do you think

 

Here a few examples:

 

Cheers DSP

[Gunfreak]

We won't get unarmed people for obvious reasons. But I'm all for more variety in ground units.

[Darcaem]

I do think the  goat is the key asset here

Jokes aside, I fully agree. And why not unarmed "background" assets? As Dropship Pilot said, we already have airshow crowd (or is that asset part of a mod and not part of DCS?)

[MAXsenna]

@Dropship Pilot I totally agree! 

@Gunfreak Probably not, while ED could provide pure models, and let the community make skins. 

[Stratos]

Agree, we really need more Afghan assets! I really like the idea of the guys with a donkey!

 

[YoYo]

12 hours ago, Dropship Pilot said:

There is a lot of talk about all the bases in Afghanistan but I think we are missing a much more important piece: Afghan People

- One (better more) civilian male(s) and female(s) (with different liveries like with the insurgent pack)

- A civilian crowd to create busy market street (similar to the airshow crowd)

- Unarmed/civilian versions of the armed pickup trucks with cargo and/or people as payload and one or two civilian vehicles typical to Afghanistan (a motorcycle with two civilians/insurgents on it for example).

- An Afghan police officer as well as a typical Afghan police car.

- Afghan Military Soldiers (Rifle, RPG, LMG)

- A loaded pack donkey/mule and one with a rider. 

- A goat (with different liveries to create a herd)

- A few placeable Afghan buildings (those from the Caucasus look really out of place!)

 

I think those assets could really bring the Afghanistan map to life. What do you think

 

Here a few examples:

 

Cheers DSP

In general, more characters would be useful, including civilians, despite appearances, this is quite an important topic in every conflict. But first, let the announced new animations of soldier models appear, there are some that still do not have even walking animations (example JTAC) so fingers crossed!

[graveyard4DCS]

We definitely need Afghan trucks...

[MAXsenna]

46 minutes ago, graveyard4DCS said:

We definitely need Afghan trucks...

With a livery contest to follow.  

[Gierasimov]

Fully agree, although 15 years of DCS history shows that it is not going to happen. Even half baked WW2 Asset Pack paid module got stuck, most of the stuff that would make sense for Normandy and Channels map is not there. Afghanistan, Syria, Sinai all we have is just a bunch of disjoint units here and there. 

[shagrat]

Am 12.10.2024 um 22:25 schrieb Gunfreak:

We won't get unarmed people for obvious reasons. But I'm all for more variety in ground units.

We already have Deck crew and personnel to place, which is unarmed, as well. 

Apart from allowing to make the maps feel more alive, it would actually enable mission designers, to create meaningful conditions that reflect ROEs.

Especially in the asymmetrical conflicts in Afghanistan, Syria and Iraq, the Rules Of Engagement, the need to ensure no harm to non-combatants, is a key tactical element!

...and if someone is concerned about "civilians": laying waste to whole city blocks, afghan villages and fields of crop, is not exactly the Geneva convention spirit, either, despite being simulated in DCS.

[Gunfreak]

57 minutes ago, shagrat said:

We already have Deck crew and personnel to place, which is unarmed, as well. 

Apart from allowing to make the maps feel more alive, it would actually enable mission designers, to create meaningful conditions that reflect ROEs.

Especially in the asymmetrical conflicts in Afghanistan, Syria and Iraq, the Rules Of Engagement, the need to ensure no harm to non-combatants, is a key tactical element!

...and if someone is concerned about "civilians": laying waste to whole city blocks, afghan villages and fields of crop, is not exactly the Geneva convention spirit, either, despite being simulated in DCS.

They are combatants on a warship.

So obviously not what we are talking about when discussing unarmed people on the Afghanistan map.

[shagrat]

Am 17.11.2024 um 23:17 schrieb Gunfreak:

They are combatants on a warship.

So obviously not what we are talking about when discussing unarmed people on the Afghanistan map.

You misunderstood, we can place, for example the unarmed sailor or a flight director, or a white/red/yellow shirt everywhere we like, as "unarmed" persons... or use innocent cows.

And as I said, we can level whole civilian city blocks, if we choose to.

That's why the "supposed" reasoning against "civilians" in a simulation doesn't make a lot of sense.

And if that's the concern, just make them without a death animation, but have the model register hit/dead events so we can simulate the challenges and restrictive nature of typical ROEs in such a theatre.

Currently it's mostly a decision along the line of "if it moves, shoot it!". I would like to make players actually think and consider potential collaterals or bomb impact ranges etc. to make COIN missions much more interesting and challenging.

Edited Tuesday at 12:16 AM by shagrat

[Gunfreak]

8 hours ago, shagrat said:

You misunderstood, we can place, for example the unarmed sailor or a flight director, or a white/red/yellow shirt everywhere we like, as "unarmed" persons... or use innocent cows.

And as I said, we can level whole civilian city blocks, if we choose to.

That's why the "supposed" reasoning against "civilians" in a simulation doesn't make a lot of sense.

And if that's the concern, just make them without a death animation, but have the model register hit/dead events so we can simulate the challenges and restrictive nature of typical ROEs in such a theatre.

Currently it's mostly a decision along the line of "if it moves, shoot it!". I would like to make players actually think and consider potential collaterals or bomb impact ranges etc. to make COIN missions much more interesting and challenging.

Because blowing up random carrier dudest/cows or blowing up some terrain pieces doesn't have the same problematic effect as some dude making a youtube video about blowing up a 1000 unarmed civilians with cluster bombs. Not really sure why you are having problem understanding such a simple concept.

[shagrat]

 

vor 3 Stunden schrieb Gunfreak:

Because blowing up random carrier dudest/cows (...)

"Random carrier dudes"?! Really? ...just, wow!

[Gunfreak]

Just now, shagrat said:

 

"Random carrier dudes"?! Really? ...just, wow!

Yes carrier dudes don't look like civilians now do they? 

[shagrat]

Gerade eben schrieb Gunfreak:

Yes carrier dudes don't look like civilians now do they? 

So if we replace the carrier dudes with the airshow crowd as a stand in for people at an afghan market and drop cluster bombs on those, we are obviously fine, right?!

[MAXsenna]

1 hour ago, Gunfreak said:

Yes carrier dudes don't look like civilians now do they? 

YMMV. There was a camera man shot by an Apache, and they mistook him for a man pad. So there's that. 

And seriously. Making liveries for the "carrier dudes" could make them look like civilians, no? The way videos are made today, fakes will be pretty indistinguishable from real ones in the near future, so it won't matter what ED does. Fakes will be made. 

Hopefully ED will just bite it, and release what we want. Airliners too, they're even more important if you ask me. 

[HC_Official]

+1 defo need more core game assets that are human beings, it would give us a bit more to work with when making missions