released to early access Cold War Germany discussion

[maks]

Dear Ugra,

Hope the Netherlands and Belgium are in? Would love to fly over my home country

brgds from Belgium  maks

[sirrah]

7 hours ago, maks said:

Dear Ugra,

Hope the Netherlands and Belgium are in? Would love to fly over my home country

brgds from Belgium  maks

Having just one Dutch (Volkel) and one Belgium (Kleine Brogel) airbase modeled, would already have me insta buy this map.

Even if the scenery around those bases is just modeled generically and basic.

[Thamiel]

Additionally to the AFBs there were quite a lot of military Cold War installations like "Autobahn-Notlandeplätze" in FRG and GDR. In the southwest there were vast weapon depots in the palatinate forest or even bunkered cruise missile installations in the Bitburg region aiming at the Fulda Gap. Some of them survived the 2000 as derelict lost places.

[Rick Mave]

On 2/2/2025 at 11:26 PM, Thamiel said:

Additionally to the AFBs there were quite a lot of military Cold War installations like "Autobahn-Notlandeplätze" in FRG and GDR. In the southwest there were vast weapon depots in the palatinate forest or even bunkered cruise missile installations in the Bitburg region aiming at the Fulda Gap. Some of them survived the 2000 as derelict lost places.

The Ersatzpisten have to be part of the map imo.

Same with SAM site emplacements and other military facilities particular to the Fulda Gap Region of the 80s imo.

[kl_koral]

Am 1.2.2025 um 22:08 schrieb twistking:

Including all of East Germany is a very reasonable ask and very much needed imho. I would hope that also some parts of Poland and Czechoslovakia would be included.
The question is, if the map will cover Bavaria as well. Having the Alps in DCS would be great. Fantastic for flying... extremely picturesque. I would happily trade the "deep" west to fully include the south.

Alps are very nice but trade in "deep west", like Nato and USAF back bone "Ramstein" and many bases there? Like Bitburg, Spangdahlem? hm...

[Fitzcarraldo]

1 hour ago, kl_koral said:

Alps are very nice but trade in "deep west", like Nato and USAF back bone "Ramstein" and many bases there? Like Bitburg, Spangdahlem? hm...

I think the argument was mostly for cutting the Rhein/Ruhr high population areas, because they would not offer too much compared to their high tax on development time and possibly map performance. I wouldn't call Ramstein nor Spangdahlem the "deep" west (even though they're technically on a similar longitude)...
The map could easily feature Ramstein, Spangdahlem, Bitburg, but omit Rhein/Ruhr...

Edited February 4 by Fitzcarraldo

[twistking]

22 hours ago, kl_koral said:

Alps are very nice but trade in "deep west", like Nato and USAF back bone "Ramstein" and many bases there? Like Bitburg, Spangdahlem? hm...

21 hours ago, Fitzcarraldo said:

I think the argument was mostly for cutting the Rhein/Ruhr high population areas, because they would not offer too much compared to their high tax on development time and possibly map performance. I wouldn't call Ramstein nor Spangdahlem the "deep" west (even though they're technically on a similar longitude)...
The map could easily feature Ramstein, Spangdahlem, Bitburg, but omit Rhein/Ruhr...

Yeah, i'm mostly skeptical of the feasibility and benefits of Rhein/Ruhr area. That's what i meant with "deep" west. It could be easily omitted without necessarily loosing the airbases in the South-West. The main drawbacks i see from omitting Rhein/Ruhr is that this would probably also cut off Benelux. I think it would be a good compromise, if that would allow for the complete North-South coverage...

[Swiso]

About the Rhein/Ruhr area population... Cairo is a big city of 10+ millions people...and the Cairo agglomeration has like 20+ millions people, and yet Cairo is there in the Sinai map.

Of course we are talking about a "desert" map, but the city in itself is quite big...

To the Rhein/Ruhr area...I think it could be done, I don't think we should expect an exact replica of the whole area, or the cities... just an overall "populated area" even if not 100% an exact copy.

A Cold War map , to me, should include all the major airbases that played an important role in that period, both in West as in East Germany. A bonus should be some Netherlands, Belgian and Danish Airbases.

[twistking]

4 minutes ago, Swiso said:

About the Rhein/Ruhr area population... Cairo is a big city of 10+ millions people...and the Cairo agglomeration has like 20+ millions people, and yet Cairo is there in the Sinai map. [...] To the Rhein/Ruhr area...I think it could be done, I don't think we should expect an exact replica of the whole area, or the cities... just an overall "populated area" even if not 100% an exact copy.

A Cold War map , to me, should include all the major airbases that played an important role in that period, both in West as in East Germany. A bonus should be some Netherlands, Belgian and Danish Airbases.

Fair enough. I just hope we'll also get Bavaria and the Alps. It would be the the most ambitious DCS map by far...
I'm from the Rhein/Ruhr area myself and have no special affinity towards Bavaria, but -oh boy- would it be great for flying in DCS... even if strategically a little bit less relevant than other areas...

[rcjonessnp175]

Loved flying a November Tail 172 out of Mainz,  like others have said, have Bavaria  in as well,  Garmish  pardon spelling is gorgeous region

Edited February 6 by rcjonessnp175

[kl_koral]

Regarding the size and complexity of the map it will  come down to a good piece of art to give the people the "feeling" of flying over germany while not modelling everything correctly. From the short clips it looks very promising.
Eastern germany with Berlin is already been shown and Mendig in central-west Germany. I hope it will go further down to get Ramstein into it. Bavria and the alps would be amazing. We'll see. For me this is was the best tease of this year, and I'm very much looking forward to see more.
We've seen bits here and there, but the shots of Berlin and the landscape seems to be very promising.

[Rongor]

Rhein-Ruhr could hardly be left out since at least half of cold war NATO airbases in Germany were west or at least close to it.

People shouldn't only focus on American related Ramstein, Spangdahlem and Bitburg exclusively.

Cold War air bases would rely on Büchel, Nörvenich and NATO at Geilenkirchen as well. Also RAF bases in Germany like Laarbruch, Wildenrath, Brüggen and Gütersloh.

[sirrah]

7 hours ago, Rongor said:

Rhein-Ruhr could hardly be left out since at least half of cold war NATO airbases in Germany were west or at least close to it.

People shouldn't only focus on American related Ramstein, Spangdahlem and Bitburg exclusively.

Cold War air bases would rely on Büchel, Nörvenich and NATO at Geilenkirchen as well. Also RAF bases in Germany like Laarbruch, Wildenrath, Brüggen and Gütersloh.

Completely agree with what you say here.

All these bases (including Bit, Spang and Ramstein) should be included. Anything less would be a slight disappointment imho

Oh and let's add Hopsten to that list while we're at it (German F-4F's)

Edited February 6 by sirrah

[Kirito]

Long story short, we need all of these bases: https://www.mil-airfields.de/deutschland/fliegerhorste-militaerische-flugplaetze.html

(I think this thread is becoming more and more a wish list)

[Fitzcarraldo]

2 minutes ago, Kirito said:

Long story short, we need all of these bases: https://www.mil-airfields.de/deutschland/fliegerhorste-militaerische-flugplaetze.html

(I think this thread is becoming more and more a wish list)

Be reasonable!

[Yannick Pancake]

I personaly would also like to see the north sea coast.

A) for the Navy Guys to have their carriers somewhere and B) up there was/is Germanys main navy homebase (possibly a strategic important target) and also in case of a cold war gone hot situation, the Nato planned on using the harbours at the north sea to reinforce and resupply the Nato troops in Germany. It was also expected, that there would be a part of the fighting in the "Norddeutsche Tiefebene" (North German Plain).

So purely from the cold war perspective I would rather like to see the north sea than the alps, just because it would make more sense to me. This doesn't mean I wouldn't like to see some green, snowy mountains but I think it's less relevant than at least parts of lower saxony and perhaps some of the BeNeLux States.

[Kirito]

vor 3 Minuten schrieb Fitzcarraldo:

Be reasonable!

that was meant to be ironic

[Fitzcarraldo]

2 minutes ago, Kirito said:

that was meant to be ironic

 Oops. My bad.

[sirrah]

11 minutes ago, Fitzcarraldo said:

Be reasonable!

Let's face it, we're all here with hope that Ugra will notice and pick up our own personal wishes

That's what makes these kind of speculation threads so much fun 

[Kirito]

vor 1 Minute schrieb Fitzcarraldo:

 Oops. My bad.

Never mind.

Just think of all the infrastructure and cities. We've seen Berlin and know from Mendig. That's all. Further more is just a wish list

[Yannick Pancake]

5 hours ago, sirrah said:

Let's face it, we're all here with hope that Ugra will notice and pick up our own personal wishes

That's what makes these kind of speculation threads so much fun 

100%

 

I personally would love to see Wittmund AFB in the North, just because I loved watching Phantoms phlying in and out of it until their decompressioning in 2013 wich was pretty much what got me into DCS and aviation in general.

 

Soooo "objectively" this IS the most important airbase on the whole map! 

 

Jokes aside, I think no matter what Ugra does, they will have a good reason for choosing whatever they do, and I will respect that. Nonetheless I would love to see many airbases (+roadbases) scattered around the whole map and not only in some parts of the map.

[MAXsenna]

As for POIs I want Nordschleife so can race a Leopard around in Combined Arms.

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[Fitzcarraldo]

48 minutes ago, MAXsenna said:

As for POIs I want Nordschleife so can race a Leopard around in Combined Arms.

Sent from my SM-A536B using Tapatalk
 

You surely mean Viggen!

[MAXsenna]

You surely mean Viggen!

Yes! In reverse!

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[Volator]

On 2/6/2025 at 9:32 AM, Rongor said:

Rhein-Ruhr could hardly be left out since at least half of cold war NATO airbases in Germany were west or at least close to it.

People shouldn't only focus on American related Ramstein, Spangdahlem and Bitburg exclusively.

Cold War air bases would rely on Büchel, Nörvenich and NATO at Geilenkirchen as well. Also RAF bases in Germany like Laarbruch, Wildenrath, Brüggen and Gütersloh.

Since the Navy dudettes want some water to fly their missions from the boat, we will need the North Sea and the Baltic Sea in the simulated area, so the airbases we really want are: Wittmund, Jever, Oldenburg, Nordholz, Husum, Leck, Schleswig, Eggebek, Kiel, Laage, Ribnitz-Damgarten, Parow, Peenemünde... just to name a few.

... and Ahlhorn (along with the A28 highway strip), Diepholz, Wunstorf, Hopsten... and I forgot the German Army airbases, so Bueckeburg, Itzehoe and Rheine-Bentlage as well of course

 

Edited February 7 by Volator