uncommanded weapon release?

[ruprecht]

I've observed a couple of wierd things that seem to be related to the long-medium-short burst switch on the Weapon Status and Control panel.

 

Firstly re Vikhrs. Often if I select a medium burst for a double-tap, only one missile will come off the rail when I shoot (and yes, I do keep the trigger depressed for a couple of seconds). This is using auto mode with a valid lock and launch authority. This in itself is confusing and inconsistent.

 

Additionally, often when this happens, if I keep the target locked, as soon as the 6-second cooldown comes off, I get an uncommanded launch of 1 or 2 missiles. What the?

 

I have also observed uncommanded firing of cannon, rockets and vikhrs under the following circumstances:

- I have previously fired vikhrs or rockets using a long or medium burst

- I have reset the shkval

- I uncage the shkval

- I select cannon, rockets or vikhrs - whoooooosh uncommanded launch

 

This never occurs with short burst selected.

 

Is this a bug or a feature?

[JG14_Smil]

I've never had this happen and I use the different burst lengths a lot. Perhaps your controller software is at fault?

 

Oh, I do note that firing two vikhrs is hit or miss when using med and long burst.

[Feuerfalke]

Can you post a track, please?

[ruprecht]

Perhaps your controller software is at fault?

 

Quite possibly, and I will check the mappings, but I thought it a good idea to see if anyone else had experienced it. Seems that you have also seen the inconsistencies in vikhr pairs?

 

Can you post a track, please?

I will record one tonight.

[VMFA117_Poko]

You sure you joystick is ok? Did you check in Game Controllers/Joystick Properties/Test if there is no other buttons pressing in coalition? Maybe trigger is flashing...?

Edited September 23, 2009 by Poko24

[ruprecht]

You sure you joystick is ok? Did you check in Game Controllers/Joystick Properties/Test if there is no other buttons pressing in coalition? Maybe trigger is flashing...?

 

Reasonably sure, and I have checked but will recheck. Theoretically though, if the trigger was flashing, I would see this issue regardless of the switch position. If I never touch the burst switch, I never see this issue.

[26-J39]

Maybe you could re-bind your weapons release button on your joystick to something like landing gear for example then see if you can reproduce the problem... If it still happens sounds like a bug, if your landing gear acts funny you can bet its your joystick or drivers.

[Martillo1]

I also have encountered the "just one Vhikr launched problem" when the long-medium-short burst switch is on the "long" or "medium" positions.

 

It is a nuisance when engaging MBTs.

[dburne]

Ditto here - oftentimes the first press and hold will give me one launched, and then the next press and hold will give me two launches. Very sporadic.

I have not however experienced the uncommanded launch though.

[Celo63]

+1

 

I had this just yesterday myself. First launch would give 2 vikhrs, then 1 then 2 then 1.... alternating all the time.

 

A week ago when I used the medium position it worked fine, 2 launched every time.

 

Only thing different yesterday was I went on a long mission alone, so selected unlimited weps and fuel to avoid slogging all the way back to base.

 

BS version 1.0 btw. Just patched to 1.0.1b today and will test again.

[ruprecht]

Posted a track here showing the viks launching singly when long was selected. The launch is at about 24:45, on the Abrams, after I drop the Kiowa.

 

http://imagehost.radsy.com/VAAF/VAAF_Expo_02_Convoy_GoodRun.trk

 

I couldn't reproduce the uncommanded launch issue tonight, as I say it is inconsistent and sporadic. If I encounter it again, I'll save the track.

 

And for some reason when I ran the track, I crash at about 33 min, which is a shame because I didn't in the original mission and went on to do a really nice quickstop :)

[beers]

I was having trouble with vhikr long & meduim double-firing as you describe, and I saw a post here a few weeks ago where someone suggested it has to do with the recoil movement of the airframe which causes the target to momentarially move slighly out of C lock. He suggested being extra careful to center the thing-on-the-thing before launch. I think there's something to his theory, as my double-launch has been more consistent since I have taken more care.

[Pogo]

I haven't really done any testing on this but my observations lead me to believe that with the Viks set to medium, the release pattern that I've noticed is this.

 

Initial commanded release = 2 weapons

2nd commanded release = 1 weapon

3rd commanded release = 2 weapons

4th commanded release = 1 weapon

 

and so on.

 

Again this is just my impression without my paying particularly close attention to the sequence.

 

Cheers,

Pogo

[Cp]

I have noticed this too.

 

It could have something to do with the pipper being forced to the center of the hud no matter how much you turn/bank.

 

I get around it by switching to manual before I fire.

[MTFDarkEagle]

What Pogo is saying could make sense... I however dont know since I only use long or short methods. I will try if I have this too. What I have never come across before is the uncommanded launch.. What I would think is if you macro's your joystick to fire, and also keep the "standard" button included in the game (not sure if I explained correctly), which makes it think it should fire twice?

[26-J39]

I was having trouble with vhikr long & meduim double-firing as you describe, and I saw a post here a few weeks ago where someone suggested it has to do with the recoil movement of the airframe which causes the target to momentarially move slighly out of C lock. He suggested being extra careful to center the thing-on-the-thing before launch. I think there's something to his theory, as my double-launch has been more consistent since I have taken more care.

 

This is true... I always had this problem until taking more care to line up the target. When firing a single vikhr, the target is lined up with the vikhr (to the best of the WCS computers etc..if u know what i mean)... You will see when u switch salvo to med or long the targeting circle on the HUD moves to centre... so this means both vikhrs on a salvo shot are actually been fired slightly out of recommended launch parameters, hence the reason the second vikhr wont launch. The airframe recoil is definately a factor here, also excessive side slip will cauz 2nd vik not to fire.

[Feuerfalke]

Very interesting. I got to say that I mostly use single releases, even if fighting the M1. That way I don't lose 2 VIKHRs when I have to break the lock.

 

However, when testing this, I found the same phenomenon.

 

 

 

Good find!

[JG14_Smil]

this has nothing to do with technique or targeting. I thought it might have had to do with even/odd weapon numbering, but that theory did not hold water for long. I finally just decided to live with it and leave the switch on med while trying to fire one missile as the problem has been in BS since day one.

[viper169th]

Hi Ruprecht,

I've only had a problem with this when i didn't let the counter on the left bottom side of the HUD count down to 0 I haven't seen the track but I'm guessing this is what is happening to you. I use short and med burst all the time if you launch prior to it hitting 0 and clearing you will get only a single vik release both missiles should come off the rails within 1.5 seconds roughly. I hope this helps

 

Sincerely,

Viper169th

[MTFDarkEagle]

Is it resolved yet?

[deltatango]

 

Additionally, often when this happens, if I keep the target locked, as soon as the 6-second cooldown comes off, I get an uncommanded launch of 1 or 2 missiles. What the?

 

Are you using the Saitek X52 with an SST profile for DCS?

 

If so, what type of key stroke have you set for weapons release? simple, advanced or macro command?

[ruprecht]

The airframe recoil is definately a factor here, also excessive side slip will cauz 2nd vik not to fire.

 

Paying careful attention to this, I did notice that when I was careful to keep the Shkval circle inside the Vikhr reticle for both shots, they came off in pairs; and when I allowed the recoil from the first shot to take the second out of parameters, the second shot failed.

 

In the second case, I definitely get uncommanded launch when the cooldown comes off if a target is still locked. It's like the fire control system "queues" a release, which is blocked while the first missile is inflight, but unblocked when that cooldown comes off.

 

Hi Ruprecht,

I've only had a problem with this when i didn't let the counter on the left bottom side of the HUD count down to 0

 

This doesn't seem to be the issue I get, but thanks

 

Are you using the Saitek X52 with an SST profile for DCS? If so, what type of key stroke have you set for weapons release? simple, advanced or macro command?

 

Yes, it is set to the default simple keystroke for weapons release. That said, I have noticed a slight difference between keystrokes issued via 3rd-party software and direct keyboard keystrokes. For example, if you assign targeting mode reset (Backspace) to a switch in the betainnovations keymapping software, it works but the switch in the sim "locks down". Pressing Backspace directly doesn't give this issue. However, testing in Notepad etc reveals only a single Backspace, so I'm not sure exactly what's going on, and I say again that I never get uncommanded release if I don't touch the salvo switch.

 

Still trying to get to the bottom of it.

[goldfinger35]

I get this too.

i am using x-52 pro without saitek software.