Issue with F-15 radar or feature?

[Pilotasso]

Just noticed the F-15 radar started to give hard lock warning when in HOJ mode.

 

Is this on purpose or we got another broken thing after fixing other bugs?

[VTJS17_Fire]

Just noticed the F-15 radar started to give hard lock warning when in HOJ mode.

 

This is actuall since FC 2.0.

 

 

It also goes into STT sometimes when you have TWS selected and you lock a target up under 20 miles. I have had this happen a few times.

 

This happens, if the target has ECM on but you are in/ under burn-through range. I think, TWS has not enough power for the burn through lock, so the radar swichtes in STT. New since FC 2.0, too.

 

 

kind regards,

fire

[VTJS17_Fire]

didn't they move burn-through range back? In 1.12 it use to be 12nm now I don't know what it is.

 

They move the range out. About 12nm in FC 1.12, now about 25nm for smaller fighter-ECMs and i think, 12nm for powerfull ECM by bombers.

 

But the TWS-mode don't have the power like the RWS/STT mode. That's why you lost a lock on a target, which maneuver hard, with TWS earlier as with STT. Same for burn-through power (lock) ... i think.

 

 

kind regards,

fire

[kingneptune117]

what is hard lock?

[Breakshot]

Just noticed the F-15 radar started to give hard lock warning when in HOJ mode.

 

Is this on purpose or we got another broken thing after fixing other bugs?

 

Im assuming the lock warning also happens in TWS?

 

Sounds like a good feature to me, if true... :P

 

Will do some testing on this later...

[71st_Mastiff]

No thats always been there you just havent got'en close enough for it to kick in..:joystick:

 

Just noticed the F-15 radar started to give hard lock warning when in HOJ mode.

 

Is this on purpose or we got another broken thing after fixing other bugs?

[The Beast]

Im assuming the lock warning also happens in TWS?

 

Sounds like a good feature to me, if true... :P

 

Will do some testing on this later...

 

 

Nope thats the beauty of TEWS no warning for the enemy till the 120 goes active!

[SFJackBauer]

Nope thats the beauty of TEWS no warning for the enemy till the 120 goes active!

 

Just a small correction - the beauty of TWS. TEWS is the radar warning receiver for the F-15.

[The Beast]

ha sorry i knew that!!

[Pilotasso]

This is actuall since FC 2.0.

 

This happens, if the target has ECM on but you are in/ under burn-through range. I think, TWS has not enough power for the burn through lock, so the radar swichtes in STT. New since FC 2.0, too.

 

 

kind regards,

fire

 

you didnt get it, Im not talking about STT lock after burn through. Im talking about full lock warning when designating a strobe, no matter the range the target is, 25 or 160 miles away. And was subject for patche fixes in previous versions of lockon. Vanilla FC2.0 included.

 

 

Im assuming the lock warning also happens in TWS?

 

Sounds like a good feature to me, if true... :P

 

Will do some testing on this later...

 

No you missunderstood, I put emphasis again, lock warning when in HOJ mode, regardless what mode you previouly had, TWS or RWS.

 

Its making MP an ECM jungle. People are making ECM part of the start up procedure, not to mention more friendly kills.

 

I'm just wondering if this was made a feature and why (because some ED staff mentioned on previous patches F-15 should give no lock warning in this mode and made this part of bugs to be corrected), or if it got broken again while clearing other bugs.

Edited May 10, 2010 by Pilotasso

[RvEYoda]

I'm just wondering if this was made a feature and why (because some ED staff mentioned on previous patches F-15 should give no lock warning in this mode and made this part of bugs to be corrected), or if it got broken again while clearing other bugs.

 

My guess is that it is a sideffect of some other fix. Not entirely sure.

Btw with the Fc2 patch installed it IS possible to bug a target tws even though he has

ECM on as long as you have burnthough, unlike both std 2.0 and 1.12 :)

[Pilotasso]

I noticed that, but we are talking about 2 different things here.

[59th_Buncsi]

Maybe i experienced, if you didnt wrote about this, then sorry :)

If a target isnt heading on you, only around, or beam, or heading home, but use ECM, you will get a stable target in the ECM, if he is in the burn out range, but if you lock him, that is like you lock an ECM. The only advantage is if you broke lock, you know the range, and if the target is already should be in engage, you can shoot your AMRAAMS. I never fly in F-15, but i think its true for all aircrafts :)

[Pilotasso]

Hard to decrypt your post here, but if I understand correctly having a stable lock on a retreating target just because hes also jamming means hes above 25 miles and it cant be reachable anyway, (infact you know nothing about what your locked on) which is useless. This is hardly an excuse for "I give, I take away" compromise philosofy you seem to be hinting at when fixing bugs, or else we are forever stuck with arcade features.

Edited May 10, 2010 by Pilotasso

[Nate--IRL--]

Just curious but why wouldn't this apply to the Russian A/C too? Shouldn't they also be able to Silently Lock a jamming target?

 

Nate

[Pilotasso]

Russian radars AFAIK as stated by ED staff referring to manuals employ a different method for ECCM than eagles. F-15's do ECCM by software as much as frequency hoping (not modeled) to bypass the frequency of the jammer and/or estimate target position based on ELINT (based on jammer signal strength, method of jamming etc), russian radars with a weaker signal processor do it via frequency swiching to guidance mode, thus giving lock warning...aarhgh :S sounds bad, maybe someone else can explain better.

Edited May 10, 2010 by Pilotasso

[GGTharos]

No, they shouldn't. Believe it or not, the F-15 has a lot more passive sensing/engagement capability than the Russian birds ever did when it comes to the radar and TEWS.

When it comes to ECCM and jamming though, nothing really works as (some of us assume) it ought. You should pretty much never see a strobe from a fighter until you try to lock it, which would give you the warning, and then the jammer would fire up to break the lock. This also means TWS would not trigger your jammer.

 

Just curious but why wouldn't this apply to the Russian A/C too? Shouldn't they also be able to Silently Lock a jamming target?

 

Nate

[Breakshot]

If it is indeed a bug and not an implementation... then there is a possibility it could be related to EOS giving a lock warning bug, in rear aspect beyond 25km it sometimes gives a constant lock, even though u are clearly picking up an IR contact, and having an IR missile selected... although it seems to only happen the 'first' time you do it after loading into a fresh mission... although i do remember similar things happening even back in 1.12, so it could just be net related...

 

So the key question here is, does this F15 HOJ lock thing happen 100% of the time?

[Pilotasso]

It seems a constant thing as soon as ECM is emmiting. They are either F-15's or realy fast SA-15 batteries :D

[RvEYoda]

If it is indeed a bug and not an implementation... then there is a possibility it could be related to EOS giving a lock warning bug, in rear aspect beyond 25km it sometimes gives a constant lock, even though u are clearly picking up an IR contact, and having an IR missile selected... although it seems to only happen the 'first' time you do it after loading into a fresh mission... although i do remember similar things happening even back in 1.12, so it could just be net related...

 

So the key question here is, does this F15 HOJ lock thing happen 100% of the time?

 

When EOS exceeds a certain range it uses radar for rangefinding, instead of a laser.

This is how the real system operates. Whether this ingame result was the intention of

the developers or a sideffect of something else I do not know.

 

Normally lasers cannot do much more than 10 km under normal conditions.

[Sov13t]

I believe when EOS is the selected primary channel, radar can still be secondary channel and as such provide any information EOS does not have. Now, it doesn't have to lock to provide range finding it can be in scan mode...

[104th_Crunch]

It seems a constant thing as soon as ECM is emmiting. They are either F-15's or realy fast SA-15 batteries :D

 

I know you are joking, but many people miss this. Air contacts have a chevron (upside down V) over air contacts in the TEWS. That is how you tell if it is a F-15 or SA-15.