ANSWER FROM TM REGARDING WT THROTTLE PROBLEM

[Funkyjazz]

Hi,

 

Last week i have sent two questions to TM. 1 Regarding the back light of the throttle unit and second the throttle failures.

 

This is the original message from me to TM:

 

Im on the verge on buying the WT. Before i make my move i have some questions:

1) is there a knob on the throttle panel were i can switch the back lighting on and off?

2)On a forum i have red some throttle related problems. After shutting down the PC and then restarting the PC, the PC wont recognize the throttle anymore. As far as i read, TM advises a RMA were the throttle unit is repaired. Does this problem only relate to a batch of is it add random?

 

Answer from TM:

 

Dear Mr. Boby Kim,

Thank you for your request. In order to resolve the issue you have encountered with your HOTAS Warthog, please refer to our response herewith:

Thank you for contacting us regarding your inquiries.

The backlighting on the throttle will be adjustable with our next release of the TARGET software. It is not available in the current RC3 version.

The problem with the throttle you have read is related to the firmware inside the throttle. This happens randomly and we are working to get these cases isolated. With the new drivers we have releases not long ago we have included a protection of the flash through HID to avoid potential flash corruption. This will avoid the firmware corruption in the future.

We rest at your disposal for any further questions.

[Succellus]

The second part is a lie or a half true. The problem ain t solved.

This may have as i stated solved a problem, but not the bricking. There are people that have reported bricking AFTER the firmware update.

But if i where you i would buy it anyway, i know i did buy one, well, maybe i wasn t smart to do so and should have waited, but WTH, no risk no gain.

 

Do not rely on first degree atendent answer, they are not always informed by mistake or on purpose.

Customers forums are usually more reliable.

Edited January 14, 2011 by Succellus

[sofie_59]

Or just wait some time and buy it later when TM have solved the problem. And the price has got down a bit

[Funkyjazz]

I have been following all the "dead throttle" posts. I think that the answer of TM is half of the truth. My opinion about this whole "dead throttle" topic is that somehow they used different "bios" chips for different batches.

I worked at a lot of manufactory compagnies and they all had 1 thing in common: As soon as company X had a delay with the original part X, they went to company Y for a similar part Y, which should do the same trick as the original part X. Everytime this led to troubles. I have the same feeling with the WT.

 

I am going to be patient.

[jerda]

That is probably what they told the customer service reps to say. 'Its an umm err umm oh, a 'firmware problem', yeah thats it.

 

whats worse, to be lied to or to be ignored? Week 3 has begun, waiting for my rma throttle to return. TM canada has been sitting on my old unit for a full week now. No emails, No shipping info,Not anything. They wont even return my email. They previously said they'd ship "as soon as the throttle is received", I'm getting a bad feeling.

 

You have 3 choices, find another hotas, wait for a real fix, or take a chance of major frustration.

 

Customers forums are usually more reliable.

 

Is that why TM doesn't have a forum?

[Wolf Rider]

I think they're finding the problem is firmware related (as I wrote on another thread) the buttons/ switches on the throttle have an "on" condition and that may account for a path being opened up to and inside the chip/s that corrupts/ fries/ erases the firmware itself, when the PC is powered up and doing its device detect thing. It may be a certain combination of switches being on which is the badboy here.

 

(I work in entertainment as a lighting engineer and had similar happen with a dimmer rack unit. The unit had 9 switches on the front and pressing a combination of three buttons then powering off and powering on whilst the buttons were pressed, would reset the bios to factory default. This is known as a "deep clear". Inadvertantly and being rushed, I pressed three wrong buttons whilst going through the deep clear routine and the rack developed a mind of its own and very embarrassing at the time it was, to say the least. Manufacturer took a month looking at it and found a button press combination opened what they could a "trapdoor"... being a new design, it was a pathway they weren't aware of. A week later, they had the fix and couple of continents full of these racks to re-flash) [/rant]

[Succellus]

Is that why TM doesn't have a forum?

 

I always wondered why TM doesn t support its own forum. And i think, maybe overdoing here, that yes thats why they don thave a forum.

 

TM having a forum would concentrate all the complains and potencially could hush potential customers away.

While we are on non TM dedicated forums we are separated, its harder to make a big picture over a whole problem, etc.

 

So yes TM do not have a forum for MKT reasons.

[Cali]

I always wondered why TM doesn t support its own forum. And i think, maybe overdoing here, that yes thats why they don thave a forum.

 

TM having a forum would concentrate all the complains and potencially could hush potential customers away.

While we are on non TM dedicated forums we are separated, its harder to make a big picture over a whole problem, etc.

 

So yes TM do not have a forum for MKT reasons.

 

That's pretty sad.......not wanting to help your customers or providing answers for them. That is another reason why it's hard to change from CH, their customer service and forum support is the best I have ever seen. You get answers from the people that made the software and the product within a very short time. I don't think I have seen someone wait more then 1-2 days for a response, 2 days is pushing it.

[Succellus]

That's pretty sad.......not wanting to help your customers or providing answers for them. That is another reason why it's hard to change from CH, their customer service and forum support is the best I have ever seen. You get answers from the people that made the software and the product within a very short time. I don't think I have seen someone wait more then 1-2 days for a response, 2 days is pushing it.

 

 

I agree CH support was very good wheni had theyr products.

[Funkyjazz]

Well, the forum will be my next question to TM. As soon as i receive an answer i will post it.

 

Sent message:

 

Hello,

 

Thanks for the answer on my last questions and im sorry to have another one. Im am registered at the forum oF the Eagle Dynamics site (http://forums.eagle.ru/index.php) which develops military flightsims. A lot of people already bought the WT. A lot have problem with their dead throttle units. Some of them are waiting 3 weeks without a answer from TM. So, i am still on the verge of buying a WT device but why do you not maintain a support forum? And how come people have to wait 3 weeks for an answer? Please visit the "input / output" thread on the ED forum and read for yourself. Why should i buy the TM without decent support? And please, dont get me wrong. I really want to buy it but for 350 euro's i want decent good forum support.

Edited January 14, 2011 by Funkyjazz

[sofie_59]

:thumbup:

[Thorvald]

We rest at your disposal for any further questions.

 

Wow was that translated using Google Bablefish??? lol.

[power5]

Wait a minute. So the Warthog is not perfect as many would have had us believe at release? My "inferior" g940 has never bricked, and works as it should. Am I missing something that makes the WH worth double the money?

[kaiserb_uk]

My "inferior" g940 has never bricked, and works as it should. Am I missing something that makes the WH worth double the money?

 

Yes. The Warthog is 'programmable' - that is it can do whatever you want it to do, within reason.

[Slammin]

The Warthog is not programmable. It is TARGET that takes DX output from the WH and translates that output to keystrokes. You might be thinking of the Cougar. The Cougar is programmable. It actually stores your profile within the stick itself. There is no profile storing with the WH. TARGET stores your profile in a script file on your PC with the WH.

[Wolf Rider]

 

My "inferior" g940 has never bricked, and works as it should.

 

 

could you let us in on the secret there?, as I know of quite a few users who would love to know how this is achieved.

 

:joystick:

[WynnTTr]

Wait a minute. So the Warthog is not perfect as many would have had us believe at release? My "inferior" g940 has never bricked, and works as it should. Am I missing something that makes the WH worth double the money?

Yeah cos your g940 is representative of all g940's ever produced since its release.

 

Back on track though - some form of communication is better than none. Their communication still sucks but better than being ignored.

 

As to whether they're lying or not, no matter the answer some people will always assume that it's a lie despite them being in a more qualified position to know than anyone else here or in any forum.

The question then becomes one of an individual one - what answer will satisfy YOU.

[brewber19]

It doesnt matter if the Wh stick bricks itself, its still the best tool for the job re: DCS A10...so if mine bricked itself, I'd immediately go and get another.

 

Is it perfect? No. There is "sticktion" on the joystick so really super smooth stick inputs aren't ideal (my CH Fighterstick was better). The throttle can brick itself at power-on.

 

Is any stick perfect? Nope, and I've tried HOTASs of Saiteks X-45, X-52, X-52 pro, stock TM Cougar (awful), CH Fighterstick & throttle (the best so far for precision and feel, for me) and now the TM Warthog.

 

Honestly? For fast jets the WH will be fine. For BoB:SoW, I wish I still had my Microsoft Sidewinder FFB2!!!!

 

Other than that? Fricking fantastic for the sim. Just the fact that TMS/DMS/Coolie/China Hat/Boat switch etc etc are where they should be, really makes using the sim soooooo much easier.

[hassata]

Look as much as we are fans of the WH (and I say this as a TM owner since their very first products all the way up to the WH), there is a problem. There was a failure issue with the MFDs as well. And I bet it all elates to sourcing cheap building blocks. This reminds me of Mercedes in the early 2000'2. They recruited a CEO who attacked the dire situation by choosing cheaper components such as fake leather dash etc. He saved billions and turned the company around, but ended up hurting reputation and sales in the long run. It was a benz on the outside, but inside, some of the finishing looked more like a Camry. It took them till 2006 to climb back up the JD rankings.

[brewber19]

Hi Hassata,

 

My post wasn't in response to whether there is an issue or not, as clearly there is. I bet the only reason mine hasn't bricked itself (yet) is because its "always powered on" due to the USB port its plugged in to. I haven't attempted to upgrade the FW yet either.

 

My post was more in response to Power5s post, which I should have made clear at the start of my post. Almost all HOTAS's have issues, the only exception for me in my experience so far is my CH gear. If they made a WH hotas I would buy it in a heartbeat and have 100% confidence.

 

I do have huge sympathy for those with bricked throttles, and if it were me I would be super pissed as well.

 

You're right about Mercedes as well, still wouldn't buy one - like Audis, all plastic show and no go. Its all twin exhausts, chrome everywhere etc etc. I'm also too young for a Merc yet (I'm only 36....need another 15 years before I've given up on life enough to drive a "boat" like a Merc). I'm sure you can guess what Euro-Brand I drive?!!!

[EagleEye]

It may be a certain combination of switches being on which is the badboy here.

Thats not the case on mine. I don`t touched the Throttle for weeks, because I played some other games with mouse only. Suddenly last Thursday the "device unknown" problem appears after booting my PC...

I have bad feelings when I read that some people allready wait some weeks for a replacement.:cry: No answer from TM support jet for me.

Edited January 15, 2011 by EagleEye

[hassata]

My post was just a general observation.

 

I'm sure you can guess what Euro-Brand I drive?!!!

 

VW, like me lol?

[Succellus]

The Warthog is not programmable. It is TARGET that takes DX output from the WH and translates that output to keystrokes. You might be thinking of the Cougar. The Cougar is programmable. It actually stores your profile within the stick itself. There is no profile storing with the WH. TARGET stores your profile in a script file on your PC with the WH.

(directed at above and the 940 troll)

Well technically true but in the end the result is thesame theWT is programable, and in more ways the 940 dev team could dream.

Also it sports many more buttons and features the 940 doesn t have.

Ok it doesnt have rudders coming in.

 

But i would take the risk of bricking warthog anyday over the limited-for-ever the 940 is.

Edited January 15, 2011 by Succellus

[brewber19]

BMW ;)

 

330d saloon. understated (no chrome) and nice & quick.

 

My post was just a general observation.

 

 

 

VW, like me lol?

[Wolf Rider]

 

Thats not the case on mine. I don`t touched the Throttle for weeks, because I played some other games with mouse only. Suddenly last Thursday the "device unknown" problem appears after booting my PC...

I have bad feelings when I read that some people allready wait some weeks for a replacement.:cry: No answer from TM support jet for me.

 

 

 

not doubting what you're saying, but is it possible some switch/es may have been knocked that you weren't aware off?

 

 

this apparently is a checklist to set the switches into an inactive state;

 

Throttles (Left and Right): Out of Detent

Flap Switch: Center (MNV)

Master Light Switch: Center

EAC: Down (OFF)

RDR ALT: Down (OFF)

Autopilot select switch: Center (ALT/HDG)

APU: Down (OFF)

ENG OPER (Left and Right): Center (NORM)

FUEL Switches (Left and Right): Down (OVERRIDE)

Speedbrake switch: Center

Boat Switch: Center

 

 

but double check with DIView or maybe Windows controller thingy