Solty

Can someone check if 109 and 190 are also affected?

And I was wondering why do I only hit well with first half of my ammo. I though my aim is getting worse with flight time xD It also seems that only .50cal is experiencing the problem, even though it is not set in a small space over a hot engine... I have certainly not seen it on my jet modules.

Hotshots know that their plane allows them to be even better and some watch their stats really close. And you won't be able to have stats like 100k/12d flying the slower and less maneuverable plane. Spit will bring some power, but that's only in turn fighting. Germans will still be way faster so I wouldn't count on it to be a complex game changer. But at least it will bring some new flavour and red team will have to adjust their tactics. Actually... That might be a nice game changer.

Red is German.

I don't think you should judge us like that Sith. If I wanted to just "win" I would just fly 109K4 like everyone else did and win. Don't you think? The reason why I fly P-51 is that it is my favourite plane of all time, and I know its history and its capabilities. If I was just an average man wanting a superior plane, I would probably ask for P-51H. 72'hg most certainly won't be a silver bullet. But it will give the P-51D a fighting chance. And that is all is needed. A chance to utilise it's speed. It is an aircraft defined by it's speed. Since the very begining the plane was very fast even with lower power settings and Allison engine. First P-51 in UK's arsenal was using an Alison engine with lower power than Spitfire MkV. And the Mustang MK1 while beeing heavier and bigger and having a weaker engine, was still faster than the Spitfire MkV. Who love's a P-51 knows that it's main thing is speed. Even in versions that were not focused around range. The P-51D is not a good dogfighter, but it is constantly pushed to dogfight other more nimble oponents. I am not going to pretend that it will magically outturn, outaccelerate and outrun the 109K4 when it will get 72'hg. But it will be just that a bit faster, which will give you a fighting chance.

And you are missing the point. All I want to say is that higher 72'hg rating would bring both balance and historical accuracy to the engagement. They are tied together.

The balance is there as long as one of the oponents has an advantage in one of the crucial fields. P-51D vs Fw190D is a perfect example of such balanced fighting. With those two planes fighting each other you can never be sure which will emerge victorious. They both have very similar performace, but very different flight characteristics. That creates for an interesting fight. P-51D 67'hg vs Bf109K4 is not a balnced fight, because the K4 has two of the most important factors during a dogfight in which it is superior. Speed and turn time. P-51D with 72'hg is going to be more balanced because the P-51D will become faster just a bit and that will make the fight more of a battle of wits and capablity to use your plane to maximum. The K4 will still accelerate better, climb better, turn better and have better low speed control. Just the P-51D will now be able to extend and run. And that is also representative of what IRL both those plane's were about. Different tactics and knowledge of the enemy plane. Balance creates longevity for the title. Nobody wants to get his butt kicked all the time. And an average DCS P-51D player now is loosing. It is not about me, because I can handle myself, and yes I loose to many very good K4 players, but I hate to go into a server which has 11 people online and see that only 2 of those people are P-51D, most of the enemy team consists of K4's. And that can be quickly fixed with 72'hg rating. Why 72' or 75' and not 81? That is because 81' was only used by the british and I don't like to have an unhistorical advantage. Remember that those power settings are all historical, just one of them is not used by the USAAF. It is both balanced and historical.

That is not true. Have you never heard about the concept of "assymetrical balance"? It is when you pick units that are different, and yet create a situation where one plane can be used to utilise one tactic and other can use another to defeat each other. For example. If we take F6F3 vs A6M5 we get one plane that is a very good low speed turner and has amazing handling at low speed, and another plane that is faster with a bit better high speed characterstics. Yes the faster plane has the advantage to stay fast, but if he will stay fast, he will have nearly no ability to engage the slow flying zero. So he has to commit a bit to shoot it down and pull deflection, but if he overcommits, he will engage the turning fight, the Zero will win. If he is conservative the F6F will win or the fight will end with both of them bugging out. The fight is inherently balanced because there are two extremes that utilise their completely unbalanced capabilities to the fullest. EDIT: That is why Fw190D9 vs P-51D is balanced. Because the Dora is faster and has better roll rate at low speed. But P-51D is a better turner at lower speeds and has better roll rate at high speed. They both have advantages to use against each other, that are not inherently much better than the enemy.

The 72'hg will. At least it will make P-51D a little bit faster and that will make the fight against the 109 winnable in 1v1 situation. Because of the possiblity to extend or even run away in cerain circumstances. While the Fw190D9 vs P-51D balance will remain the same. I think that actually D9 vs P-51 is pretty good matchup, even with the current lacking in speed P-51. But I think that this matchup would become more interesting with addition of the new power setting. The Fw190 will still be faster, but tactics will play more of a role, because it won't be able to disengage at will, but still will have advantages. Me262 can be balanced out by the mission makers. It will also not be such an amazing plane for the altitude we mostly fight at. I think that overall the game is not really very unbalanced... but the K4 vs P-51 certainly is problematic, and the sooner ED would create the new power setting, the better for all.

You have aswered your own question:smilewink:. "If you want to duel it, the K4 will win". That makes for an more players that choose K4 on servers which ends in imbalance and additionally it creates a group of "better pilots" that think their capability to beat the P-51D is only connected to their "skill", which leads to some people beeing abusive on the server to others. Another problem it poses is that the "underdog" side requires very presistant players, which leads to very small playerbase on the Allied side. Another thing is that if you want to battle a clearly superior airplane you need teamwork and that is unachievable on open servers. Ther are a lot of potential problems and there are countless discussions on every gaming forum about balance issues. The main problem with this is that it kills the longevity of a title, due to rising frustration of the playerbase.:book:

Why everyone wants high res maps? Just make them WT level with colors and lighting doing most of the scenery.

It is just a difference between rare and nearly non-existant. Tiger I was a rare sight on the battlefield, but that doesn't mean it was nearly non-existant like the Sturmtiger. 43 Ta152 were made overall (not counting pre-production stuff and prototypes). That is nearly non-existant, especially in 1944. 533 is rare for K4, when most planes in LW are G14, G6 and Fw190A8 and F8 which can be counted in thousands. And not only that, you also have to remember that all of those planes could not be operational at the same time.

P-51D had 1720HP with 67'hg and if you push it to the British 25lbs standard or 81'hg for the Mustang IV you will get something near 2000HP Well, I imagine that not many people have 8 hours of spare time to fly a P-51D in a simulation. Also, that will result in venous thrombosis.

@Kurfurst and @rel4y The P-51D Mustang is not only a fuel truck. A very good site about P-51's history http://www.mustangsmustangs.com/p-51/production By twisting facts and saying "it is not rare" when you can clearly see it is rare you do nothing good to the community. I took that data from German wiki, namely the table "Produktion der Bf 109 bis zum 30. November 1944". P-51D blocks didn't change their engines! That is not the same. It is the same plane just little improvments or changes like stabilizing fin, wing racks etc. The difference between K4 and G14 is like between P-51D and P-51H. A new engine model and many other changes. Anyway, the 72'hg or 75'hg will not make P-51D clearly superior. Because that is not the point. But it will level the playing ground for 1v1 action. @MAD-MM I do not understand how someone cannot see that every little piece of a puzzle is important. War is not just plane A vs plane B. It is strategy, logistics, tactics, aircraft and their weapon systems, then losses and victories, initiative, fighting capablity, production rate etc. Types of fuel and engine ratings are just as important as any other aspect. @Sith I agree with you on that. The airplane is surely out of it's comfort zone. But it will never be in it. My long experience with aircraft sims shows that most servers and players create/like missions that are quick and short. I myself do not like to fly too much without action. And even if that was the case, and missions were long and altitudes high and we had bombers to escort, we would still be far away from what makes a mission. That is leadership, cooperation and discipline. Which you will never find in an average multiplayer match. And I think that you will agree that a match in which you fly 3h to the target and stay there for 30min to go home (if one survives) for another 3h is not going to be interesting.

Indeed and IMHO that project should have taken into account what version of P-51D we have and thefore build a plane set around the two known planes. Because D9 was also a ED's plane right? Anyway, you said yourself that ED has something planed for P-51D. One can dream right?:pilotfly: Because currently it is sad to see when you join a server and there are 4x P-51 vs 3xFw190D9 and 5x109K4. The truth of every multiplayer game is, that people want to be the best, and they take the best tools to achieve their goal.

Awesome vid. Thx for sharing.

We have discussed it very much already, and by 1944 standards the K4 which was a quite rare sight indeed, especially with G14 beeing the most produced variant for that stage of the war together with other modified G's like G6, G8 and G10. Especially like you said against those most common allied planes. A bit more detail: K4 was just another type in many many types that served in the LW. And it was not even close to beeing produced in numbers like the late war G variants. Not in 1944! In 1945, yes many more were produced and focus switched to those K4 and D9 variants. What I hope is that the relative performance of the P-51D will get improved, as talisman said, the new 44-1 and 72'hg or 75'hg power setting would make things equal. You see the idea is that you take two planes that have distinct strenghts. That way plane's feel unique. With K4 against current 67'hg P-51D, the 51 pilot has to be way better to win or have a numerical advantage or the K4 driver has to make a very grave mistake. Either way currently the K4 has nearly every advantage the fighter plane needs to be successful.

That is because most Bf109's were not K4's and most Fw190's were not D9's, but G6 and G14 and Fw190A8 which would be way slower both, than the P-51D, even at the deck and the difference would be astonishing at altitude of 7000m. And most certainly you can outturn the D9, just you have to burn your energy to do so. The Fw190D9 can pull a lead on you at high speed, so beware of that.

And yet you have claimed I was trolling. Anyway... I am hope YoYo will soon tell us how it will look like in DCS.

And you are not listening. 595 is not 610.

Yes. Trolling. Lol. What you want is censorship. I just think that hummingbird wants 610kph but is not going to get it because I don't see how aerodynamic improvements from K4 could lead to such increase. But thats just me.

YoYo stated as such. To me it would be OK since there are two other test that claim 380kph at SL and that seems similar. There are many tests with many numbers but none has shown 610kph at SL and that is where I get suspicious.

He just said that there is a corrected version because it was 568kph instead of 575kph. At least I took it as such. Not change into 610kph. Maybe I am just reading it wrong. But all YoYo said was basically that the old model was indeed slower but not that much as Humming now claims.

Just show me where YoYo says he will model it to fly 610kph.

]http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=2613565&postcount=18 "The charts you are praying at ARE NOT FROM REAL TESTS. These are simplified engineering estimations based on idealised power curves, efficiency, etc... "