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DeadMeat

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Everything posted by DeadMeat

  1. Sorry, I don't have the rights to make my CMS hat commercially available. I can only provide a link to a viewer of the model here if you want to recreate it. My design fits the #4-40 threaded post version of the OTTO T5. It sits a bit high though but it works. Same goes for the adapter to fit the T5 into the Warthog grip - I can only share a viewer link.
  2. Per NATOPS section 2.10.1.1 there's a down lock but no up lock
  3. Mini trims for the inboard throttle - I used a T4-TCG3312 (tactile version) for MIC switch and T4-CG1112 ("silent" version) for the SOI switch on my Warthog throttle upgrade... Both are in stock on mouser right now. I think the "OTTO version" of the real Mason MIC switch would be a full size T4 (same size as the trim switch on the stick grip), but the T4-T works great.
  4. The rod does go through the spring. Here's a quick video I just shot that may help you. Don't forget the c-clip. Now where did I put mine
  5. Right, the spring is a real pain. It takes some practice but you close up the grip and basically you gotta seat the spring first in the slot and then try to push the lever back on. You have to catch and compress the spring with the lever as you push it in.. Keep at it and you'll get it
  6. Did you connect ground as well? If that's not it, try with different pins or a different switch. Sounds like either a short in the switch you modified or a problem with the UNO
  7. Here's expensive example of a switch that is 4 position, 90 degree index and has continuous rotation. You could also go for a cheaper one, open 'er up and cut out the mechanical stop yourself to make it freely rotate. FWIW I think I read somewhere that the real switch is 8 position, even if only 4 of them are connected. Can't find the reference though.
  8. yea it’s been suggested a few times but I haven’t seen anyone actually do it. Should be fairly easy The Otto T4 trim switch will not fit in the middle position but the stock trim might - but as I recall the diameter of the trim and sensor switch bodies are different so you’ll need to break out the ol’ dremel and hot glue
  9. Sounds like you're in a good position to make whatever you decide work The TK switch may be an option! The price close to the T5, but from what I can tell it is a "tactile" version meaning it is more "clicky" than what I used (think sensor control switch on the Hornet grip) so that should be even nicer. Size wise the body looks to be a bit smaller than the T5 in both depth and diameter? The stock CMS switch is the same size as the MIC switch on the Warthog throttle. It has a loose fit on the stick grip diameter wise but tabs and hot glue holds it in place. Here are some approximate dimensions for CMS and TMS/DMS switches: Two things concern me about the TK switch, the MOLEX connector interface will be tricky to work with (unless you have the right connector handy of course) and the button style itself. You may be able to pop the hat off and replace it with your own design or attach the TM hat if you can get it off the TM switch. I was able to pop off the hat on a T4 so it may be possible on the TK as well.
  10. Regarding wiring, I have updated my original post with a table showing how to match original TMS wires to the terminals on the OTTO switch if you want 1 to 1 wiring. It is pretty simple, on the OTTO switch the terminal opposite the direction you're switching connects to the common "C" terminal. On the TM switch it is the terminal in the same side you're switching. On the picture below, you would connect terminal 3 to C if you press the OTTO right (seen from top of the switch) /away from the camera. If you press the TM switch to the left you connect yellow (common) to black wire. You can ignore this and connect the cables as you'd like and just remap inside DCS. Only thing is the common/ground wire (yellow thrustmaster cable) has to go to the common "C" OTTO terminal otherwise the switch will behave strangely.
  11. I can't speak to the quality of other manufacturers' grips (which I think is out of scope for this thread anyways) but if you want a A10/F16 style grip you're probably stuck with TM for now. A replacement TM F16 "viper" grip (identical to the TM warthog grip) is around USD 200 which is maybe more reasonable than going down the OTTO rabbit hole? Certainly easier and less risky. If your grip is within warranty consider filing a claim - otherwise you're left with the option to try and fix problem yourself, contact Thrustmaster support to buy a spare hat switch (if they even carry that) or buy a replacement grip. Regarding the price of the OTTO "replacement" I think you're right, it is expensive to put in our little toys (I mean very serious consumer goods haha) but don't forget they're not intended for this application either To be clear I didn't start this thread to advertise for or defend the pricing strategy of any manufacturer, OTTO or others. The thread is just here tell you that yes, if you want to, you can use OTTO switches in your Thrustmaster grips
  12. Well you can swap them out for MIL or commercial spec switches (which is not cheap) or you can take the 4-way switches apart and replace the tact switches inside with different ones that have a more tactile feel. It is fiddly solder work to do that but it is much cheaper if you get it right. I tried the tact replacement first using OMRON B3F-1026 (on the throttle mic switch) but the end result was not really much of an improvement. In the end I went full idiot and replaced all of them with OTTOs.
  13. Short update. I've swapped out the rest of the hat switches with OTTO 4-way and 5-way switches. I've used commercial spec switches but they are functionally identical if somewhat cheaper than their mil-spec cousins. Change the "C" to "M" in the part numbers below if you're interested in spending even more (Trim: T4-0016) DMS: T4-CQ1112 TMS: T4-CK1112 CMS: T5-CP1112N (plus 3d printed adapter and hat) The mod is not too difficult. Take the grip apart like usual. The DMS and TMS switches are easy to remove. They pop right out of the front panel from the back The CMS is trickier. You'll have to remove the hot glue and unscrew the switch body from behind and then it'll pop out. The OTTO T4 is pretty close to the stock DMS and TMS so they'll fit with a bit of electrician's tape and hot glue. The CMS is trickier, the stock switch is much larger in diameter so it would make more sense to fit a full size T5 (like the trim): I've used a smaller T5 with an adapter ring instead. The hat is custom designed and SLA printed and painted: Wiring is straight forward. Carefully unsolder the wires from the TM switches and solder them unto the OTTOs. Only thing to note is that the wiring position is "opposite" on the OTTOs compared to stock. Here is an example of how to match the OTTO switch contacts to the original TM TMS switch wiring: In the end it wont matter much (except for the ground wire), you can always remap inside DCS. I find the end result is excellent. The switching feel is great, but the improvement over stock is probably not worth the cost unless you get lucky on EBay.
  14. You can take the grip apart and pop the sucker out from the back to investigate further. You can easily disassemble the switch unit itself and see if the little tact switches inside are damaged or there's a mechanical problem. Thrustmaster support may be able to help out with a replacement if you can't fix the tacts (or mechanics) yourself, otherwise you could drop in an OTTO T4-CK1112. I've swapped out all hat switches on my grip with OTTOs so let me do a write up on that - perhaps it is useful for you Edit: Here we go: A-10C (Warthog) grip: full OTTO hat switch upgrade
  15. You could digitalRead() your switch and send several sendDcsBiosMessage() as you want. Throw in some debouncing for good measure. If you want quick and dirty you can use some millisecond delay() between each action, see here for inspiration: https://forums.eagle.ru/topic/117635-sending-messages-to-dsc-bios/?tab=comments#comment-2634648 If you want to go more advanced you could monitor in-game switch states to trigger the additional sendDcsBiosMessage() commands as appropriate - for example if you want to lift a switch cover first and wait to throw a toggle until it is open - or if you want to go through whatever sequence one switch at a time.. If you really need to have specific timed delay between actions, it would be better to use something like millis() and check against elapsed time to avoid stopping the code with the delay(); otherwise you can't do anything else while it waits.
  16. Well, unless something is broken on the main board, perhaps the connector is not seated properly or it is either the wires or the switch itself that are faulty. The wires are pretty fragile and can easily get pinched when you close up the grips. I've had this happen on pretty much all my grips and throttles :lookaround: If you check out the first post here, you can see how each switch has a wiring bundle that connect to the main board. Try and take the grip apart again and separate out the bundle that connects the sensor switch. Check if there's a pinch along the wires and if so you'll need to splice in a piece of wire make the connection. Any wire will do but the smaller the better since it is pretty tight in the neck of the grip. If there's no visible pinch it may be a faulty connection at or in the switch itself. You should be able to remove it from the grip and unscrew the back plate to check if there's any loose connections inside or if any of the tact switches are broken. You should be able to replace these if that is the case.
  17. That seems like a pretty solid solution. A very neat result! I wonder if threadlocker on the screw could extend the time before it gets wobbly? Or maybe rid it completely? Something to consider for the folks that are not comfortable with epoxy I guess :)
  18. You need to remove the nuts that hold the toggle switches in place from the top side. To do that you need to unscrew and carefully peel off the light plate first. Then you'll need needle nosed pliers or like a pair of tweezers to get in and unscrew the nuts. You may also need to unscrew and remove the plastic bracket that held the main PCB before you can slide the side PCB out.
  19. Thanks I hope the thread can be useful reference for people that want to upgrade or just fix problems with their grips. Good luck on messing with the throttle :) I'll be sharing a few upgrades on that soon!
  20. There's a workaround that lets you use regular toggles and covers without additional hardware. If you only care about the state of the switch in DCS and not the cover itself, you can do a digital read of your physical switch state and send instructions for both cover and switch actuation in sequence. you need to monitor in-game cover and switch states to sequence and trigger the open/close and toggle events. DCS-BIOS lets you do both. I use the trick for the covered Hornet fire push buttons and it works great. Same logic in some form would apply for covered toggle switches.
  21. A-10C (Warthog) grip: mil-spec trim switch upgrade Here's my take on the trim switch mod for the Warthog with added details about wiring for those interested. The clickity is much improved (in my opinion), but it is not an easy mod and I haven't solved a few issues with fit, so be warned :huh: I installed the same OTTO T4-0016 trim switch that I put in the Hornet grip only I painted the hat gray to match original switch: The switch should be water tight but I masked it off anyways before painting it. One layer Tamiya white spray primer, two layers Tamiya AS-7 gray, two layers matte clear varnish to seal it in: To install the mod, you'll need to say goodbye to the warranty :bye_3: cross your fingers, open up the grip, and unplug the trim, DMS, TMS and pickle switches from the PCB: Remove the switches from the front/face piece by carefully pushing the tab on each side and pushing the whole switch out from the back. Unscrew and remove the center bracket from the front piece. Dremel out the hole in the front piece to fit the larger OTTO trim switch. A lot of material will have to go: Cut out the right side of the center bracket until the trim switch fits. Be sure to leave the screw posts intact so you can put the grip together again. I used a hack saw here to quickly remove a big chunk and then a dremel to get to the final bits off: Desolder the wires from the stock TM trim switch to leave their full length intact. Cut the OTTO trim switch wires down to 5 cm (2") and connect them with the corresponding TM wires: The Warthog wire colors are identical to the TM Hornet trim switch. Note that you'll need to connect two OTTO common wires to the single TM common wire, e.g. blue and dark green to the TM yellow. The unused OTTO wires and the mesh wire can be removed completely. Cut away material from the tabs on the right side piece to fit the trim switch: Put the switches back in the front piece and click it back onto the left side piece. Tuck the trim switch wires below the trim switch and snake them around the back between the TMS and DMS: Plug everything back into PCB and close the grip back up carefully to avoid pinching any wires. Unless you fried the PCB, or broke the grip structure in the process you should be golden. Only one small issue persists: the top cover wobbles a bit when you press the trim switch. This is mainly because we had to remove so much material from the center bracket that otherwise holds it in place. I use hot glue to keep it secure - not a very nice solution, but it works... Have fun and don't say I didn't warn ya :smilewink:
  22. Good job. It really makes a difference when it works out :)
  23. Nice dremel work there :) The Warthog grip is not really suited for the T4 trim switch since you remove so much internal structure to make it fit that the top part of the stick becomes unstable. I have it working keeping a cut down center bracket in place, but it is a little wobbly right now. I'm testing to see what works best to keep the grip top stable without having to resort to strong epoxies to keep it together. I mean I'd like to be able to take it apart again for service!
  24. I already have an angled neck piece for my Cougar so I'd want the straight version of the base :) Keep at it dude
  25. A-10C (Warthog) grip: mil-spec button upgrade Thank you, that's an excellent comparison. Really shows the differences. Totally agree that P8 are preferred - if you can source them :) they can be hard to find. P1s are readily available on e.g. Mouser (or cheaper places if you're in the US) I will still recommend them if anyone is interested in upgrading their TM grip - warthog or hornet. Not cougar. Just don't. Buy a warthog and save yourself the pain. P1s will fit the warthog "pretty fine" - with a few caveats: The pickle/thumb switch will tilt slightly outwards without modification to either switch solder lugs or internal grip structure (very little grinding required) I live with the tilt :) Index finger switch has negligible tilt - it will protrude more than stock however, but not enough to be an issue in practice. Pinkie switch fits fine - protrudes a little more than stock, but the lever below is angled away so it doesn't get in the way (unlike the Cougar) Lever switch - fits P1 but you do have to grind/sand the lever a bit to make it fit, and dial the set screw all the way back. In conclusion - only the lever really requires some real modification to fit P1.. But still we're talking a bit of sanding. Nothing that compromises the structure of the grip. (My) recommended switch list for reference (repost) Pickle/thumb: P1-11121 (4 lbf red) Lever: P1-11122 (4 lbf black) Index: P1-11118 (2.5 lbf gray) Pinkie: P1-11118 (2.5 lbg gray) Reposting my pictures here from another thread on the topic. Top part, showing slight tilt of pickle switch and protrusion of index finger switch: Pinkie switch protrusion and modified lever - sanding is not visible. Lever sanded on the sides facing the grip. Check the fit periodically to avoid removing too much.
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