LanceCriminal86

I don't believe we are getting a hard wing at all. Far as I know we are getting retrofit slatted jets from the 66-69 serials without DMAS, and then later a 71- and higher with factory slats, DMAS, and TISEO.

It did not, I'm seeing the first N flying in 1972, Js were in Vietnam well before that, deliveries started in '66. The correct order would be B> J > N > S roughly with only B/J operating in Vietnam.

Gotta love the forgetfulness that the AIM-54's aero and motor performance had to be "adjusted" in order to even remotely perform like the real missile due to the old guidance and missile API (or really lack of the API) for the long shots. Or assuming that the values provided for the missile at launch were supplied in a vacuum with no review or input from ED. Even with those physics and guidance there were complaints the missile was underperforming at long/mid range because the guidance logic would burn so much energy off maneuvering. With the current physics and old, non-API guidance the missile would probably have been far worse than any iteration so far seen in release or open beta. Without the added values to adjust loft, lead calculation, etc. we'd be seeing a much shorter range missile, burning off what less energy it has now, with terrible loft profiles. And of course the inability to model differences in the A and C. Let's go back to where doing barrel rolls makes you unhittable, and missiles burning up all their energy before they get anywhere near the target from course corrections and maneuvering. And the most entertaining bit of course are the new and super low-post accounts showing up lately while the folks that had hounded the previous AIM-54 threads with criticism seem to be mostly silent or in agreement that the latest changes are making sense.

Never, because he was still wrong in most of his assertions and provided abusive and harassing DMs. There's a reason he's not here.

The only ones should be 114 with the movie style weathering and Rogue Nation, and only in the A skins folder. We're trying to figure out what is going on with the packages or updater, if something different needs to be done to remove the extra ones. They were triple checked before this round.

Since the only official -95 is the Iranian one, the answer should be No. Unless a decision is made to overhaul or revise the Early 135 to represent a USN -95 and -135 in some modular way

This stuff is getting looked at though, the ALQ-126 are an essential item and were always going to be added. It's not an F-14 2.0 issue, it's racking and stacking through art team priorities for fixing broken things first (which are being done), then features that needed to be added, and from there what additions or changes can be done without excessive man-hours. The early gun vents were getting done anyways. The ALQ-126 had to be added anyways and might at least be an on/off argument somewhere. And even if we don't get a modular TCS option or the ALQ-100 only, at least the ALQ-126 on/off option means we still can represent the newer and older jets from the 80s by the point where at least deployed squadrons had TCS. The converted jets are are just a B or D, they're not different or special really except they may show the closed up glove vanes. That's it. The Upgrades were somewhat spread out but if you spend a few minutes, pretty easy to figure out. And I have no idea what you are talking about with "squadron specials" or frankenplanes.

Break it down like this: A - OG batches, 60GR-75GR up through '73. Test/Eval squadrons, VF-124, VF-1/2. Gahbage IRSTs, different beaver tails and big reinforcement before being changed. - Main production A, 80GR-end of 110GR in '81. Added a nose probe in 90GR. Includes your Final Countdown/1st Sidra jets (-90 and -95s from VF-41 and 84), Top Gun jets, and 2nd Sidra jets (an -85 and -90GR). - Late production A, end of 110GR- in around '81 to last 140GR As delivered in 1988 to VF-201 and VF-202. Added jammers by intakes/glove and new beaver tail with jammer antenna. The bulk of the jets that survived to OEF/OIF and got LANTIRN etc. 1996+, trickle down of upgrades similar to B, LANTIRN, PTIDS through '98/'99, DFCS and ALR-67 by 2001. A+ / B / B (U) - First new and converted A+ around '86, VX-4 and testing through '88. 24, 211, 74, 103, 142, 143 start converting around '88-'90. Basically A with GE engines, new jammers, and new ALR-67 RWR. - Name changed in '91 to "B". That's about it. - B (UPGRADE) through 90s into 00s, various upgrades and phases for things like digital BUS, A2G, Lantirn, PTID, DFCS, GPS/JDAM, HUD. D Built or converted from As, 1990-1993. That's basically it. Got PTIDs as A/B squadrons converted or shut down, got GPS/JDAM around 2002 cause already a digital jet. Two good resources: Mike Crutch's CVW Volume One book/PDF, breaks down each BuNO and its squadron history with exceptions being the RAG and non-line squadrons. But you can sometimes see if they went to or from there. It's a good way to figure out when jets from those "blocks" hit the fleet squadrons. Second is this site: https://modelingmadness.com/review/mod/us/usn/fighter/gar14adiff.htm They are some big IFs, but ones that didn't necessarily receive an immediate "no" when asking if possible or to be considered. Animation argument would be one way, but making them both pods means like the Lantirn you could actually have them tied to the functions. Maybe if I send IronMike and Cobra enough snacks and pint size hookers it could happen, who knows. They have to add the ALQ-126 anyways, easier to add than remove.

And PTID was separately happening in 1995, one of the VX-9 jets that was a former VF-74 camo jet may have been the first PTID Tomcat as part of that program. PTID was originally because the old TIDs were becoming harder to read and burning out. IF we can somehow get modular/pod style ALQ-126 and TCS, then we could pretty well mimic the older -95 jets. Run the earlier jet with an ALQ-100 and no extra jammers and you basically have your '81 shootdown and Final Countdown jets, slap a TCS and you have an '89 shootdown jet, and add the ALQ-126 and you have most of the jets that were brand new in the early/mid 80s and onwards.

I thought a Reserves episode or two would have been neat, get some folks from 201 and 202 for the East coast and 301 and 302 for West coast. Some of them flew the doors off their jets and were comprised of fairly senior, experienced crews balanced out by reservist ground crew who sometimes were just reserves or had transitioned from fleet squadrons. From what I've gathered over the years they sometimes picked up different missions, such as aggressor duty, TARPS competitions (RAM at Bergestrom AFB), did some of the earlier A2G evolutions at Fallon, etc. Their jets were either really old blocks (70 and 75s with 301/302) or brand new + rebuilt + random old (60 and 65 eval jets rebuilt to 135, last 4 A -140s built, and random other jets at 201/202). And I believe VF-201 had two MiG killers come through the squadron, both 'Music' in the early 90s and CDR Hermon Cook later on. VF-202 in turn had one of if not the highest readiness scores I think from the CNO that had ever been recorded? Then mixed in you had the VF-1285, VF-1485, and VF-1486 who were augmentees and used VF-124 or 301/302's jets from the sound of it. And as another side thing, would have been neat to hear about the whole VF-191 and VF-194 thing, getting all those jets and crews only to have it get yanked. Oh, and last it would have been great to get some VX-4/9/PMTC guys to talk about some of what it was like to run the testing and eval side.

The -95 we are projected to get only, currently, represents an Iranian contract jet. In themselves those had some features removed and they apparently did not end up receiving Navy Sparrows, so the question about -95GR and AIM-7F might be moot. The projected "earlier" USN jet is still the -135, just in the 80s factory configuration with ALR-45/50 instead of ALR-67 and no Lantirn. The "early" external is probably going to be limited to adjusting antennas to ALR-45 types only and the older gun vents. In some form the TCS options may open up for the "bullet" aero housing when TCS is not equipped. Whether my wish list of mountable/removable ALQ-126 and TCS happens is going to somewhat determine if you can at least visually represent and simulate the older blocks, but there's a lot of work being done for more priority needs so no idea how it's going to shape up. But an ALQ-100 only setup and removable fuel pylons have not been promised at all, nor a perfect 1:1 recreation of the Iranian jets, more of a bonus option to allow some player experience around the Iran-Iraq war or more modern scenarios on Persian Gulf.

No, you are not. You threw a crash out there that was gone over 2-3 times by the Navy itself and inquiries as having nothing to do with G-stress, and everything to do with known weaknesses in the TF-30 at high AOA and low airspeed, and where a pilot exhibited old habits that worked fine in the Prowlers that she was an excellent pilot in, but was deadly in the Tomcat. The jet was recovered and Gs had nothing to do with it.

Weird, Hultgreen's jet was very much intact and did not disintegrate before impacting the water, nor was any "over-g" attributed to the incident, rather a compressor stall due to high AOA and low airspeed with heavy rudder input last I recalled. Where's the proof for your assertion there OP?

Well, the LANTIRN episode talking about how hard certain Hornet Mafia admirals worked to prevent that program from happening certainly might cause some controversy. Perhaps some of the performance stuff as well, discussions of the D's capabilities and later maintenance numbers against what was assumed to be a high maintenance jet.

It's been addressed repeatedly but yes, a fix for it was supposed to be rolled in a few patches ago. VFlip has posted a link somewhere to a fixed set of the skins.

Perhaps you missed the part where we are not putting non-E skins on the F-4E? Y'all can go nuts when the paint kit comes out but not the purpose here. Trying to identify F-4E operators and squadrons that fit the blocks of Phantoms being modeled for the module. When the Navy jets happen someday you can be assured they will properly be covered.

I think the D has a lot of extra systems to model though, some of which might be a challenge to find and document. I've been doing research to try and look at airframe differences and such on the E and noted that the APS-107 RHAW used in the D was also used in the E early on but was also discontinued around 1968, and replaced with APR-36/37. First Es didn't have the 107 either. I think there was also some other radar homing or detection gear, something like ARN-101 along the spine of the jet. It sounded like the Ds had a lot of electronic systems, and it may be similar to the challenge of doing the G.

Yeah, I have found a shortage of info on the ALR-67 dates versus say LANTIRN or PTIDs. At least those we know were happening in 1995 and we also know there were squadrons with pods but not PTID into 1998. ALR-67 though has not been easy to find. That said, I think the 1998 draft training plan seemed to imply that ALR-67 was on the docket then to be done: "AIRCRAFT AND/OR EQUIPMENT/SYSTEM/SUBSYSTEM REPLACED. In the F-14A Aircraft, sixty "core" F-14A Aircraft will be upgraded with the AN/ALR-67 Countermeasure Warning and Control System, LANTIRN and the Programmable Tactical Information Display (PTID)." If you said our A model was a 1998 jet from say, VF-154 that had LANTIRN and maybe got ALR-67 but hadn't received a PTID yet, you could just squeeze it in on a razor's edge. We saw anecdotes that '98 is where PTIDs were showing up in 154 and they had jets with LANTIRN and the old fishbowl. - 2001 NTSP changes the above statement to "were upgraded". So Allied Force jets might not have had the ALR-67 upgrades yet, but by Afghanistan in 2001 any As left should have had it.

On the topic of the Forrestal class we still don't even have all 4 from the 80s-90s period. Saratoga should be very close to Forrestal but Ranger and Indi had more significant changes to the layout. You can slap a 60, 61, or 62 on the Forrestal though and pretend if you want. As far as your eras though, late 50s? We don't and probably won't have any jets that represent that point anytime soon. The oldest we will probably see are late Vietnam F-4Js and F-8Js, which would be pre-SLEP where the ships were converted to the shuttle style catapult from bridle style. There is a good chance a bridle era ship will be done but probably years down the road whenever the Navy F-4 happens. I don't even know that it would be worth trying to pretend we have the early 60s or late 50s with the F-8 because you'd be missing the entire rest of the air wings from that time. As far as the F-8J goes, by the time Phantoms and eventually Tomcats were on the scene the Crusaders were becoming relegated to converted Essex or the Midway class ships. They weren't being deployed as much on the Forrestals, Kitty Hawks, Enterprise, or Nimitz classes. The J itself only equipped a few F-8 squadrons before they transitioned to F-14s or were shut down. I've never found a date where ALR-67 upgrades began on the A, only that the later BuNOs mainly got it with possibly one exception. And trying to look for the antenna changes you can see it on the OEF/OIF jets, but not sure I've seen it on say the Allied Force era Tomcats or before. I'll have to go back and look but I was under the impression crews were using car fuzz busters as a ghetto RWR around that time?

Incorrect on the A. If we consider the visual aspect alone, we are talking 1995+ for the B, and '96 or '97+ on the A as LANTIRN rollouts began following 1995 testing. For the A to have ALR-67 may even be later than that, again depending on the actual date where the ALR-67 retrofit to As began. I say visual because the GPS dome added for LANTIRN would only have been there from 95+ as jets got LANTIRN. Now, take away the actual LANTIRN, and the B can go all the way back to the late 80s as an A+ if you just do loadout restrictions. They already had ALR-67 and the upgraded gun vents from the start, just pretend that pesky GPS dome isn't there. Take off the LANTIRN for the A, and you're still stuck in a scenario where ALR-67 make it a late 90s jet. Otherwise it visually would be fine back to about 1990-1991 or whatever point the gun vents began the conversions from the slotted vents to the NACA style. You could try and ignore the ALR-67 but it's a significant difference from what the ALR-45 could do. Still to come is an older jet that is proper 1980s, covering from the early 80s through early 90s, or again mid-late 90s if you ignore the gun vents. That would be due to no LANTIRN, non-A2G loadouts, and the ALR-45 RWR. There are still some visual things missing from the A and B plus some fixes to be made. If some magic happens, we might even get to pretend we have late 70s jets without the TCS pod and no upgraded jammers (because the end of -110-GR in like 1981 and up had added ALQ-126 jammers, which are currently missing except for the boat tail antenna). Otherwise we're going to have early 80s production and up to about 91-93 or so A, then a very late 90s-00s A. The Iran jet isn't going to be a 100% thorough jet, just the 80s jet with some of the systems turned off.

The Iranian -95 will not be a full and "true" Iranian -95 in itself. Unless something massive changes it will still have the same externals as the -135 Early, maybe with the ALQ-100 only but maybe just with the TCS bullet housing. It will probably still have the late -115+ beaver tail with ECM. If the early external model gets the older vents it probably will have those. Probably will have the external tank pylons, unless that too changes across the board. It has been stated more than once that it will be the "Early" -135 with some features turned off and Iranian skins. Everything depends on what the art team decides to change for the earlier external model. If they add changeable TCS pods and removable ALQ-126, and removable tank pylons then sure, it will be pretty darn close to an Iranian jet. They added the option for an Iranian player jet further down the road in development as a bonus.

Hwat? No such thing occurred. The -95 wasn't originally promised, then or now, only an Iranian spinoff with some disabled systems was added further in development. There's TALK of setting up the "early" -135 so it can look like the older jets for the most part. Functionally the -135 "early" is going to fly the same as a US -95 would, just with a little extra jamming. All the early/late and -135 naming from HB were intended for was to separate the later 90s LANTIRN equipped jets that eventually got ALR-67 from the 80s-90s Tomcat with the old ALR-45 and still Air to Air focused. Giving us some visual or mounting options would let you maybe remove some stuff to pretend it's a -95 in 1981 off the Nimitz with no TCS or ALQ-126. Again, being considered but nothing concrete. And the early jet basically is waiting on art from what I understand in past updates. Once the model can have the features backdated/added for the different As and the B then it should just be testing of the ALR-45 and that's about it.

Oh? What other changes to the B preclude including the A+ back through '87-88 besides not mounting the LANTIRN and ignoring the GPS dome?

TL;DR Airquake servers have been spared one more month. Next month there will be rending of garments, wearing of sack-cloths, and the lamentations of their women will drown out all. Phoenix will blot out the sun, and there will be no fighting in the shade.