fastfreddie Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 It kinda seems like to take forever - can´t wait to take a flight in this beauty. Shouldn´t have preordered so early so the timespan of waiting wouldn´t have been that long .. lol .. :D Compared to the DCS release record (Blackshark, A10, Mustang) we are flying along now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastfreddie Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 U first! bring it on... Yeah I waiting to see the drop rate on the MK108 cannon. Supposed to be like 41m the first 1000m with a pretty low velocity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JST Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Yeah I waiting to see the drop rate on the MK108 cannon. Supposed to be like 41m the first 1000m with a pretty low velocity. Muzzle velocity of a mineshell is about 500-540m/s, though the cannon is light, low recoil and fires around 600rpm. It's always some tradeoff. My skins/liveries for Fw 190 D-9 and Bf 109 K-4: My blog or Forums. Open for requests as well. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
20thBG_Blackwolf Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Any word on when in November we can get this? Tonight at midnight would be ok with me! BSD Discord , BSD Website If it doesn't hover, it just sucks and blows Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
20thBG_Blackwolf Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Hey,JST could you do a version of your Black 3 of II/jg6 but make it a 13 instead for me? I did this by changing the bort number but that has to be done each time. BSD Discord , BSD Website If it doesn't hover, it just sucks and blows Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gavagai Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Yeah I waiting to see the drop rate on the MK108 cannon. Supposed to be like 41m the first 1000m with a pretty low velocity. That is a crazy estimate and contradicts the acceleration of gravity: 9.81m/s^2. It will take less than two seconds for the shell to travel 1000m. "Drop" is a function of time, not the mass of the shell. P-51D | Fw 190D-9 | Bf 109K-4 | Spitfire Mk IX | P-47D | WW2 assets pack | F-86 | Mig-15 | Mig-21 | Mirage 2000C | A-10C II | F-5E | F-16 | F/A-18 | Ka-50 | Combined Arms | FC3 | Nevada | Normandy | Straight of Hormuz | Syria Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luzifer Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 That is a crazy estimate and contradicts the acceleration of gravity: 9.81m/s^2. It will take less than two seconds for the shell to travel 1000m. "Drop" is a function of time, not the mass of the shell. Hmm... Free fall of 41 m in 9.81 m/s² takes about 2.9 s. Over 1000 m that makes for an average velocity of about 346 m/s. If the mine shell loses velocity rather quickly from air drag (high caliber / low mass?) that does not seem outrageously far off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gavagai Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Low mass? Not sure where that comes from. Ok, it might not be "crazy," but that's a pretty big deceleration in the horizontal axis if it is true!:wassat: P-51D | Fw 190D-9 | Bf 109K-4 | Spitfire Mk IX | P-47D | WW2 assets pack | F-86 | Mig-15 | Mig-21 | Mirage 2000C | A-10C II | F-5E | F-16 | F/A-18 | Ka-50 | Combined Arms | FC3 | Nevada | Normandy | Straight of Hormuz | Syria Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiloMorai Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luzifer Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Low mass? Not sure where that comes from. I was really just guessing at a reason for deceleration. As far as my reasoning went, mine shells would have a higher ratio of explosives to lead (or whatever metal), but I didn't actually look up anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gavagai Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Sure, that makes sense. I've seen Tony Williams' tables before and the 30mm shells always have significantly more mass than the smaller calibers. http://www.quarryhs.co.uk/WW2guneffect.htm P-51D | Fw 190D-9 | Bf 109K-4 | Spitfire Mk IX | P-47D | WW2 assets pack | F-86 | Mig-15 | Mig-21 | Mirage 2000C | A-10C II | F-5E | F-16 | F/A-18 | Ka-50 | Combined Arms | FC3 | Nevada | Normandy | Straight of Hormuz | Syria Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9.JG27 DavidRed Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 so that shows that the mk108 drops 3,4m within the first 400m. but i guess it doesnt really matter...with training one will get used to its trajectory, and then it sure will be deadly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JST Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Hey,JST could you do a version of your Black 3 of II/jg6 but make it a 13 instead for me? I did this by changing the bort number but that has to be done each time. Yeah, I sent it to you via PM. 1 My skins/liveries for Fw 190 D-9 and Bf 109 K-4: My blog or Forums. Open for requests as well. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JST Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 As far as my reasoning went, mine shells would have a higher ratio of explosives to lead (or whatever metal), but I didn't actually look up anything. Mineshells were made from drawn steel, the thin shell allowed for more explosive. Weight of the projectile was about the same as any modern 30mm HE shell (~350g) although the casing and cartridge were much lighter. My skins/liveries for Fw 190 D-9 and Bf 109 K-4: My blog or Forums. Open for requests as well. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiloMorai Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 MK108 ammo http://robdebie.home.xs4all.nl/me163/weapons15.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JST Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 MK108 ammo http://robdebie.home.xs4all.nl/me163/weapons15.htm There it is! Thanks. Did a quick google to try and find this site earlier, but didn't work out. 30mm mineshell: My skins/liveries for Fw 190 D-9 and Bf 109 K-4: My blog or Forums. Open for requests as well. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gavagai Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 so that shows that the mk108 drops 3,4m within the first 400m. but i guess it doesnt really matter...with training one will get used to its trajectory, and then it sure will be deadly. With the good old 0.5*a*t^2 that works out to an average velocity of 427m/s over the 400m, btw. I'm going to have to eat some humble pie and say that the 41m over 1000m could actually be correct!:doh: P-51D | Fw 190D-9 | Bf 109K-4 | Spitfire Mk IX | P-47D | WW2 assets pack | F-86 | Mig-15 | Mig-21 | Mirage 2000C | A-10C II | F-5E | F-16 | F/A-18 | Ka-50 | Combined Arms | FC3 | Nevada | Normandy | Straight of Hormuz | Syria Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
20thBG_Blackwolf Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Yeah, I sent it to you via PM. Thanks, got it. :D BSD Discord , BSD Website If it doesn't hover, it just sucks and blows Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Friedrich-4B Posted November 2, 2014 Share Posted November 2, 2014 Attached is an MK 108 Handbuch dated October 1943; it doesn't give specifics on velocities or trajectories, but it is interesting nevertheless, and shows what a simple, advanced weapon the MK 108 was. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]************************************* Fortunately, Mk IX is slightly stable, anyway, the required stick travel is not high... but nothing extraordinary. Very pleasant to fly, very controllable, predictable and steady. We never refuse to correct something that was found outside ED if it is really proven...But we never will follow some "experts" who think that only they are the greatest aerodynamic guru with a secret knowledge. :smartass: WWII AIRCRAFT PERFORMANCE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastfreddie Posted November 2, 2014 Share Posted November 2, 2014 (edited) With the good old 0.5*a*t^2 that works out to an average velocity of 427m/s over the 400m, btw. I'm going to have to eat some humble pie and say that the 41m over 1000m could actually be correct!:doh: I pulled that from my FW190 Eddie Creek and J Smith volume sets. They have some pretty good sections on the weapon systems and compared the MK108 and MK103. The Mk103 had a velocity of 940m/sec and the Mk108 only had 520m/sec. They talked about the FW190 A6/R2 which was to compromise of Mk108 mounted inside the wings. "The MK108 gun, was very small and compact and easy to manufacture. However, its relative low muzzle velocity was its shortcoming, with the result that is projectile trajectory was seriously affected by bullet drop after a comparatively short range:41m (135 ft) of drop in the first 1000m (3300 ft) of range". If its velocity was only averaging 427m/s over 400m I'd hate to see what it drops to by the 1000m mark. I'm guessing this won't be a long range sniper weapon on B17s when they are released unless I'm using David as my spotter. Edited November 2, 2014 by fastfreddie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastfreddie Posted November 2, 2014 Share Posted November 2, 2014 Attached is an MK 108 Handbuch dated October 1943; it doesn't give specifics on velocities or trajectories, but it is interesting nevertheless, and shows what a simple, advanced weapon the MK 108 was. The first time I saw pictures of it outside an aircraft I had to look twice because it looked alot like the MK19 we had when I was in the army. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kubanloewe Posted November 2, 2014 Share Posted November 2, 2014 (edited) to my knowledge the MK108 was only practicable against bombers. I read from 2 pilots who stated it does much earlier jam when g forces stay on the ammobelt. One said after some gunjams he pull the 109 nose a bit over his target than push a bit back so that the positive g force went and than the MK108 fires always without trouble. i really dont know why they took in this thing in a 109 which main targets were fighters in missions with heavy 190 bomber destroyers which they had to cover against "little friends". since the 109 and 190´s had low range of armament i hope to change between the MG151/20 and the MK108 online ! Edited November 2, 2014 by kubanloewe WIN 10; i9-9900K@4,8GHz; Gigabyte Z390 Aorus;32GB Corsair DDR4 3600MHz; 2TB Samsung SSD; GeForce GTX1080 8GB Seahawk; 34" AW3418DW; MS FFB2 Stick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastfreddie Posted November 3, 2014 Share Posted November 3, 2014 Just read one pilot account and hes said in the FW190A version they flew had 20 and 30s in the wing tips (13mm removed and armor plate inserted). When diving into the bomber formations they would fire the 20s at 400m and 30's at 200m. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solty Posted November 3, 2014 Share Posted November 3, 2014 since the 109 and 190´s had low range of armament i hope to change between the MG151/20 and the MK108 online ! You can't just change between 30mm and 20mm. It was equiped with it in factory and K4 had standard 30mm Mk108. I guess you could get some additional gunpods though. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]In 21st century there is only war and ponies. My experience: Jane's attack squadron, IL2 for couple of years, War Thunder and DCS. My channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCyAXX9rAX_Sqdc0IKJuv6dA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZaltysZ Posted November 3, 2014 Share Posted November 3, 2014 but i guess it doesnt really matter...with training one will get used to its trajectory, and then it sure will be deadly. or just shoot at things from 50-100m. :) Wir sehen uns in Walhalla. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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