Flaps on the Sabre

[bart]

I may be wrong here but are the flap configurations correct on our Sabre?

 

In the cockpit the lever has three stages, up (retracted) mid (take off position) and full flap (landing). But the way it is currently modelled is either retracted or full and depending how you mess around with the lever any position between the two!

 

Now there is no flap position gauge in the cockpit so the give away here is the 3 position lever. Aircraft that I have had the pleasure of being associated with in the past that have had 3 position flaps have also had mechanical locks on the lever so it was possible to go from retracted to full flap in one movement but when going from full flap to retracted position there was a safety feature that would not allow that to happen without going through a "gate" on the lever first at the mid (take off) position. On our Sabre you can go from full flap to retracted....anyone notice the sink with this when taking off?!! You cant select the mid position and have the flaps move there without going to external view first and selecting full flap in the cockpit then going to the mid position to stop further flap movement.

 

Take a look at this video of start up procedures and checks. At around 1:20 the pilot selects full flap from retracted position, then moves to mid take off position.

 

Thoughts anyone?

[Furia]

The sabre of the video has a wing with slats and thus has a different performance and procedures than the Belsimtek module that is a F-86F-35 with a wing with no slats.

 

The Sabre has no internal flap possition indicator, you can see the flaps possition looking over your shoulder or with experience you know how many seconds you need to get them where you want them.

 

So the ammount of flap to be used also depends of runway avalaible, type of take off, aircraft load. You use as much as you think fits to your needs.

 

The flight manual says that if during takeoff you retract the flaps at speeds below 160 knots you will experience a pitch down.

 

[bart]

I stand corrected.......

 

Just read in the f-86 Sabre's pilot manual that the flap lever mid position is the HOLD detent position, so yes our Sabre is correct.....sorry Belsimtek!!

 

What's also worth a point is it states that once the flaps are up in flight, the lever should then be put into the HOLD detent to prevent damage to the flap actuating mechanism.

Edited July 27, 2014 by bart

[joey45]

And now to map that to my TMW....

 

Now IF it were a rotory then I (we) could map that to something more useful.

[Basco1]

It would be very nice if the good chaps at DCS could give us an AXIS for the flaps,and maybe a second one one for the landing gear,so we could map these to our controllers,instead of us having to use a very unrealistic switch.

[Scrim]

I don't see what's wrong with the flaps. It's either in down, up or neutral. Why should it be mapped as an axis when there's no middle room between those settings?

[jocko417]

BTW, I think IRL the flaps were marked like the P-51.

[Basco1]

I don't see what's wrong with the flaps. It's either in down, up or neutral. Why should it be mapped as an axis when there's no middle room between those settings?

 

Something called 'IMMERSION',I use a Saitek throttle quadrant for my undercariage and flap controls,which has clearly defined middle sections so I can't see a problem,I have no problem selecting a 'middle room',it's just personal preferance I guess,sure if you want to use a button go ahead use your button.

[bart]

And now to map that to my TMW....

 

Now IF it were a rotory then I (we) could map that to something more useful.

 

I have the flaps mapped to the 3 position flaps switch on the TMW throttle and it seems to work, but can only get the pit lever to the middle position if I go from the DN position to the MVR position on the TMW flap switch. I cant get the mid position when going from UP to MVR.

 

As for the U/C I just press G on the keyboard.

[Dejjvid]

The MVR position is no button, but if you want to lower flaps a little bit, you use flaps down a short moment, then back to MVR and they stay. But I think there are several different ways to bind flaps.

 

And for landing gear I use modifier (NWS) + AP on left throttle. No need to move your hands from the HOTAS.

[Dejjvid]

Don't know about the sustained turn radius, or best cornering speed with/without flaps. I always fight with high energy, and I never use flaps in any dogfight. When people try to drag me in to a turning contest I do a high yo yo instead, I kill them every time they do that.

[LNR212]

Hi!

 

is there a chance to map the flap-switch from the TMW for the Sabre like for the A10?

 

UP-MIDDLE-DOWN position...

[Davee]

I have the flaps mapped to the 3 position flaps switch on the TMW throttle and it seems to work, but can only get the pit lever to the middle position if I go from the DN position to the MVR position on the TMW flap switch. I cant get the mid position when going from UP to MVR.

 

As for the U/C I just press G on the keyboard.

 

 

MapKey(&Throttle, FLAPU, L_CTL+'f');

MapKeyR(&Throttle, FLAPU, L_CTL+'f');

MapKey(&Throttle, FLAPD, L_SHIFT+'f');

MapKeyR(&Throttle, FLAPD, L_SHIFT+'F');

 

 

Allows for stopping flaps anywhere going up or down. So, I don't have to use full flaps on takeoff or otherwise.

[cichlidfan]

Hi!

 

is there a chance to map the flap-switch from the TMW for the Sabre like for the A10?

 

UP-MIDDLE-DOWN position...

 

The Sabre's flaps don't work that way.

 

Catseye's implementation is an accurate simulation of the real thing.

 

From the -1

 

EDIT: If I were going to use the flaps switch on the Warthog, I would use DX assignments instead to prevent flooding and achieve the same results.

Edited August 5, 2014 by cichlidfan

[Skulleader]

Hello,

 

I don't know if I can help you but I possess few F-86F Manuals and I publish here two pages about the flaps for the F-86F:

 

 

And

 

 

 

If you have any comments it's perfect, Skull.

[NeilWillis]

With the TMW all you need to do is use the flaps switch for the flaps, and map the flaps up to the forwards position, the flaps down to the aft position, and the middle does nothing.

 

It works perfectly.

[joey45]

I have the flaps mapped to the 3 position flaps switch on the TMW throttle and it seems to work, but can only get the pit lever to the middle position if I go from the DN position to the MVR position on the TMW flap switch. I cant get the mid position when going from UP to MVR.

 

As for the U/C I just press G on the keyboard.

 

I was thinking more like the grey rotory to the right of the throttles...;)

[NeilWillis]

It's a 3 position switch, and the sabre has a 3 position lever, why do you need anything else?

[LNR212]

The Sabre's flaps don't work that way.

 

Catseye's implementation is an accurate simulation of the real thing.

 

 

Roger that... but anyway, would it be possible to assign it that way? (.lua-file edit?)

Or maybe like joey mentioned the grey rotary?

[cichlidfan]

Roger that... but anyway, would it be possible to assign it that way? (.lua-file edit?)

Or maybe like joey mentioned the grey rotary?

 

I don't see how since the sim doesn't recognize any type of 'middle' position for the flaps there is nothing to assign.

[joey45]

Damn... good point, didn't think of that... TARGET then... and do bands.

 

Or edit the .lua for the flaps switch.

[Shaman]

I like current implementation. It works well on Warthog throttle flaps sw. Middle position to hold.

[cichlidfan]

I suppose it would be possible to create a 'middle' function using key down, and key up commands with a delay, of the correct amount, in between. However, that would have to rely on the assumption that the flaps move the same amount regardless of the speed of the aircraft, when in flight.

 

EDIT: Of course, this would have to be done with an external program (i.e. SST, Target).

Edited August 5, 2014 by cichlidfan

[KLR Rico]

I've noticed that the flap handle returns to hold when the key is released while the flaps are in an intermediate position (as expected), but when the flaps are fully opened or closed, the lever will stick in the respective position instead of returning to hold. Bug or feature?