When will we finally see old 'bugs' quashed?

[Filament]

Alrighty....I think I'm done (for now).

 

Most recent example, is a crushed Ka-50 nosewheel on the deck of the Vinson - into the wind - blades down relative to the wind - sliding forward, with the ship doing ~15 kts. in my direction of facing. Huh?

 

In IL-2, if I want to roll *back* - I just extend flaps! These design teams are affiliated (or at least talk to each other, occasionally).

 

I'm out. I own almost ALL the modules. I would think that after an expenditure of ~$250-300 I could expect something to work correctly here, after 2+ years of this!

 

I've got a litany of these complaints - but have 'sat' on them - until now.'

 

I realize there are many models - and soon to be many terrains, instead of the same 'ol Crimea area, for 10 years or so.

 

Fix this $hit! Stop all development of new models until everything currently existent, or in the pipeline, works perfectly (or very, very close)!

 

We've already paid for it! *Crowd-funding mode OFF!*

 

*out*

Edited January 1, 2015 by Filament

[Flagrum]

So, they shall stop development of EDGE/DCS2 so that you ... what? Extend flaps on your helo ...!?

 

I don't even ask why you try to land on a ship if you know that there is a long standing bug, but instead wish you a happy new year! I think.

[Filament]

So, they shall stop development of EDGE/DCS2 so that you ... what? Extend flaps on your helo ...!?

 

I don't even ask why you try to land on a ship if you know that there is a long standing bug, but instead wish you a happy new year! I think.

 

Well - you're correct in one sense. I suppose I knew about the 'long standing bug.' But I presume you miss my point...you guys are extending your arms, thinking that the shot of EDGE heroin is going to 'make everything right.'

 

It doesn't matter. Adding more A/C and terrain modeling (exponentially adding to the complexity of 'things to be corrected') doesn't do anything but provide a little more 'eye candy.'

 

Weights/balance/FM's, etc. - I can deal with these. Laws of physics departures - in spades - now, we have a problem. Flaps, on the helo - nice 'reach,' but failure - in attempt at 'punking.'

 

Happy New Year to you, as well!

 

These are not $2 iPad apps we're dealing with...

[Flagrum]

Well - you're correct in one sense. I suppose I knew about the 'long standing bug.' But I presume you miss my point...you guys are extending your arms, thinking that the shot of EDGE heroin is going to 'make everything right.'

No, of course it won't.

 

There are probably bugs that require features of EDGE/DCS2 to be fixed in a proper manner. If that is the case for the ship landing bug - I don't know.

 

But the real point here is, that ED must complete EDGE/DCS2 first before they really can address many of the outstanding issues. It was already mentioned in other threads that some fixes are already supposed to be incorporated into the internal version of DCS2 - it would be just a waste of time and manpower to port them back to DCS1 ... if it is even technically possible at all. Fixing bugs is time consumpting - that is what you, and many others, mabe myself included - complain about. Some more, some less. But if ED now would have to fix bugs TWICE, once for DCS1 and another time for DCS2, it only would take even longer ...

 

DCS2 is not the silver bullet to all problems. But it is, hopefully, a good starting point - once it is released.

[JNASova]

Filament is right.

There are to many problems for long period of time.Same thing was with FC 2.One problem fixed,five new comes out.FC3 beta had many problems.Answer was it is yust beta,final version will be OK....almost two years were needed to solve the problem of server stability.

To many problems for too long period of time.ED definitely must reorganize business.DCS is very good,revolutionary ideja, and it is a pity to waste because of such things.This is small community,and one by one people leaving.

 

Happy new year too all.

[NeilWillis]

And 2 by 2 people are joining too!

 

Things are never perfect - unless you know any different? With its minor niggles, DCS World is still streets ahead of anything else on the market.

 

As has already been stated, why would you fix a car that was about to be traded in for a newer, more powerful replacement?

 

Will DCS World 2.0 be bugged - of course it will. Will it then be developed at a continually increasing pace with more and more 3rd party developers - also true.

 

Are you cutting off your noses to spite your faces? You tell us...

 

But despite this fit of pique - no doubt the next complaint will be that it is taking too long - may I wish everyone a Happy New Year, and may your bugs be squished quickly under the heel of the boot of ED and the other teams.

[weeb]

Happy New Year peeps.

 

Filament

 

This is my honest opinion, I know it may not suit everyone but that's freedom of speech.

 

I never had the inkling in all my life to fly flight simulators. I can't even remember how I found DCS but I did, and I have never looked back.

 

I didn't just want to use it, I wanted to dig deeper and understand it. I have almost all the modules, with that came a huge amount of information to digest.

 

ED don't always get it right but if I can fly about for 3 hours bombing the shit out of things and 1 problem in the game shows up, whats the beef? It's not like I'm locked out of the game like Sony and MS which were obliterated over Christmas.

 

When you see their problems "extending flaps" pales into the term insignificant. I'm not taking a pop at you, so please don't think that, what I am trying to say is what one person may think is significant, another may say it's trivial.

 

I understand your frustration, you are obviously an intelligent guy, your screen name indicates you know about the internal matrix of a light bulb. Keep it "light hearted", so far so good.

 

weeb

[msalama]

EDGE heroin is going to 'make everything right.'

 

Probably not. Regardless, getting EDGE out is an essential step in 'making everything right' as you put it.

 

The longstanding bugs annoy me too, as does the still-missing Huey mechanics thermal damage model. But I also realize that without revenue, these guys aren't going to fix anything in the long run :huh:

[crazyeddie]

I have been around this game since I was in nappies, and now I need nappies for a different age related reason. (That is a long long time if you were wondering !!)

 

The game has changed massively since the early days of Flanker, many improvements and many unresolved bugs running hand in hand.

 

I measure the success of the game by the activity on this site, in the early days there were a huge number of modders doing all sorts of stuff on this and associated sites, usually for nothing, and the sites buzzed in a way that none of them do now.

 

Dont get me wrong, some of the work being done now is exceptional, better than ever, but what about the basic game, has that improved.

 

I still see simple to fix little bugs, lots of them, that have been around forever. I accept that DCS is in this to make money and I agree that this is the best of what there is available but I do think they are missing the point at times.

 

Development is essential but it should never be at the expense of producing a quality product in the first place.

 

Filament has a point, the balance is wrong and it has driven some exceptional modders away.

[Phantom453]

DCS has certainly moved forward in leaps and bounds over the years and continues to do so. The future, as revealed so far, looks very positive.

 

However, I have to agree that many of these smaller issues/ bugs, often rather minor in isolation, do compound, especially over time, to detract from the appeal and immersion of several aspect of the sim and indeed the overall flying experience.

 

Clearly the primary focus at the moment is the release of DCSW 2.0/ EDGE and the NTTR map. IMHO the should obviously continue (ED are relatively close to release now it would seem) and once released, addressing any major bugs/ critical issues should be a priority. However, after this it would be a great opportunity for a period of consolidation and the final elimination of any of those pesky lingering bugs not dealt with by the release of DCSW 2.0/ EDGE).

 

It would be great to see DCSW 2.0 step off as a complete product with a highly polished feel to it.

[shagrat]

Fix this $hit! Stop all development of new models until everything currently existent, or in the pipeline, works perfectly

We've already paid for it! *Crowd-funding mode OFF!*

 

*out*

I don't know how many times this argument will come up again and it won't make it right!

To stop the development teams develop things helps the bug fixing teams how, exactly? Do you really think texture artists, modellers, or even avionics specialists can help with bugfixing environment modelling or collision models? The modeller perhaps... it is CAD at all.

 

The thing is, no company on this planet will be stupid enough to follow that road. A car mannufacturer will always(!) develop the next generation car to be launched In some 5-7 years and not put his developers and engineers to fixing/upgrading existing stuff. That is what production improvement lifecycles are for.

People ever saw the bugfix lists on update and patch releases? You think they have tiny fairies fixing them or actual staff doing that?

 

Especially, the latest upgrades since Sept/Nov introduced a lot of bug fixes to the "old" pre-EDGE DCS World including such game breaking issues as AI stuck on railway bridges, F-15 drop tanks etc.

Now I am sorry your favorite bug has not been addressed, but it is not as if ED is not fixing things!

 

And they do it, despite splitting their resources between old DCS World and DCS World 2.0!

 

Now following your argument, they should fix ALL bugs in DCS World first, stopping development for EDGE and 2.0, right?

Then we would have a "fixed" version with no new maps or modules until DCS World 2.0 / EDGE release some months later, scrapping the fixed version and introducing the inevitable new bugs?

Sounds like a plan.

 

I'll rather have them stop fixing ANY bugs in old DCS World and focus on polishing 2.0 so we have less bugs and get it out as quick as possible and then start fixing relevant bugs, while developers can adapt planes, build new maps, new modules while we have a lasting environment! :doh:

[Filament]

Good points, all.

 

I remember when DCS started out. I thought, "wow - a battlefield environment! Air and ground! It'll either set the bar, or be an epic fail."

 

It hasn't failed. It has set the bar. But it hasn't succeeded yet.

Because it's trying to be all things, to all people.

 

This is a high-fidelity sim. The highest yet created. Just one of these aircraft, properly and thoroughly known, would be enough for a lifetime. Any of them, is at least an "8" on a 10-scale (to me).

 

The flight sim "niche" (in terms of numbers of us), has dwindled since the DCS project started. Fortunately, most of us are fairly well-off and are professionals - so it makes life doubly "challenging" for the developers. We're intelligent enough - and experienced enough - to know when things "aren't quite right." They do this because they have a passion for this also! And they probably knew - like we suspected, at the start - that they might be biting off more than they can chew. And it is fun to land an A-10 or a helo on a dirt road, and run over and jump into a Bradley on go blow stuff up on the ground after you missed it with your last bomb! ;) It all mostly works - not 'epic fail!'

 

I agree that we should just hang on until EDGE is released.

 

But I also think that Wags and team should tire of boasting about being a "Kool-Aid mixer" in his sig, because we're going to start holding their feet to the fire and fixing anything that's been glaringly-wrong for 2 years or more!

 

'Nuff said.

 

Great points, all! And Happy New Year - and thanks to the team, too, for all your hard work thus far!

[Flagrum]

But I also think that Wags and team should tire of boasting about being a "Kool-Aid mixer" in his sig, because we're going to start holding their feet to the fire and fixing anything that's been glaringly-wrong for 2 years or more!

I think, he and the whole ED team are glaringly aware of this. And if I remember correctly, the original Kool Aid mixer did not end too well, either.

 

And that is probably why whe are not flying over Nevada right now. :o)

[SkateZilla]

Who.doesnt like.kool aid?

 

Even.though.its.off topic, the kool aid thing has nothing to.do with development.

Edited January 1, 2015 by SkateZilla

[Dudester22]

This sim is alot more advanced then the the sims of yesteryears. This means more work fixing bugs which in turn creates other bug that need fixing. I don't think you will ever get this Sim to be bug free, so just be glad they are only small bugs.

[Chief1942]

ad infinitum

 

Like many here, I go back to Flanker days. One thing I picked up on early in my addiction to flight sims (especially "study sims") is that the amount of expertise and effort required to do it right the first time, is nigh on impossible. Much of what we have comes from "best guess" as some of the info trying to be replicated was still classified data. Even with what has been released in the way of operational detail, ED is still having to take real world information and adapt it to a computer simulation in a manner that replicates the "real deal" as close as they can. I have come to accept that such an undertaking is practically impossible. When was the last time you actually felt the effects of those 6 G's you pull with impunity? I've had the opportunity to have had some stick time in real world military flight simulators:pilotfly: and believe me, they too are "buggy".

I think like Filament, many of us get frustrated with our particular "bug" in our favorite module, and after many hours it does seem to compound ( the frustration that is) to the point where venting seems to be the only way to relieve that ever building sense that things could/should be better. Like has already been stated by others, EDGE may in fact squash many of the existing bugs, but simply due to the nature of our favorite pastime, I suspect there will simply be others. I think it comes with the challenge of creating "study sims" and perhaps as technology improves, we will see less and less of these problems. But I doubt they will ALL ever go away.

 

Happy New Year to all, especially those hard at work at Eagle Dynamics.:thumbup:

Edited January 2, 2015 by Chief1942

[Cali]

I would like for them to not work on so many projects at one time and focus on 1-2. Work on more if it doesn't hinder the process of other projects. Old bugs are annoying. I remember Viper had a bug thread that he would keep up to date. Hopefully 2015 has some good things in store for us and ED team.

[Picksplitter]

and for a completely different view...

 

I too have seen the bugs, oh my. There was a time with the a10c where if you went over 320 knots, your left wing disappeared and if you looked down you could see thru the airframe. I said to myself, don't go over 320 knots and don't look down.

 

There was a time when the mavericks were buggy.... I said let's switch to guns...

 

adapt and overcome... fly around the bugs!

[Mosley]

Both sides have points. But in the end there are bugs that have been around for so long its pretty sad. My favorite is whoever said that the cbu 97's/105's work fine as long as you drop 4 instead of 1. I got a good chuckle out of that one. IMO the cbu's have been messed up since they switched them from the 87 style to the proper 97. Then its been messed up, really messed up, ctd when droping them, etc. They have never been fixed properly.

 

I too am of the opinion lets get the bugs fixed. However I am expecting a slew of new bugs once edge is released which is normal but those have to be fixed, then move on to fixing the bugs in new products, then something else, then getting back to the basic bugs that have plagued this sim for years.

 

In the end its lets push out more product to make money ( which I completely understand ) but at some point which seems to be when the bug breaks the game is the only time its fixed.

 

Been through this same thing year or two ago and in the end nothing changes.

 

I play single play when I feel like it, havnt bought a module since.