DCS: AJS-37 Viggen Discussion

[Grundar]

Not sure if this has been posted in this thread before but it is a interesting read about a dramatic event over the Baltic sea during the Cold War involving a SH37 and a Soviet Su-15.

 

http://www.flygtorget.se/illustrationer/fil_20110110093819.pdf

 

 

 

The Cold War was pretty cold at times...

 

Bloody oath it was. It's always fascinating to read about things like this that happened in the cold war. I'm impressed with the SH37 throwing that kind of maneveur at that altitude, probably more surprised that the Sukhoi followed him through! :joystick:

 

For military personal during the Cold War it must of been a constant simmering tension, especially for those who would be in an immediate frontline.

 

Leatherneck, please just release the Viggen already lol :cry:

[Kev2go]

interesting story

[grunf]

I may be wrong, but 500m seems too optimistic for a split s. :D

[RaXha]

I may be wrong, but 500m seems too optimistic for a split s. :D

 

 

 

Not in a Viggen with no external ordinance. :P

[grunf]

Not in a Viggen with no external ordinance. :P

Great, one more reason to look forward to it! :D

[Hummingbird]

For comparison's sake a clean F-16C's minimum turn radius at SL is 369 meters (1,211 ft), i.e. it would need a minimum of at least 738 m in height to complete the split S, and then at least a good 50 m in safety margin to avoid clashing into the deck.

[renhanxue]

I think the pilot probably understated his altitude a bit.

[mattebubben]

And also for those wanting the entire Story Translated it was done a "few" pages ago (Page 55 Post 566 ^^)

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=2601502&postcount=566

Edited June 24, 2016 by mattebubben

[microvax]

BTW, can the canard flaps be employed manually during flight or are they only usable with gear down for landing ?

[Skjold]

BTW, can the canard flaps be employed manually during flight or are they only usable with gear down for landing ?

 

Excellent question, i'd like an answer to this as well.

[JanTelefon]

In the simulators I have tried in Sweden the flaps go up and down with the landing gear.

[microvax]

So we have a deploy landing gear to pull ridicoulous instant turns situation.

 

So whats the max gear deployment speed ? :D

[Hook47]

So we have a deploy landing gear to pull ridicoulous instant turns situation.

 

So whats the max gear deployment speed ? :D

 

No maximum deployment speed, just a remain attached speed :D

[El Hadji]

I may be wrong, but 500m seems too optimistic for a split s. :D

 

According to several different sources this maneuver was practised a lot by Viggen pilots. The delta wing design is one reason why it is possible to achieve according to the same sources.

 

I would be very surprised if the Swedish pilot mentioned a lower altitude than what was the case. Chances are that he was even lower. You can say a lot about us Swedes, but bragging about achievements isn't something that is common practice. Unless your name is Zlatan Ibrahimovic of course.:D

[JaNk0]

... You can say a lot about us Swedes, but bragging about achievements isn't something that is common practice. Unless your name is Zlatan Ibrahimovic of course.:D

 

I can second that statement :megalol:

[grunf]

According to several different sources this maneuver was practised a lot by Viggen pilots. The delta wing design is one reason why it is possible to achieve according to the same sources.

500m split s will be the first thing I'll do in Viggen :D. So far the only plane I could do it with is the Mustang. :D

 

I would be very surprised if the Swedish pilot mentioned a lower altitude than what was the case. Chances are that he was even lower. You can say a lot about us Swedes, but bragging about achievements isn't something that is common practice. Unless your name is Zlatan Ibrahimovic of course.:D

Respect to the Swedes. :thumbup:

[renhanxue]

So we have a deploy landing gear to pull ridicoulous instant turns situation.

 

So whats the max gear deployment speed ? :D

 

There's an electro-mechanical safety interlock that prevents moving the gear lever to the deployed position at >620 km/h IAS or M 0.65. You can override this, though, by pulling the lever out and past the stop. The SFI doesn't explicitly state Vne with gear out, though (at least not in the parts we have access to).

Edited June 25, 2016 by renhanxue

[MBot]

Question for the experts on Swedish missiles: Do you think the Rb 04E anti-ship missile would have been able to hit a large hovercraft moving at 70 kts (Aist class)?

[microvax]

There's an electro-mechanical safety interlock that prevents moving the gear lever to the deployed position at >620 km/h IAS or M 0.65. You can override this, though, by pulling the lever out and past the stop. The SFI doesn't explicitly state Vne with gear out, though (at least not in the parts we have access to).

 

I guess thats sufficient anyway, since the 7.5g limit.

[Jediteo]

Question for the experts on Swedish missiles: Do you think the Rb 04E anti-ship missile would have been able to hit a large hovercraft moving at 70 kts (Aist class)?

 

70 kts is pushing it, but if it is within the radar search envelope and it is targeted by the missile, it should home in and track just fine, provided it has enough kinetic energy left.

Edited June 25, 2016 by Jediteo

[mattebubben]

Question for the experts on Swedish missiles: Do you think the Rb 04E anti-ship missile would have been able to hit a large hovercraft moving at 70 kts (Aist class)?

 

And ontop of the RB 04E you also have the More advanced RBS 15 Anti ship missile which i think would have even less trouble.

 

and you might be able to use the RB75T (AGM-65 with the heavy warhead)

though that would demand getting closer.

(where as the RB 04E and RBS 15 could both do it BVR)

 

It mostly depends on angles though.

 

For example if the missile was either going head on or in chase it would be no problem.

 

If it was side to side it would be a trickier shot atleast for the RB 04E and RB75T but i still think it would be very possible as most landing craft where within its duties.

(70 knost might be to fast for a early AGM-65 to get a good intercept but i dont know)

 

But as sated if it passed infront of the RB04s Seeker and it locked on it should be able to cope with the speed of the target if it still has enough energy to maneuver (so depending on the range it was launched from)

 

But the Later RBS 15 should have no problems even against fast moving landing craft.

 

But Depending on the range / target aspect angle some pilot skill might come into play as you might have to give some slight lead to a target moving at such speed.

 

Since you cant designate a target for the missile before launch.

 

You simply launch towards where you want it to look for targets

(RBS 15 is more advanced and can be told where to go and can be given waypoints for a route)

 

So for a longer range Launch against a Ship moving at higher speed you might have to give slight lead to ensure its still within the seekers search zone when missile gets close enough to detect the target.

[MBot]

70 kts is pushing it, but if it is within the radar search envelope and it is targeted by the missile, it should home in and track just fine, provided it has enough kinetic energy left.

 

Thanks, good to know.

 

The threat of Soviet hovercraft looks to have been quite scary for Sweden. The Baltic fleet had enough hovercraft assault capacity land a mechanized battalion or a regiment of pure infantry on many parts of Sweden in a single lift of two hours. With such a short time to react, a response with a concentrated air strike would have been impossible. Only ready ground alert aircraft could probably reach such a hovercraft assault in time, if at all. And considering that it would most likely have happened at night, its good to know that the Viggen could at least depend on its sole radar guided missile.

 

Hoping that we will eventually have such targets for our Viggen :)

Edited June 25, 2016 by MBot

[MBot]

and you might be able to use the RB75T (AGM-65 with the heavy warhead)

 

Consider that any amphibious crossing would most probably have been made at night, which rules out the Rb 75 with the TV seeker. Even with illumination bombs, the TV Maverick might not work at night (I remember reading that the TV Mavericks were troublesome to lock on even in sub optimal daylight conditions). The Rb 05 plus illumination bombs might even be the better solution at night.

[ReggiePerrin]

Just spotted this thread, who do I send my money to for this, do they take kidneys and/or the first born child?

[mattebubben]

Just spotted this thread, who do I send my money to for this, do they take kidneys and/or the first born child?

 

Ask cobra.

 

He might need a child sacrifice for the gods.

 

Maby thats what they have been waiting for before an announcement / release.

 

They need to appease the gods to ensure good omens.

 

Everybody must give up a child (preferably a first born but everybody is free to pick your least favorite child) for a blood sacrifice to Odin!

 

And then we will finally have our Viggen!!!.

 

Hail to Odin! the All Father!

Edited June 25, 2016 by mattebubben