AussieGhost789 Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 You're not annoying and your concern is ours. To be honest, we don't want to report something to ED until we are pretty sure of what is happening. This is my finding after firing two missiles at a low flying target and watching the missile trajectory in TacView. I saw both of them impact the ground in front of the target aircraft and since they had the range, the only explanation left is that their intercept solution was below ground level. Remember that you don't aim at where the target is, but at where it is going to be. I was under the impression that this was how all A-A missiles worked, in that they did not consider terrain. The missile will fly the intercept path, irrespective of terrain. That's how they all seem to work in the sim now, and that's how I understood they were supposed to work. It's one of the ways of defeating a missile, driving it into the ground. 1 [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
TomCatMucDe Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 I should have done more research on this aircraft before pre-purchase. That's on me...not blaming anyone. I was hoping for an aircraft that could add another dimension to missions......like SEAD for instance. This Mirage isn't adding anything from my point of view. I would love to have a NATO SEAD aircraft. I'm looking forward to the day when there is a western, AFM aircraft with a fully clickable cockpit that is on a par with the current DCS Eagle or Flanker models. Forgive me for being a downer....it's my weepy time of the month. Alright, these are your preferences and nobody can discuss them, however the Mirage adds an important aspect to DCS. It is currently the only fully simulated true dogfighter in game. Im afraid it will remain the only one until the rlease of the F18C we don't know when.
Brisse Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 It is currently the only fully simulated true dogfighter in game. That is so far from the truth, but I guess you are talking about a specific time period? If we look at all time periods I can count five or six fully simulated dogfighters, depending on if you count the MiG-21bis or not.
Zeus67 Posted December 10, 2015 Author Posted December 10, 2015 Please don't derail the thread. jcback is having second thoughts and let's leave the issue there. Don't make claims for us that we are not making at all. Thank you "Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." "The three most dangerous things in the world are a programmer with a soldering iron, a hardware type with a program patch and a user with an idea."
sedenion Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 Can someone do a comparison chart (range and speed tables for exemple) between Super 530D , R-27R and AIM-7, according current DCS modelisation of these missiles ?
Bacab Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 Can someone do a comparison chart (range and speed tables for exemple) between Super 530D , R-27R and AIM-7, according current DCS modelisation of these missiles ? What kind of measures do you expect ?
Brisse Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 Can someone do a comparison chart (range and speed tables for exemple) between Super 530D , R-27R and AIM-7, according current DCS modelisation of these missiles ? Impossible, because the 530D doesn't exist in any of the public versions of DCS yet.
Zeus67 Posted December 10, 2015 Author Posted December 10, 2015 I was under the impression that this was how all A-A missiles worked, in that they did not consider terrain. The missile will fly the intercept path, irrespective of terrain. That's how they all seem to work in the sim now, and that's how I understood they were supposed to work. It's one of the ways of defeating a missile, driving it into the ground. Thanks, so it seems that they are working as intended on the intercept path. "Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." "The three most dangerous things in the world are a programmer with a soldering iron, a hardware type with a program patch and a user with an idea."
sedenion Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 (edited) What kind of measures do you expect ? Ranges by altitude and target aspect, max speed by altitude, seeker efficiency... something that can help us to adopt a strategy if we are facing Su-27, Mig-29 and F-15C... something to see what is our chances in those scenarios... I dismiss the R-27ER, R-77 and AIM-120 because these missiles clearly outclass the Super 530D... Edited December 10, 2015 by sedenion
Bacab Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 Ranges by altitude and target aspect, max speed by altitude, seeker efficiency... something that can help us to adopt a strategy if we are facing Su-27, Mig-29 and F-15C... something to see what is our chances in those scenarios... I dismiss the R-27ER, R-77 and AIM-120 because these missiles clearly outclass the Super 530D... Indeed it is no small request to evaluate those parameters, it would need hundreds of run to be valid and consistent.
Conroy Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 Ok, so....team play is a MUST flying the Mirage. About missile iusse, this must be checked and reported during the beta testing, so ED could fix it in the future if needed. Personally i really can't wait for this Mirage, please don't postpone the release date.
il_corleone Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 Really thank you for this info Zeus67! One question, how easily a radar lock can be broken? I mean, after launching your 530D, how easily the enemy can break your lock, and with what maneuver you can easily break it?
Zeus67 Posted December 10, 2015 Author Posted December 10, 2015 (edited) Really thank you for this info Zeus67! One question, how easily a radar lock can be broken? I mean, after launching your 530D, how easily the enemy can break your lock, and with what maneuver you can easily break it? That is so random that I cannot reply. You have a good lock, every seems okay and then the lock just vanish from the screen and the radar resets back to RWS and it takes a complete sweep for it to get the target back. I hope you can help me find the circumstances surrounding a lost radar lock so I can check if it is a bug in the aircraft or it is something in the environment. I cannot say the probability either. I guess that is something we will find out in beta testing. But I think that it is something to do with the "gimbal limits" in the antenna. The target must be flying under the beam and the antenna cannot follow. As I said, more testing is needed and the following information is required: Range when radar lock was lost. Aircraft Pitch and heading. Target azimuth, speed, heading and altitude (you can get those values in the top of the radar screen when a contact is locked). Edited December 10, 2015 by Zeus67 "Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." "The three most dangerous things in the world are a programmer with a soldering iron, a hardware type with a program patch and a user with an idea."
il_corleone Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 That is so random that I cannot reply. You have a good lock, every seems okay and then the lock just vanish from the screen and the radar resets back to RWS and it takes a complete sweep for it to get the target back. I hope you can help me find the circumstances surrounding a lost radar lock so I can check if it is a bug in the aircraft or it is something in the environment. Thank you for the fast answer! I tougth you guys had a Math algorithm for circustances that a lock can be broken, like the distance, height and the size of the target. I Will be doing tests when the module is released and I will post them if I can help you to make a more realistic behaviour if needed, you will have better info than us on that Radar
ec-swr Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 Ok, so....team play is a MUST flying the Mirage. About missile iusse, this must be checked and reported during the beta testing, so ED could fix it in the future if needed. Personally i really can't wait for this Mirage, please don't postpone the release date. +1 ¿any idea of release date? ¿tomorrow? :D [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC].youtube
TomCatMucDe Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 That is so random that I cannot reply. You have a good lock, every seems okay and then the lock just vanish from the screen and the radar resets back to RWS and it takes a complete sweep for it to get the target back. I hope you can help me find the circumstances surrounding a lost radar lock so I can check if it is a bug in the aircraft or it is something in the environment. I cannot say the probability either. I guess that is something we will find out in beta testing. But I think that it is something to do with the "gimbal limits" in the antenna. The target must be flying under the beam and the antenna cannot follow. As I said, more testing is needed and the following information is required: Range when radar lock was lost. Aircraft Pitch and heading. Target azimuth, speed, heading and altitude (you can get those values in the top of the radar screen when a contact is locked). i think the community here apreciates your openess and the direct exchange with you. I hope we will all commit to reporting bugs or glitches when we get our hands on the beta. I will personally try to do my best. The beta is for testing before the joy :)
will- Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 Thank you for the fast answer! I tougth you guys had a Math algorithm for circustances that a lock can be broken, like the distance, height and the size of the target. I Will be doing tests when the module is released and I will post them if I can help you to make a more realistic behaviour if needed, you will have better info than us on that Radar Hopefully these will be done in single player as multiplayer adds even more variables. Intel i9-9900K 32GB DDR4, RTX 2080tiftw3, Windows 10, 1tb 970 M2, TM Warthog, 4k 144hz HDR g-sync.
il_corleone Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 Hopefully these will be done in single player as multiplayer adds even more variables. I will be doing both if I can, but expect singeplayer only :thumbup: I hope I can help and also give some light to those waiting for some ranges!
il_corleone Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 Another question Zeus67, how does the Radar behave against Heli targets? can we use the 530D?
Zeus67 Posted December 10, 2015 Author Posted December 10, 2015 Another question Zeus67, how does the Radar behave against Heli targets? can we use the 530D? O yes, you can. But remember that if your target floods the air around it with chaff, there is a high probability of a miss. Currently the seeker is too weak against ECM. It is something we will ask ED to solve but probably won't be ready for when beta comes out. "Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." "The three most dangerous things in the world are a programmer with a soldering iron, a hardware type with a program patch and a user with an idea."
il_corleone Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 (edited) O yes, you can. But remember that if your target floods the air around it with chaff, there is a high probability of a miss. Currently the seeker is too weak against ECM. It is something we will ask ED to solve but probably won't be ready for when beta comes out. Thank you! I`m sure things will get fixed in a short amount of time, your dedication and communication with the community ( I made 3 questions today, and all were answered :book: )It will give faith from other customers and will encourage people to buy and trust on RAZBAM, also the community will love to help you guys! Can`t wait to the release! :) You can count on us for test things! This beauty is waiting for us! Edited December 10, 2015 by il_corleone
jojo Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 Can someone do a comparison chart (range and speed tables for exemple) between Super 530D , R-27R and AIM-7, according current DCS modelisation of these missiles ? Do you have it for R-27R and AIM-7M ? :D Mirage fanatic ! I7-7700K/ MSI RTX3080/ RAM 64 Go/ SSD / TM Hornet stick-Virpil WarBRD + Virpil CM3 Throttle + MFG Crosswind + Reverb G2. Flickr gallery: https://www.flickr.com/gp/71068385@N02/728Hbi
Paganus Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 I wouldn't worry too much about BVR at this point. You can't count on a hit outside of 10 miles with any missile in the game currently, when against a fighter. The 530D will be a good bomber buster. Like in the 21, when dealing with fighters it is often best to carry heaters and go for the merge. All missiles in the game currently can be spoofed into the ground. Air to air and surface to air. This is in the game engine. Radar locks break a lot in the game. Countermeasures, beaming, notching, even taking an extreme AoA can do it. Sincere thanks to the team for the way you're communicating with us. Looking forward to shooting Ramsey down from my M2000C real soon. :megalol:
VTJS17_Fire Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 But remember that if your target floods the air around it with chaff, there is a high probability of a miss. Currently the seeker is too weak against ECM. It is something we will ask ED to solve but probably won't be ready for when beta comes out. Hi Zeus, you wrote, that the AI deployed a lot of chaff to brake the lock of the missile. But a semi-aktiv seeker doesn't have an own lock, he only follows the reflection of the radar reflection of the platforms radar lock. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semi-active_radar_homing#/media/File:Missile_homing.jpg This would mean, that the AI broke the radar lock of the Mirage with chaff. DCS didn't support this feature until now. In DCS, you can't brake a radar lock with chaff. So, is this a new feature or is there a bug? Second to that, you only mentioned the platforms altitude to reach the top speed of the Super 530D. Since FC 3, the platforms speed also helps to increase the missiles speed. Is this feature also available for the Mirage and its missiles? Best regards, Fire Hardware: Intel i5 4670K | Zalman NPS9900MAX | GeIL 16GB @1333MHz | Asrock Z97 Pro4 | Sapphire Radeon R9 380X Nitro | Samsung SSDs 840 series 120GB & 250 GB | Samsung HD204UI 2TB | be quiet! Pure Power 530W | Aerocool RS-9 Devil Red | Samsung SyncMaster SA350 24" + ASUS VE198S 19" | Saitek X52 | TrackIR 5 | Thrustmaster MFD Cougar | Speedlink Darksky LED | Razor Diamondback | Razor X-Mat Control | SoundBlaster Tactic 3D Rage ### Software: Windows 10 Pro 64Bit [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
Brisse Posted December 10, 2015 Posted December 10, 2015 Second to that, you only mentioned the platforms altitude to reach the top speed of the Super 530D. Since FC 3, the platforms speed also helps to increase the missiles speed. Is this feature also available for the Mirage and its missiles? I'll chime in and try to answer that. Missiles in DCS are using an advanced flight model. They are not scripted to reach a certain fixed speed or anything like that. The missile has weight, drag, lift and thrust etc... and the physical forces are simulated in real time. Under these circumstances the answer to your question is obviously YES, the speed of the launch platform affects the missile in a manner that is realistic. It has to follow the laws of physics.
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