[KNOWN] Spotting with 4K, Monitor size vs Resolution

[imacken]

Look at the 2 screenshots. The first is with labels on and you can see the 2 bandits. The second is at the same time but switching labels off. Can you see the planes?

Both the images are with FULL ZOOM as well!

They are only a few miles away as the labels are showing the aircraft names.

I know it's a topic that has been discussed many times, but if it wasn't for labels, I would never be able to see any aircraft on a 4K display until they are about 3-4 miles away.

[SharpeXB]

I can see far away aircraft on a 4K screen before they even begin to generate labels. Sometimes at up to about 15 miles.

[33-DFTC]

I share imacken's problem too and all the simmer I know using a 4K display on DCS have the same experience.

 

Would you share with us your secret please ? Imacken shares two screenshots of the same situation with and without labels, it's pretty obvious the planes are not visible with the labels turned off.

 

Can you share with us screenshots of a similar situation where you can spot planes without labels at 15nm on a 4K display ? You're using the native resolution display in game, right ?

[imacken]

I can see far away aircraft on a 4K screen before they even begin to generate labels. Sometimes at up to about 15 miles.

 

Yes, as 33-DFTC says, please share your secret if you are running at native res!

[Random]

Same issue.My guess is that its not just the pixel being tiny but also contrast and some "bleed" from adjacent pixels masking it too. Only solution I can think of is going for a bigger monitor! But that is expensive

 

Ran in 1080 the other day and literally LOL'd at how easy it was to track a viggen leaving my airfield!

[Canada_Moose]

Sharpe and Zhukov have super human vision apparently.

 

I have 20/18 vision, fly in the real world and have no problem spotting other aircraft in the sky above or below me.

 

In DCS half the time I can’t spot an aircraft that’s supposedly right in front of me.

 

Apparently I’m just a “gamer” that needs to look better. :(

 

I have resorted to unashamedly using dot labels

Edited March 17, 2019 by Canada_Moose

[caponi]

I can see far away aircraft on a 4K screen before they even begin to generate labels. Sometimes at up to about 15 miles.

 

your secret may be FULL-HD @ 4k Monitor ...

in this case it is true, but the quallity is terrible

 

look at my big monitor and it is very difficult to spot enemies

but it looks amazing :)

[LeCuvier]

I believe that I have a pretty good monitor (not 4K though) but I'd be happy if I could spot fighter-size bandits 5 nm away. Without labels I'd have no chance to survive.

[j-tk]

It's the same on a 1440p/144 monitor, really noticeable with the F-14 module.

[SirJ]

since a few updates it got noticeable better IMO. 1440p/60...waaay easier to spot anything...no use of any mods...

[SharpeXB]

ok here are Su-27s visible at 13 miles, from a native UHD screenshot

[imacken]

I honestly don’t know what to make of that. These dots could be labels dots, but if they are not, and they really are at 13nm, then you are a magician. You are the only person on these forums that is experiencing that afaics.

Just to repeat what I and almost everyone else says, I cannot see any aircraft at greater than 5nm at 4K res. Even ED have admitted that this is an issue and are spending a lot of time looking into spotting on different hardware.

[draconus]

I honestly don’t know what to make of that. These dots could be labels dots, but if they are not, and they really are at 13nm, then you are a magician. You are the only person on these forums that is experiencing that afaics.

Just to repeat what I and almost everyone else says, I cannot see any aircraft at greater than 5nm at 4K res. Even ED have admitted that this is an issue and are spending a lot of time looking into spotting on different hardware.

Show your graphics settings and nvcpl - if set any FXAA or whatever.

Also your OP attachments are not full res - why?

Edited March 18, 2019 by draconus

[imacken]

Show your graphics settings and nvcpl - if set any FXAA or whatever.

Also your OP attachments are not full res - why?

The attachments are just crops of the original grabs for clarity's sake - if you'll excuse the pun!

Settings attached, not that I think the issue has anything to do with that. It's across the board - with one exception! - with users having all different settings in 4K.

Edited March 18, 2019 by imacken

[SharpeXB]

I honestly don’t know what to make of that. These dots could be labels dots, but if they are not, and they really are at 13nm, then you are a magician.

Labels are set to off. DCS settings are as posted. My Nvidia CP settings are at global default. This is the Constant Peg II Instant Action mission for the M-2000 over Nevada.

If I reduce resolution to 1080p and set AA off, those specks are actually appearing bigger and can be seen at about 30 miles. So yes, 4K is hampered compared to 1080p because it seems there is some single pixel trick used for far away aircraft that appears larger if the pixels are larger.

But I don’t believe what I’m getting in 4K is unrealistic. You should struggle to see another fighter sized aircraft at that range. Certainly seeing them at 30 miles is unrealistic.

[imacken]

Seeing at more than 5nm is impossible without labels for me and others in 4K.

As I said, you are a magician! Glad everything is good for you.

[SharpeXB]

Seeing at more than 5nm is impossible without labels for me and others in 4K.

As I said, you are a magician! Glad everything is good for you.

At 5nm the other aircraft are rendering as more than a single pixel so this 1 pixel “sprite” business shouldn’t be in effect. At that range 4K is showing very clear profiles of other aircraft to me.

You’re running the same graphics card as I am. I’m using the latest Nvidia driver but those have never made a difference for me in DCS

Try setting any overrides in Nvidia CP to the global default. When sending 2160p/60 to your monitor the other important component is cables. I’m using a DisplayPort 1.2. Some HDMI cables are not up to the task including the one LG shipped with my monitor.

[imacken]

Thanks, but I am already using a DisplayPort 1.2 cable.

Somehow, you are seeing stuff that others aren't. Difficult to explain.

[SharpeXB]

Show your graphics settings and nvcpl - if set any FXAA or whatever.

Also your OP attachments are not full res - why?

Here are the NCP settings, all default except Vsync

 

The forum upload must compress the screenshots, the zip here has the full size images

I don’t know how to attach those full size images on the forum.

Screen_190317_153424.zip

Edited March 19, 2019 by SharpeXB

[draconus]

The attachments are just crops of the original grabs for clarity's sake - if you'll excuse the pun!

I find it counterproductive when discussing tiny dots.

You can use any upload web site either specificaly for pics or not like https://uploadfiles.io/

 

 

Can you two try and check the same mission using the same module to see the possible difference?

[imacken]

I find it counterproductive when discussing tiny dots.

You can use any upload web site either specificaly for pics or not like https://uploadfiles.io/

It is easier when discussing tiny dots to zoom in to the area concerned. This highlights the issue with tiny dots more clearly rather than having to search around a 4K image.

I don't understand what the reference to an upload site is about, sorry.

[draconus]

I don't understand what the reference to an upload site is about, sorry.

It's because of SharpeXB's suspicion of attachment compressing here, so you can upload elsewhere without compression ruining your efforts to show something useful.

[imacken]

It's because of SharpeXB's suspicion of attachment compressing here, so you can upload elsewhere without compression ruining your efforts to show something useful.

Here are the full png files.

 

http://igmack.co.uk/Screen_190315_214027.png

 

http://igmack.co.uk/Screen_190315_214031.png

[viper2097]

On both pictures, I can see both F5 at the same size.

The difference is the small dot or ^ in front of the "F5" label which probably looks like the plane when watching with labels.

 

Btw, F5 are so tiny and don't produce any smoke. They are really hard to spot.

We had here some real F5 flying around before our army transit to the Eurofighter. The F5 hasw been a pain in the a** to spot, while the EF is quite easy to spot...

Edited March 19, 2019 by viper2097

[draconus]

Here are the full png files.

 

http://igmack.co.uk/Screen_190315_214027.png

 

http://igmack.co.uk/Screen_190315_214031.png

Thx, now we can see them. They're tiny, alright, but it's not a single pixel either. That concludes that there's nothing wrong with your gfx/system/DCS and there's no magic in SharpeXB config.

 

 

 

F-5 are small and hard to spot, period. I suggest using the radar to find (at one of the steerpoints, Angels 15) and lock them. I tried the same mission yesterday but I have yet to find a good way of cooperation with Jester - he doesn't help much right now so I change seats back and forth, which is a pain :)