ED, please consider releasing the Viper in EA with functional AIFF

[Santi871]

One of the biggest issues with the Hornet's early EA period was the lack of IFF symbology (and then simplified, barely-functional HUD symbology). It was really detrimental to the experience, especially in multiplayer, an led to much confusion and frustration.

 

AIFF isn't simple in the Viper, but it would be a shame if the Hornet's experience is repeated. Hopefully it's considered a high priority item for EA release. Fingers crossed.

[comie1]

Santi871 makes a great suggestion. Hopefully the significance of the impact IFF had on user experience hasn't slipped past

[backspace340]

+1 not having IFF was the worst bit of the Hornet launch, and having the IFF logic / process switch during development has confused a big chunk of the playerbase at each step and caused untold thousands of friendly fire incidents. Even if its a 'cheat' underneath, please give us an IFF placeholder that matches the end product.

[Oceandar]

100 % Absolutely agree with this. I don't wanna be one of those bad boys shooting down friendly lol.

[djswich]

100 % Absolutely agree with this

[kaoqumba]

In full agreement! The basic IFF available can solve many problems. On this basis, if a target pod and laser guided bomb with basic functions can be added. Then its EA stage, playability will be very, very high.

[kaoqumba]

If there were any. Then it will become an all-weather multi-purpose fighter as soon as it is released!

[Krippz]

100% agree.

[CarbonFox]

This. I was honestly going to wait on picking up the F-16 until it has its IFF completed in full.

[F16wannabe]

Chaff flare!

[Nealius]

Ways to IFF without IFF:

 

1. Position and aspect relative to the FLOT

 

2. aspect on you

 

3. airspeed

 

4. AWACS declare/picture/bogey dope

 

5. understanding of other packages operating in the AO

 

6. assigned altitude blocks for friendly flights

 

7. Datalink

 

8. RWR

 

9. Being on the radios and calling buddy spike/buddy lock

Edited May 19, 2019 by Nealius

[Santi871]

If everyone flying were on SRS and did proper comms IFF wouldn't be that much of an issue....

 

You are clearly unfamiliar with pvp servers if you think locking everyone and having 15 people respond buddyspike or having to have everyone reporting their positions 24/7 is a viable replacement for IFF.

[Nealius]

Clearly I just prefer more structured gameplay than jumping into a disorganized melee.

[backspace340]

Ways to IFF without IFF:

 

1. Position and aspect relative to the FLOT

 

2. aspect on you

 

3. airspeed

 

4. AWACS declare/picture/bogey dope

 

5. understanding of other packages operating in the AO

 

6. assigned altitude blocks for friendly flights

 

7. Datalink

 

8. RWR

 

9. Being on the radios and calling buddy spike/buddy lock

 

1. Not useful for aircraft in a furball / chainsaw

 

2. Ditto

 

3. Airspeed just tells you if it's a fighter or not

 

4. AWACS couldn't declare on the Hornet at release, don't expect it to be able to for the F-16. Also, not every mission has an AWACS.

 

5. Not all MP scenarios have organised packages, it's a free for all, you're never going to understand what 30 other people are doing in a 24/7 battle without hours of briefings which don't happen. Also, most servers put fog of war on the F10 map, so you can't see friendlies or enemies, some you can't even see yourself.

 

6. Doesn't happen in the vast majority of MP scenarios - the phrase herding cats comes to mind.

 

7. There isn't going to be datalink on EA release.

 

8. Not all scenarios have different aircraft on different sides.

 

9. Did you play the Hornet on release day in MP servers? It was ridiculous, 30 people shouting raygun, 30 buddyspikes, pretty much every second or two. It was chaos.

 

Not to mention that in a PVP environment, while you're reading the tea leaves trying to discern if they're friendly or not, they know that you're not friendly and have probably already fired. If ED don't want the F-16 to be restricted to SP / WVR fighting, we need IFF on release.

[Nealius]

Years ago when I did fly online PvP in a different sim that had zero IFF functionality at all, as well as aircraft of the same type on both sides, we rarely ever had blue-on-blue incidents because we used those 9 points that I listed. Saying you can't do the same in DCS is just an excuse.

 

And just to counter your counters to points 1 and 2, this is why you don't engage furballs already happening unless you have comms with the other friendly in the fray. And you sure as hell don't Fox 3 into a furball because of the whole CAF thing....

 

I mean, it seems wasteful to take the most realistic combat flight sim available to us and treat it like an arcade game...but if that floats your boat then whatever.

Edited May 19, 2019 by Nealius

[backspace340]

Years ago when I did fly online PvP in a different sim that had zero IFF functionality at all, as well as aircraft of the same type on both sides, we rarely ever had blue-on-blue incidents because we used those 9 points that I listed. Saying you can't do the same in DCS is just an excuse.

 

It had datalink showing you the position of every friendly fighter, point 7. in your list is a pretty massive one. If the F-16 launches with datalink in DCS, we can do without IFF - knowing where your friendlies are is as good as an IFF system for most scenarios. It's not an excuse because you're not comparing like for like between that game without an IFF and what we'll get here - we also won't have a TGP for long range VID at launch and might not have AWACS declare (if there's even an AWACS/EWR still alive in the mission).

[Santi871]

Clearly I just prefer more structured gameplay than jumping into a disorganized melee.

 

Good for you, but several pvp servers usually have >15 people flying on each side and wouldn't be able to (and didn't) handle the comms clutter it causes.

[Hadwell]

Years ago when I did fly online PvP in a different sim that had zero IFF functionality at all, as well as aircraft of the same type on both sides, we rarely ever had blue-on-blue incidents because we used those 9 points that I listed. Saying you can't do the same in DCS is just an excuse.

 

And just to counter your counters to points 1 and 2, this is why you don't engage furballs already happening unless you have comms with the other friendly in the fray. And you sure as hell don't Fox 3 into a furball because of the whole CAF thing....

 

I mean, it seems wasteful to take the most realistic combat flight sim available to us and treat it like an arcade game...but if that floats your boat then whatever.

 

the problem is, with DCS, when all your friends in F-18s and F-15's and F-14's and hell even mig-21's... can tell instantly without any radio calls or anything... and you can't... who's gonna be the one getting teamkills?

 

yeah if you're in a 109 or a mig-19 or something where you're close enough to see the whites of the enemys eyes before you can kill him... you're right.

Edited May 19, 2019 by Hadwell

[Hatefury]

I'm a little surprised that this has been moved to the wish list section. Still from a online and especially PvP point of view it seems odd that the aim is to have pretty much all the AA radar functionality working at launch but then not have any sort of IFF.

 

I know that the relative size of the online community is smaller than the single player one, but from a multiplayer point of view I feel some sort of IFF at launch is needed.

 

Hornets without IFF resulted in a lot of friendly fire, even with the cheat IFF that was put in there was still friendly fire as it was a bit buggy.

 

And yes I respect friendly fire is the fault of the person firing the weapon, it doesn't really help you when you get killed on the receiving end of it.

[HWasp]

Huge swarms of new F-16 pilots with TWS and Amraams but no IFF at all... No, I don't see how this could ever cause any problems. :)

 

Seriously, some kind of placeholder IFF symbol anywhere, like a little F on the edge of the HUD or any other convenient solution will not disturb the immersion of 99% of the users, but will make the plane potentially usable for MP day one!

I will certainly avoid flying on the same team with the F-16s until some kind of IFF solution is implemented.

[Tomsk]

Seriously, some kind of placeholder IFF symbol anywhere, like a little F on the edge of the HUD or any other convenient solution will not disturb the immersion of 99% of the users, but will make the plane potentially usable for MP day one!

 

I would definitely be in favour of something like this. Just a very "simplified" IFF in the first instance so that when you STT or TWS lock a target it shows a symbol on the HUD or something if it's friendly. This should be very easy to implement, is enough to avoid the carnage, and is not so unrealistic that it's unbalanced. Indeed many modules never really have more than this anyway (looking at you Mirage 2000). This can then be replaced with a better simulation of IFF a bit further down the line.

[mattag08]

Just VID :^)

[Airhunter]

Guys, AIFF is not just IFF, it's a more advanced version. I'm sure we'll get a simple form of IFF on release.

[BIGNEWY]

Hi all

 

the team is working hard on the viper to bring it to us for early access.

 

Basic IFF is on the list, hopefully it will be at release or soon after.

 

Thanks

[Oceandar]

Hi all

 

the team is working hard on the viper to bring it to us for early access.

 

Basic IFF is on the list, hopefully it will be at release or soon after.

 

Thanks

Thats good news. Thank you sir :)