Rift S vs Pimax 5k (For owners of both)

[falcon_120]

Hey guys,

 

Pimax has made it to amazon in EU and that means that i'm really considering it now.

 

Can any owners of both devices comment me on their honest opinion now that the rift S is out and has been tested?

I'm particularly interested in hearing how you balance the great FoV against the supposedly better claritt in the Rift S (at least marginally)

 

Thanks!

PD: I did ask this topic before but was previously to the Rift S being commercially available so i think now is the perfect time to ask again.

 

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[falcon_120]

Thanks a lot for the detailed review! Much appreciated

 

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[hansangb]

I would agree that P5K+ requires more tinkering to get it running than Rift. It's a KS project and it's still not 100% fully baked.

 

I compare it to when DK2 was problematic at times.

 

But I gave away my CV1 because I couldn't handle the smaller FoV. So for me, it made a huge impact.

[Gman109]

No sense repeating what Augustus has said, I agree. I've only had the Pimax for 6 weeks (5k), and the Rift S since May 25. I've not really used my Pimax since getting the Rift S, and I sold my Odyssey+ (2 of them) in the last couple days, as there is no going back to them for me. The Rift S is the best option until the Reverb is checked out iMO.

 

 

The Pimax is also a giant PITA to get set up, the software is finicky, tinkering is a very kind way to put it, hah. Rift S is a snap, and Oculus really know what they're doing in terms of games/drivers/etc. I'll likely keep the one Rift S I have right now, and get a couple Reverbs and sell the Pimax, so long as the Reverbs check out as advertised.

[wormeaten]

Pimax is highly overpriced. 700$ for naked HMD without proper headcount, no audio at all, no controllers in that price, no positional tracking only 3DoF and in the end bad support and lowest finish quality comparing to other VR.

 

With Rift S for 400$, you got everything.

If you want light house Index is the much better choice again then Pimax and it is cheaper. Index HMD only is cost 500$ but with 150$ worth head-mount with perfect audio.

When you take everything in consideration you have to be stupid to go for Pimax after that much choice you have today on disposal.

[bies]

Pimax is highly overpriced. If you want light house Index is the much better choice again then Pimax and it is cheaper. Index HMD only is cost 500$ but with 150$ worth head-mount with perfect audio.

When you take everything in consideration you have to be stupid to go for Pimax after that much choice you have today on disposal.

 

I don't have Pimax or Index but on paper Pimax is just better than Index, it has bigger FoV and higher resolution so it's normal to be more expensive than Index. Index has better refresh rate but this is useless in DCS anyway.

 

We can tell for sure only when Index will be available.

[dburne]

As anyone who has played around with a few of these VR headsets is aware, paper stats and end user experience are two totally different things. Remember that the ceiling is set by what one 2080 Ti card can deliver. On paper, the Pimax 5K is a killer. In real life, where you only have one 2080 Ti to power it, the Pimax 5K is not up to the lower resolution Rift S.

 

Very true.

The paper stats on the Rift S really does not reflect the much better increase in clarity one actually gets from the Rift S.

I was very pleasantly surprised.

[wormeaten]

I don't have Pimax or Index but on paper Pimax is just better than Index, it has bigger FoV and higher resolution so it's normal to be more expensive than Index. Index has better refresh rate but this is useless in DCS anyway.

 

We can tell for sure only when Index will be available.

 

 

FOV is the only advantage for Pimax and it is not 200 as "paper" say but 170 max and in most of the sims, you will not be able to run it properly.

 

In any other aspect, competitors are better.

 

 

One of misleading from Pimax is exactly this 200FOV because they measure FOV diagonal. Who is measuring FOV diagonal? FOV is only horizontal and vertical everything else is misleading.

 

I don't want to debate about Pimax. Go ahead, buy your self Pimax and enjoy in great controllers, flawless audio, comfort, 6DoF tracking and great customer support in next 6 months, if... for only miserable 1500$ what will cost you to reach 1000$ full package of Index in the same level. and to get the same level of performances you will be able to play the only 125FOV on Pimax vs 130FOV on Index.

So go ahead and enjoy your Pimax.

[Jolk]

Hello

 

Owning CV1, Pimax 5k+ and Rift S, I confirm, Rift S is by far the best experience.

Pimax FOV is impressive, but that’s it.

Moving from CV1 to S is a great improvement

 

PS: Who wants a 5k+ ... good price ????

[etherbattx]

As anyone who has played around with a few of these VR headsets is aware, paper stats and end user experience are two totally different things.

 

and some of us learned this the hard way... purchased on specs and a bit ticked off afterwards. lol.

[Rosebud47]

It´s simple with the Pimax:

With regular 110° FOV headsets you move and glance in the Cockpit, like you would drive your car with a diving goggle on your head. With the Pimax you move and glance in the cockpit, like you are used to, when driving your car.

[wormeaten]

Moving from CV1 to S is a great improvement

 

Even on paper specs suggesting not much of the difference.

[dburne]

Even on paper specs suggesting not much of the difference.

 

Man can not live on specs alone...

[Wicked.-]

Having owned both now I would take the S all day over Pimax. The Pimax has the potential to be great and the 170 FOV is awesome but that's about it. You have to give up so much both in image quality and frame rate I end up with graphics worse than the CV1. Way worse. I've barely flown in the week I've had the Pimax. Instead I've spent my flying hours dicking with Pitools, Steam and SteamVR trying to get an acceptable experience.

[Waxer]

Even on paper specs suggesting not much of the difference.

 

You are looking at the wrong specs: The most important spec difference - by far - is the switch from Pentile AMOLED to RGB LCD. (Another underestimated aspect of these headsets is the adjustability of the screens to differing head size and eye positions. This can make a major contribution to effective FOV.)

 

The Rift S is an exercise in optimisation effectively: a collection of incremental changes, and best choices of existing technology alongside with the one major change above (full RGB not Pentile matrix).

 

I just recently had a go at the Rift S in Microsoft's store at Westfield mall in LAs Century City. Check out the demo if you get the chance. (They don't offer as DCS demo, but you can still get the idea of how good the image quality, comfort and tracking are like). Personally I am unsure whether to get the Rift S, or wait for the HP Reverb or Steam Value Index.

Edited June 8, 2019 by Milou

[ram0506]

I've barely flown in the week I've had the Pimax. Instead I've spent my flying hours dicking with Pitools, Steam and SteamVR trying to get an acceptable experience.

 

 

Yep, I made exactly the same experience. Since I own the Rift S I`m back into flight siming. I would clearly vote for the Rift S.

[dburne]

Yep, I made exactly the same experience. Since I own the Rift S I`m back into flight siming. I would clearly vote for the Rift S.

 

:thumbup:

[funkyfranky]

Yep, I made exactly the same experience. Since I own the Rift S I`m back into flight siming. I would clearly vote for the Rift S.

Same here. After the HTC Vive, CV1 and Pimax 5k+, the Rift S gave me the best VR experience so far.

 

Pimax is not a bad headset. But the software is just not there yet, IMHO.

 

Of course, I also want even more clarity and FOV. But with the Rift S I can use most the other nice eye candy DCS offers at high settings. With my system (8700k+2080Ti) this gives me very good FPS and a smooth experience with the S. Not sure how people will cope with higher resolution headsets that come out but we'll see. At the moment, the S looks like a very good compromise given the limits of the available hardware (CPU/GPU).

[dburne]

Same here. After the HTC Vive, CV1 and Pimax 5k+, the Rift S gave me the best VR experience so far.

 

Pimax is not a bad headset. But the software is just not there yet, IMHO.

 

Of course, I also want even more clarity and FOV. But with the Rift S I can use most the other nice eye candy DCS offers at high settings. With my system (8700k+2080Ti) this gives me very good FPS and a smooth experience with the S. Not sure how people will cope with higher resolution headsets that come out but we'll see. At the moment, the S looks like a very good compromise given the limits of the available hardware (CPU/GPU).

 

Very happy with my Rift S , image clarity and performance especially.

[bumblebomb]

off topic, is "two GPUs fueling VR" a thing? would this work driver-only so any game would benefit from it? *cough* DCS' single GPU engine*cough*.

[dburne]

off topic, is "two GPUs fueling VR" a thing? would this work driver-only so any game would benefit from it? *cough* DCS' single GPU engine*cough*.

 

No.

[Snake122]

Somewhat of a necro post but wanted to get my thoughts on this subject after my first impressions of a few hours in the Pimax 5k+ when the Rift S was my old headset.

 

Aurelius sums this up well so I'm going to use his post and discuss how I agree and disagree.

I own both the Rift S and the Pimax 5K. I was allowed to use the Rift S about nine weeks before it was released commercially (on May 21st) and the Pimax I have had for about three months. Before I go into details I will say that I prefer the Rift S overall.

 

Why you might ask if the Pimax has the wider FOV and higher resolution? The answer is several fold, but can be summed up by saying that the Rift S is a much more polished experience that just flat out works with DCS World. When I want to fly, I simply put the Rift S on my head, the Oculus dashboard fires up (the Cliff House), I then launch DCS and within 30 seconds I am ready to fly. With the Pimax, you have to fool with their not fully baked Pimax Tools and the entire experience feels much more like a technology demonstrator than a commercial product.

One of the reasons why I was looking to try the Pimax is that Oculus Home has been nothing but trouble for me since almost the begining on 3 different systems. The majority of boots into Win10 with either an RTX2060 or GTX1080Ti would at least result in a headset not connected error. A powered USB hub reduced these somewhat and on one of my motherboards I was able to update the right Intel USB 3.0drivers that nearly eliminated it, then I upgraded to my latest system and I have had far worse issues. Not only do I have device not connected errors now, I have had to repair/reinstall Oculus Home multiple times due to it getting in a Oculus service must be restarted loop. Simply, Oculus Home unfortunately is not a "just works" experience for me.

 

On the Pimax side, the initial setup was a pain but now that everything is setup and I remember to turn on the headset before I open PiTool, it works. I know that PiTool has been updated a lot since this thread was started. Between PiTool and SteamVR there are a lot of options and diagnostics available, so if you like to tweak things Pimax gives you more access to these. If not, it's a larger hassle.

 

No VR headset out currently supports Nvidia or ATI multi graphics card support (a' la Nvidia SLI). (DCS is also not coded for multi gpu VR support) This means any VR headset is limited to the headroom set by a single RTX 2080 Ti card (or a Titan card if you are rich). I use EVGA 2080 Ti cards in my home rig and the Rift S gives the better performance overall. I can set everything close to max with a pixel density of 2.2 and pull upper 20 to low 30s frame rates with the Rift S and 2080 Ti.[/Quote]On my system in my signature and settings maybe slightly more leaning towards quality but IMO fairly balanced, there were many times my FPS be at the refresh rate of the Rift S even with a 1080Ti. Of course, the Pimax 5k+ has a big hit, but I was surprised just how much. Framerates have been about halved from the Rift S on the same settings. Turning them down somewhat have me basically where I would call them flyable, but the big FPS hit planes like the F-16 are noticably less smooth. Also one thing to keep in mind is that you start to fill all 11GB of VRAM if you turn up MSAA, texture sizes, etc. You can't buy a RTX2080Ti to solve that problem, have to wait for the RTX30xx. I can't imagine how a Pimax 8k could run DCS right now and be satisfied with the performance on any system.

 

Because the Pimax requires pushing so many more pixels, you have to lower the settings a great deal to reach the same frame rates. If you are a DCS player who does not care much about ground scenery (and many don't), then the Pimax delivers an 'okay' experience in the air. Once you fly close to the ground, things drop precipitously. With the Pimax 5K and most settings close to max, I have to set pixel density close to 1.3 or 1.2 to reach the low 30s frame rates. For some flyers, that does not bother them at all. Also, the higher resolution is misleading. If you do a careful (and correct) mathematical calculation accounting for the pixels per degree (of field of view), you will find that the Rift S over 110 degrees is very similar to the Pimax 5K over 170 degrees. The resolutions are not that different actually, it is the wider field of view that the Pimax 5K offers. So naturally, you would think, "Excellent, I will have better situational awareness in a dogfight with the Pimax 5K."[/Quote]For me, the double edge sword here is evident, down low is one of the place where the FOV of the Pimax shines. The PPI of the Pimax is slightly lower than the Rift S and has a more noticeable screen door effect(although the SDE is not as bad as the Oculus CV1). So if you are ok with the lower end of settings like PD 1.2 and MSAA at 2x, I think on my system this is playable but definitely not as smooth as Rift S.

 

I can say now, after using both headsets in numerous online dogfights, the Rift S actually makes it slightly easier to keep the enemy sighted than the Pimax 5K. I know that will come as a surprise to many but the much larger field of view of the Pimax does not increase SA because the pixel density must be set lower for the same rate with the Pimax 5K. The Pimax 5K, even with their PiTools software tuned, still has a large amount of judder and warping. It makes it very hard to commit to say a rolling scissors with the Pimax. The Rift S is just easier to use when trying to keep eyes on a bandit.[/Quote]This is probably where I disagree the most. The only thing I find somewhat easier with the Rift S in dogfighting is visual ID and maybe somewhat maintaining a padlock at Ionger range. But I've found so far in post merge BFM/ACM that I can pick up other planes more often with the larger FOV. In fact, a rolling scissors seems easier to detect when it will start and easier to maintain until hopefully you squirt the bandit out front.

 

Visual experiences are ultimately a subjective experience but for me, I would rather fly with the Rift S at 110 deg FOV and with mostly max settings at a pixel density of 2.2 than with a 170 deg FOV with a pixel density of 1.3. The overall experience is just better. That is the easiest way to say it. The Pimax 5K also requires a great deal of tinkering with Pi Tools and in game. It is a far longer and more involved process than using the Rift S.[/Quote]I have never felt the need to crank up the Rift S to 2.2, but I'll try it when I go back to compare the Rift S. Pre-VR, I ran triple monitors so I obviously have a preference for larger FOVs and one of the few downsides of the Rift S (beside for Oculus Home being a large time sink getting it to run). I will say that when you a task focused usually you don't notice the smaller FOV, but for "gee-wiz" moments and times when you should be fighting the tunnel vision (the non-G induced task saturated kind), the larger FOV has came in handy.

 

The Rift S also has, thanks to Facebook and Oculus market share, an already established and fairly well developed ecosystem of apps, previews, VR movies and games. The Pimax 5K can now access that but once again, there are many glitches, troubleshooting and visual errors that do not take place with the Rift S. For example, I just downloaded theBlu (a VR ocean experience) to try with my small son. We fired it up with the Rift S and it worked perfectly with no problems. When we tried the Pimax 5K, we ran into immediate show stopping glitches. 45 minutes later I had the glitches straightened out but my son was already waiting at the door to practice soccer with me instead. That is just one example among numerous similar experiences I have had.

 

If I only had the money to buy one or the other, I would choose the Rift S for DCS VR flying.

Again, I'm slightly biased since Oculus Home has been problematic and I really don't do much outside of DCS in VR right now, but so far I've been surprised how much I like PiTool and SteamVR One other thing is that the inside out tracking and included controllers of the Rift S is nice. I used the controllers a decent amount, they are usable but I am trying out my Leap Motion and Im on the PointCtrl list so that somewhat speaks to how well they work. But I did just find out that you could turn knobs with the mini-sticks after I put the Rift S away for awhile to try the Pimax. On the Pimax side, I'm using a single 1.0 lighthouse to get the 6DOF tracking and trying out a trackball and the Leap Motion solutions (VRK and DCLeap) until the PointCtrl.

 

One other thing I'm trying to work through is the large FOV setting is that DCS gets really jaggy when using it. I don't fully understand why this is and AA settings don't seem to help. It has been reported here before but I haven't been able to find the solution. But the normal 170 FOV is still enough of an upgrade from the Rift S that at least in the FOV department, the Pimax delivered.

 

 

I'll update when I go back to the Rift S in awhile to get a comparison then. But I definitely see Aurelius's points and wish I wasn't such a fan of big FOV and I could get Oculus Home to cooperate.

Edited May 29, 2020 by Snake122