replay track fix: not for f14?

[draconus]

The file is there with all the data but broken so that you cannot replay it exactly. Make local recordings (like Shadowplay) instead until fixed. The most reliable tracks come from MP play on external server.

[Ilias6ty7]

Thanks. Like I said we‘re not sure atm whether the problem is ED only or us or a combination of both. We were fairly certain that it was an ED issue previously as we did what we could from our side to implement it, yet it didn’t work, and similar to other modules. With the recent fix we need to reinvestigate however, if there is something else we can do from our side to make it work. In general tracks are ED side. We’ll keep looking. Thank you for your patience.

Appreciate the focus being put into this. It is a shame the Replay Tracks are corrupted for the F-14. I suspect that the Jester interactions may have something to do with this. I have also noticed that when looking from the outside, the Jester menu appears and then remains there. I'd like to see a resolution because, as with the other aircraft, I love flying them, saving the Track, and then composing videos. I'm unable to repeat this with the F-14 at the moment, sadly.

[IronMike]

One workaround for videos at the moment is to use server tracks. That is where you replay the server track, instead of the client track, if you host it as a server for yourself. Naturally, this will not include cockpit shots.

 

Unfortunately we are not closer to the issue. Btw, just because only the F14 has it, it does not mean it is F14 side, and also this is not a blame game, but trying to figure out where the standard implementation, as envisioned by ED for us 3rd party devs, and which we did, does fail. One of the huge issues with the F-14 in connection to tracks seems to be Multicrew and Jester. It is in this regard unlike any other aircraft in DCS and thus has "special requirements" which are probably not considered in the implementation of tracks in DCS. So you see, it is not something we can fix alone, by ourselves. If we could, we would have done so ages ago, we know how important tracks are for you guys. But when the DCS track system was created, no one thought of multicrew, let alone an AI RIO to fly with you, etc...

 

We will continue to look for a solution, rest assured. We won't give up so easily. But it is also possible that it will take a bigger effort from both ED and us than we might wish. At this point, I really cannot say, and I am very sorry to disappoint you guys in this. We'll keep on keeping on though.

[Bearfoot]

One workaround for videos at the moment is to use server tracks. That is where you replay the server track, instead of the client track, if you host it as a server for yourself. Naturally, this will not include cockpit shots.

 

Unfortunately we are not closer to the issue. Btw, just because only the F14 has it, it does not mean it is F14 side, and also this is not a blame game, but trying to figure out where the standard implementation, as envisioned by ED for us 3rd party devs, and which we did, does fail. One of the huge issues with the F-14 in connection to tracks seems to be Multicrew and Jester. It is in this regard unlike any other aircraft in DCS and thus has "special requirements" which are probably not considered in the implementation of tracks in DCS. So you see, it is not something we can fix alone, by ourselves. If we could, we would have done so ages ago, we know how important tracks are for you guys. But when the DCS track system was created, no one thought of multicrew, let alone an AI RIO to fly with you, etc...

 

We will continue to look for a solution, rest assured. We won't give up so easily. But it is also possible that it will take a bigger effort from both ED and us than we might wish. At this point, I really cannot say, and I am very sorry to disappoint you guys in this. We'll keep on keeping on though.

 

Mike,

 

Does this workaround still work? I installed the DCS server on the same machine (as per the instructions here: https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?p=4383977#post4383977), launch a client DCS instance and joined the MP mission. Simple 1v1 over Caucasus. With the first "1" being me and the other "1" being AI (various others, from F-16 to F-18 to Mirage etc.) No ships, nothing else. Not ONE single track replayed correctly. Out of multiple runs. Is there something about the server needed to be on a different machine for this work?

[IronMike]

Mike,

 

Does this workaround still work? I installed the DCS server on the same machine (as per the instructions here: https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?p=4383977#post4383977), launch a client DCS instance and joined the MP mission. Simple 1v1 over Caucasus. With the first "1" being me and the other "1" being AI (various others, from F-16 to F-18 to Mirage etc.) No ships, nothing else. Not ONE single track replayed correctly. Out of multiple runs. Is there something about the server needed to be on a different machine for this work?

 

 

It is possible that it is quirked when you are your own host from same machine. DCS tends to be quirky in general when host and client are the same, although with a dedicated this shouldn't be the case, but otoh I don't know enough about the netcode to really make an educated guess.

[Nealius]

It is possible that it is quirked when you are your own host from same machine. DCS tends to be quirky in general when host and client are the same, although with a dedicated this shouldn't be the case, but otoh I don't know enough about the netcode to really make an educated guess.

 

I agree with that. To get Tomcat footage I run a second instance of DCS on the same machine, but with the lowest graphics settings and in F10 view. I've never had a broken track from that host .trk file. The same is true of other modules that frequently have broken tracks.

 

Which reminds me, I have seen graphics settings mess with replay tracks. I haven't tested with the Tomcat, but a few updates back, setting shadows to Medium or higher would break F-5E replays. If you set shadows to Low, Flat, or Off, the replay track would run fine.

[eatthis]

I agree with that. To get Tomcat footage I run a second instance of DCS on the same machine, but with the lowest graphics settings and in F10 view. I've never had a broken track from that host .trk file. The same is true of other modules that frequently have broken tracks.

 

Which reminds me, I have seen graphics settings mess with replay tracks. I haven't tested with the Tomcat, but a few updates back, setting shadows to Medium or higher would break F-5E replays. If you set shadows to Low, Flat, or Off, the replay track would run fine.

 

how do you run it twice?

[irfanahmed1979]

On 6/28/2020 at 5:53 PM, Nealius said:

 

I agree with that. To get Tomcat footage I run a second instance of DCS on the same machine, but with the lowest graphics settings and in F10 view. I've never had a broken track from that host .trk file. The same is true of other modules that frequently have broken tracks.

 

Which reminds me, I have seen graphics settings mess with replay tracks. I haven't tested with the Tomcat, but a few updates back, setting shadows to Medium or higher would break F-5E replays. If you set shadows to Low, Flat, or Off, the replay track would run fine.

 

You mean, you can run 2 client instances of DCS at the same time? Could you share your PC specs? I'm interested in this if it will really fix the tracks issue. I had a corrupted track file today (for a MP session) with the unofficial A-4E community mod.

Edited July 14, 2021 by irfanahmed1979
Needed to add more clarity

[Reax178]

2 hours ago, irfanahmed1979 said:

 

You mean, you can run 2 client instances of DCS at the same time? Could you share your PC specs? I'm interested in this if it will really fix the tracks issue. I had a corrupted track file today (for a MP session) with the unofficial A-4E community mod.

 

I don't think you can, what i do is i run a dedicated server and one dcs instance to play on the same dedicated server on the same machine. I tried on a gtx 1060 3gb, i5 7500, 16gb ram and ssd (for both DCS client and dedicated client) and it works well, i didn't notice any fps drops. However i tried to put the dedicated server on a HDD and it takes way too much time to load obviously, so i'd recommand installing both versions on a SSD.

 

And indeed, using server sided tracks is way better than client sided tracks, i flew several times in the F14, even had one mid air collision without destroying the aircraft, and all that was perfectly represented when playing the track.

 

 

[irfanahmed1979]

40 minutes ago, Reax178 said:

I don't think you can, what i do is i run a dedicated server and one dcs instance to play on the same dedicated server on the same machine. I tried on a gtx 1060 3gb, i5 7500, 16gb ram and ssd (for both DCS client and dedicated client) and it works well, i didn't notice any fps drops. However i tried to put the dedicated server on a HDD and it takes way too much time to load obviously, so i'd recommand installing both versions on a SSD.

 

And indeed, using server sided tracks is way better than client sided tracks, i flew several times in the F14, even had one mid air collision without destroying the aircraft, and all that was perfectly represented when playing the track.

 

 

Thank you for your prompt reply. Do you have any link to a tutorial on how to setup a dedicated server? I'm a total noob at this. Also if playing multiplayer, will both instances (client and dedicated server) join the same multiplayer server? I mean can this fix be used for multiplayer tracks also?

Edited July 14, 2021 by irfanahmed1979

[Reax178]

1 hour ago, irfanahmed1979 said:

Thank you for your prompt reply. Do you have any link to a tutorial on how to setup a dedicated server? I'm a total noob at this. Also if playing multiplayer, will both instances (client and dedicated server) join the same multiplayer server? I mean can this fix be used for multiplayer tracks also?

 

This is the video i used to help myself : 

All you need is to download the dedicated server from ED like you would with DCS. Then you first need to launch the dedicated server, connect to your account, then there will be only a white screen (which is normal since the dedicated server doesn't have any graphics). Then launch "Local Web GUI" which is downloaded with the dedicated server, a browser page will show upand then it's pretty straightforward. After you're done with your server settings, launch the server from the browser page, then when it's done, just connect to your server by typing the IP / or by writting your server name on the multipler search bar.

 

As for multiplayer, unfortunately, i don't think you could join a server with the dedicated server since it's meant to create a server, not to join one. However, some multiplayer servers post their track replay after each session on their discord, you could use that and it should work nicely since it's the same thing as using your own server and playing its tracks. But it depends on the server, you cannot get the server-sided tracks yourself if it's not your server.

[irfanahmed1979]

Ok, thanks a lot

[Langrenus]

It's almost the end of 2022 and the Heatblur F-14 saved tracks still do not replay correctly. For one thing, it is not saved as an interactive replay. It doesn't allow for changing views, or for TrackIR interaction during the replay, and all my Jester interactions are played back on top of the replay. Oh, yes, and the aircraft invariably does a suicidal nosedive into the ground when you get within spitting distance of your destination. The replays are inaccurate, unreliable, and unusable for training/learning purposes, unless you are looking for what not to do. C'mon Heatblur, please, let's get it together already! Four years is way too long so sit on such a glaringly in your face discrepancy!

Edited October 25, 2022 by Langrenus

[lunaticfringe]

3 hours ago, Langrenus said:

It's almost the end of 2022 and the Heatblur F-14 saved tracks still do not replay correctly. For one thing, it is not saved as an interactive replay. It doesn't allow for changing views, or for TrackIR interaction during the replay, and all my Jester interactions are played back on top of the replay. Oh, yes, and the aircraft invariably does a suicidal nosedive into the ground when you get within spitting distance of your destination. The replays are inaccurate, unreliable, and unusable for training/learning purposes, unless you are looking for what not to do. C'mon Heatblur, please, let's get it together already! Four years is way too long so sit on such a glaringly in your face discrepancy!

 

Heatblur doesn't control anything to do with track recording. 

[IronMike]

13 hours ago, Langrenus said:

It's almost the end of 2022 and the Heatblur F-14 saved tracks still do not replay correctly. For one thing, it is not saved as an interactive replay. It doesn't allow for changing views, or for TrackIR interaction during the replay, and all my Jester interactions are played back on top of the replay. Oh, yes, and the aircraft invariably does a suicidal nosedive into the ground when you get within spitting distance of your destination. The replays are inaccurate, unreliable, and unusable for training/learning purposes, unless you are looking for what not to do. C'mon Heatblur, please, let's get it together already! Four years is way too long so sit on such a glaringly in your face discrepancy!

 

The issue is simply how tracks work in DCS. They are not really meant as a replay function - even if used as such. They record all inputs, and then play them back, which helps tracking down bugs. Now, naturally we would like to have them fixed, but multicrew and the Jester menu make it virtually impossible as is, hence the suggestion further above to record server side tracks, by for example hosting a dedicated server for yourself.

It's not really a discrepancy, unfortunately, it is an improbability at best and an impossibility at worst with the current state of affairs, and thus it is highly unlikely that we will dedicate ressources to fixing it, until (and if) the way tracks work is changed (I don't think there is any intention for that atm), or a true replay function gets added to DCS.

Please do not get me wrong, it is as disappointing for us as it is for you, but currently there is not really anything we can do about it. Server tracks are your best bet (and work fine), and also for short tracks it helps to hit ATT Hold within 10 seconds of mission start (which avoids input desync) and not using the Jester menu, though I can see that this is not very useful for general purposes. Our apologies.

[Nealius]

Rather than working on the issue of replay tracks, since server tracks are fairly reliable, I wish ED would focus more on fixing various desync, choppy animations, warping, etc. bugs over multiplayer so then we could use the server replay tracks to get much smoother-looking content, similar to what's possible from single player tracks in other modules.