Ducksen Posted February 11, 2020 Share Posted February 11, 2020 Hey. I really need to ask this painful question here in DCS 2.5 general section. If this is placed wrong, then please move it. With the Modern Air Combat sim/game coming out this fall of 2019 I have some pressing issues. First off, will MAC draw the largest part of the playerbase away from DCS? I am guessing that MAC came about as an idea due to many players wanting to have a piece of the action, but do not want to learn many keybinds. And so illuminating a void between "super silly combat aircraft games that go pew pew" and DCS. Where there are players that do not want to play basic arcade flight games, but more a sim, but not have to read a length manual and spend time training in order to enjoy a sim. I am hoping that MAC only caters for that void and leaves the potential MAC playerbase inspired to go full DCS after a year or so. And I really hope that DCS will look and feel better than MAC in comparison so that the true DCS playerbase might try MAC, but feel that it is lacking and want to gravitate back to DCS as DCS is the best. If it turnes out that MAC has more features and more things set right, due to newer core coding and lessons learned and it is less buggy and smoother, many will stay there and never move on. And the question many have talked about is money. We have paid for a lot of modules, and now all 14 in 1 sim? From what I gathered so far, it is all in a kind of FC3 standard of sim. And many of them are in FC3 today. So that is kind of ok for me. My problem with this is when it becomes a separate sim. Could we have all our full fidelity aircraft migrated to MAC and go there if the game is smoother, newer code and all the players? One of the greatest features in DCS is that there is a collection of sims all in one. I am old enough to remember buying a sim game and instilling it with diskettes and CD's before DVD. Back then I was dreaming about the possibility to merge my sims together and be able to play with all in one sim. Today, and for many years now that has been a reality. I am so thankful for the work Eagle Dynamics has put down into making this an alliance of aircraft sims, where all can bring their module to the sandbox and play together. Now I fear there is a tear in that fabric. Where we now are splitting things up and dividing things. I feels like a divorce, yeah you take halve. I'll keep the high fidelity, you take most of the player base. YES, I am joking, and no I am not that salty about it. However, I am worried for the already niche playerbase in DCS, and hope it will grow with MAC and not shrink. For DCS to grow, then it has to be more attractive than MAC. So MAC can be a true stepping stone to DCS. I would also hope that MAC will be a module pack for DCS where FC3 would finally become obsolete. So future players who have MAC can buy DCS MAC pack for a discount. In any respect having a FC4 that might be called MAC pack in DCS would be welcome. I hope for Eagle Dynamics to come out and officially state the reason for a player to in an example fly the SU27 in MAC and migrate to flying the SU27 in DCS. What would motivate a player to make that migration/upgrade. Why leave MAC for DCS given that they are both a FC3 sim level of that plane. And the SU27 was just an example, not limited to. I guess what I am asking and saying is that I fear that the polarity or flow of players will not go from MAC to DCS, but rather MAC being the centerpiece and in many cases an end station for players. There needs to be some drive to go towards DCS. If not I truly fear the future of DCS World. Where else will DCS get funding? I just hope that my fears are irrational and based on false speculation based on wrong information when it comes to it's future. However, moving all serial codes and all virtual assets to a better platform is always welcome. So if we all in the future migrate over to MAC I am on board! If we stay split, the flow of players must go the right direction. For honestly guys, does it really matter that there is another sim that draws players? Would that not be just like having a multiplayer server where the mission is designed to have only FC3 and SU25T selectable aircraft? The players that go there will be most the same that go to MAC? Maybe? What I mean is that there can not be much difference between joining a rookie server and booting up another sim and joining a server there. I hate the fact that I find myself viewing this to be a good point. I truly believe there is no difference there. So in ending notes, this has gone on for way longer than I was prepared to write today. Hope to hear for Eagle Dynamics in an update addressing the place MAC will have in relation to DCS. I truly think this is needed to put at rest the confusion I and many others are having now. Will I buy Modern Air combat (MAC)? Short answer; Yes! Reason; Hope to see some nice features and mechanics that make for a smoother sim experience. Will I leave DCS?; Short answer; NO! DCS is where I have a lot of assets and will hope to see more features that will keep DCS in the lead as the best Digital Combat Sim for civilians there is. And will hope to see players come in from MAC and get overwhelmingly positive over the great realism that DCS provides over MAC and that gameplay is way better in DCS after all. Thanks for reading this far. I have written this from the heart and as it rolled of my tongue so to speak. I have not read over my text before submitting as I want to keep this from the heart and unplugged. So where does this leave us DCS players? Less players to fly with? Maybe, maybe not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AeriaGloria Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 (edited) If this is about multi player they will be compatible. Seems like that is what you mean by splitting the player base, people you fly with online. You can see in pictures of the dec build on videos like “10 things to know about DCS” modules like “F-86 MAC” and “F-5E MAC.” You know it will be a separate .exe right? Still doesn’t mean they won’t work through the module manager at all or in MP where it has been said it will be up to server owner to include MAC or not I don’t think you have any reason to worry, lessons learned in MAC UI will likely trickle down to DCS soon like everything else, I’m sure the intent is that core game wise they will be very similar or exactly the same, with MAC having better/more aids for beginners and shooting off the bat. Again, I think everything will be fine, we will all be able to MP together, this is not a divorce but poly-amorous relationship:love::love: So many questions have been asked about MAC but the truth is there are no real answers for us until more info comes out closer to release. Also don’t know where you got release in fall 2019, other then being in the past I’m pretty sure that one video they eventually pulled was going for a 2018 fall release Edited February 13, 2020 by AeriaGloria Black Shark Den Squadron Member: We are open to new recruits, click here to check us out or apply to join! https://blacksharkden.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team BIGNEWY Posted February 13, 2020 ED Team Share Posted February 13, 2020 Hi All I can say at the moment is MAC is being worked on and we will share news when we are ready. It will be separate from DCSWorld and will be aimed at users who want to have quick fun and action. Forum rules - DCS Crashing? Try this first - Cleanup and Repair - Discord BIGNEWY#8703 - Youtube - Patch Status Windows 11, NVIDIA MSI RTX 3090, Intel® i9-10900K 3.70GHz, 5.30GHz Turbo, Corsair Hydro Series H150i Pro, 64GB DDR @3200, ASUS ROG Strix Z490-F Gaming, PIMAX Crystal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThorBrasil Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 MAC has to be separated from DCS, as they are games with different proposals. :pilotfly: :joystick: :thumbup: |Motherboard|: Asus TUF Gaming X570-PLUS, |WaterCooler|: Corsair H115i Pro, |CPU|: AMD Ryzen 7 3800X, |RAM|: Corsair Vengeance LPX 32GB 3200MHz DDR4, |SSD|: Kingston A2000 500GB M.2 NVMe, |SSD|: Kingston 2.5´ 480GB UV400 SATA III, |SSHD|: Seagate Híbrido 2TB 7200RPM SATA III, |GPU|: MSI Gaming 980Ti, |Monitor|: LG UltraWide 34UM68, |Joystick 1|: Thrustmaster Hotas Warthog, |Joystick 2|: T.Flight Rudder Pedals, |Head Motion|: TrackIr 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blitze Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 MAC and DCS can compliment each other in many areas. I don't see why they should be completely separate from each other. Fragmenting the player base is not a good idea in a niche market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beppe_goodoldrebel Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 MAC and DCS can compliment each other in many areas. I don't see why they should be completely separate from each other. Fragmenting the player base is not a good idea in a niche market. I bet MAC will be a free (or a least a few bucks ) product casual gamers like other games out there. In that case you have to guarantee a stable and optimized product so Open Beta patches and other modules complexity cant ruin MAC experience. For my view separation can be a win-win situation for both MAC and DCS players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eviscerador Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 I bet MAC will be a free (or a least a few bucks ) product casual gamers like other games out there. In that case you have to guarantee a stable and optimized product so Open Beta patches and other modules complexity cant ruin MAC experience. For my view separation can be a win-win situation for both MAC and DCS players. I'd say it will be marketed with full AAA price of 60 or 70$ something close to the good old sims of the 90s. Plenty of planes to fly, easy to get into missions, some campaigns and air quake multiplayer. Something like the Jane's sim series but without reaching DCS study levels. I'm fine with it to be honest. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harlikwin Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 You mean I won't get to enjoy watching taxiway takeoffs, splatter landings and blatant team killing on the MP servers anymore? Say it aint so? :lol: New hotness: I7 9700k 4.8ghz, 32gb ddr4, 2080ti, :joystick: TM Warthog. TrackIR, HP Reverb (formermly CV1) Old-N-busted: i7 4720HQ ~3.5GHZ, +32GB DDR3 + Nvidia GTX980m (4GB VRAM) :joystick: TM Warthog. TrackIR, Rift CV1 (yes really). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avimimus Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 I bet MAC will be a free (or a least a few bucks ) product casual gamers like other games out there. In that case you have to guarantee a stable and optimized product so Open Beta patches and other modules complexity cant ruin MAC experience. For my view separation can be a win-win situation for both MAC and DCS players. Ah, but it means that FC3 players may not see FC4... we may not get the ability to pick cluster bomb pre-sets on the Su-25 etc. It also means we may not have any pathway towards including 4th generation player-controlled Russian aircraft... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pizzicato Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 I'd say it will be marketed with full AAA price of 60 or 70$ something close to the good old sims of the 90s. Plenty of planes to fly, easy to get into missions, some campaigns and air quake multiplayer. Something like the Jane's sim series but without reaching DCS study levels. I think there's almost zero chance of that. That business model is pretty much dead for niche genres, and ED moved away from it years ago. My guess is that they're chasing the War Thunder crowd - frictionless entry into a lightweight, metagame-driven, free-to-play arcade-like flying game. That's where the money is, and I'd be really surprised if ED didn't go that route. My only real concern is that DCS will gradually fall to the wayside if MAC takes off and becomes the more profitable and easily-serviced experience. We shall see, though. i7-7700K @ 4.9Ghz | 16Gb DDR4 @ 3200Mhz | MSI Z270 Gaming M7 | MSI GeForce GTX 1080ti Gaming X | Win 10 Home | Thrustmaster Warthog | MFG Crosswind pedals | Oculus Rift S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbestinfla Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 I just watched the YouTube video on the new MAC. They even called it "Simulator". It is far from simulation. It's an arcade type game which mirrors the Ace Combat series for XBOX/PS4. That's where the competition will be. DCS World is a piece of art designed, operated and maintained by geniuses which are updated daily. These forums are headed up by remarkable people as well, assisting other newer member/pilots with their knowledge. If you run across anything puzzling, someone is right there with the answer and explanation to guide you. This is Simulation. Take Cap and his Grim Reapers boys. They will take a real life scenario and use DCS to recreate it even down to the temperature and say, wind over deck. 90% of the time their findings are true. Growling Sidewinder is great to watch and learn. Talks about altitudes and the changes that occur with the effects of energy surrounding both plane and missiles. And the tutorials either video or reading ,i.e Chuck's Guides. Hundreds of hours spent just to help folks. I could keep going Sure it can be pricy but like they say, you get what you pay for. Even the new Microsoft/ 2020 coming. DCS will stay on top. Granted they will have more maps but you won't be able to strafe and drop cluster bombs on any bad guys. And it's going to be a XBOX game. I see this as a very expensive sim. In all I feel DCS will stay on top always see this as a very expensive sim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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