The correct procedure to arrive at the initial for a CASE 1?

[CommandT]

Hey folks, I'm no stranger to a CASE 1 recovery or the marshaling stack, but what I wonder is - what is the correct way to come in when you are the only flight inbound? Can you just make your way down to the initial (3nm, 800ft behind the boat) however you like from any direction or do you technically need to enter/ exit the marshaling stack? If so, enter at any angle and exit on downwind straight away? I feel like this was never explained anywhere for a case where no other traffic exists. Cheers!

[Frederf]

It's "however Red Crown, Strike, and Marshall direct you". The CNETRA P-816 radio examples, if that's complete, paint a very simple picture. Drive straight from A to B getting permission on the way. The only real rule I see is get on your holding altitude no later than 10nm. And then direct entry into the five mile pattern from any direction. None of the docs make mention of a direct-to-initial procedure although it might exist. The lowest hold alt is 2000'. Depart point 3 (9 o'clock) when told at a 210 relative to BRC and descent 800' for 3nm initial. Figure 2-4 is helpful.

[CommandT]

It's "however Red Crown, Strike, and Marshall direct you". The CNETRA P-816 radio examples, if that's complete, paint a very simple picture. Drive straight from A to B getting permission on the way. The only real rule I see is get on your holding altitude no later than 10nm. And then direct entry into the five mile pattern from any direction. None of the docs make mention of a direct-to-initial procedure although it might exist. The lowest hold alt is 2000'. Depart point 3 (9 o'clock) when told at a 210 relative to BRC and descent 800' for 3nm initial. Figure 2-4 is helpful.

 

Yeah that's sort of what I figured. Only thing is the comms in DCS don't actually tell you to enter the marshaling stack or exit it. Would be good if they added that!

[sLYFa]

Marshall won't need to give you any instructions during case I. Except for carquals, each squadron has his pre-briefed altitude in the stack and will arrive there at a pre-briefed time (usually just before the next cycle has completely launched). As the deck becomes clear to land on, the aircraft in the lowest pattern will proceed to the initial and the stack will collapse until the whole cycle is recovered. This is all done visually with zero comms between aircraft and boat.

[Nealius]

As I understand it the Navy way is however you please without violating safety or other procedures. I always do at least one circuit in the stack to help set me up. Commence on the reciprocal BRC + 30 (e.g. BRC 090, reciprocal 270, Commence on 300). At 800' AGL 350KCAS, roughly 6nm from the ship, I start a 1.5~1.6G turn, adjusting bank/G to get lined up, and that typically sets me up on Initial perfectly. It only works if the carrier is going 25kts, though. Most mission creators and online servers have the carrier doing something retarded like 11kts and that totally screws up the pattern.

[CommandT]

Marshall won't need to give you any instructions during case I. Except for carquals, each squadron has his pre-briefed altitude in the stack and will arrive there at a pre-briefed time (usually just before the next cycle has completely launched). As the deck becomes clear to land on, the aircraft in the lowest pattern will proceed to the initial and the stack will collapse until the whole cycle is recovered. This is all done visually with zero comms between aircraft and boat.

 

But what if you're the only aircraft inbound? You still join the stack before proceeding to the initial? I mean seems kinda wasteful.

[CommandT]

As I understand it the Navy way is however you please without violating safety or other procedures. I always do at least one circuit in the stack to help set me up. Commence on the reciprocal BRC + 30 (e.g. BRC 090, reciprocal 270, Commence on 300). At 800' AGL 350KCAS, roughly 6nm from the ship, I start a 1.5~1.6G turn, adjusting bank/G to get lined up, and that typically sets me up on Initial perfectly. It only works if the carrier is going 25kts, though. Most mission creators and online servers have the carrier doing something retarded like 11kts and that totally screws up the pattern.

 

Gotcha, thanks!

[sLYFa]

 

But what if you're the only aircraft inbound? You still join the stack before proceeding to the initial? I mean seems kinda wasteful.

 

IRL that would almost never happen. The procedure I outline is used to recover several aircraft as fast as possible without the need for positive radar control. If you are the only aircraft in the air there is of course no need to hold in the stack at all.

[Zeagle]

It only works if the carrier is going 25kts, though. Most mission creators and online servers have the carrier doing something retarded like 11kts and that totally screws up the pattern.

 

+1

[BarTzi]

Most mission creators and online servers have the carrier doing something retarded like 11kts and that totally screws up the pattern.

 

Are you saying most online servers have zero winds?

 

[Nealius]

 

Are you saying most online servers have zero winds?

 

I'm saying most servers don't have the carrier steaming fast enough (11kts is default mission editor speed) and they can't get WoD correct. If the carrier is 11kts then the server would need 15~16kt winds. I've yet to be on a good PvE server that does any of it correctly, and I have to edit the bejeezus out of missions like Through the Inferno.

[draconus]

Commence on the reciprocal BRC + 30 (e.g. BRC 090, reciprocal 270, Commence on 300).

 

That course will take you away from the initial...

[jeff64]

 

That course will take you away from the initial...

 

from the overhead stack, that brings you abeam the IP.

[draconus]

 

from the overhead stack, that brings you abeam the IP.

 

Ok, you're right. I can't remember why I had a picture of commencing at 150 (instead of 210) with a tight turn into BRC in my mind.

[Nealius]

Yeah it's the exact same as the P-816 wording, but my small brain doesn't work well with BRC - 210 so I simplified it to BRC reciprocal + 30 (given the manual's example is a due-North BRC).