Dora versus Anton

[sublime]

Hello..

I don't own either.  I do really like FW190s and have been eyeing the modules.  I greatly prefer A-3/A-5 Anton's.  I really do like Dora's better than 190 A8s.  However when flying Dora's I always feel a lil 'cheap' knowing they were hardly ever prevalent or even close.  Still my preference would make it seem open and shut.  However Im well aware the D is a much older module so I'm asking the community..

Which module is better?  I know both have pros but is it really someone's preference in plane?  Are both cockpits or flight models equal enough that the newer release of the A8 doesn't matter? Or..?

Thanks

[razo+r]

I'd say flight model wise, they are kind of similar, in terms of fidelity. Both feel good.

 

Graphics wise the D9, is not much older, it received a cockpit texture overhaul, so there's that. Both still have a few bugs and the A8 still not that "ironed out" in terms of cockpit model. But overall still enjoyable and nothing gamebreaking.

 

For the gameplay though, there's a difference and really comes down to preference in my opinion.

 

Do you want to be the fastest and have it "easy" fighting planes? Go for the D9.

 

Do you want to have a good challenge when fighting and also go for ground attacks occasionally? Go for the A8.

 

So at least in my opinion, it depends on what I want. If I feel like I want a challenge or go for ground attacking, the A8 is the better, at least for me. For pure dogfighting though, I feel like the D9 is better.

 

Edited May 11, 2021 by razo+r

[amazingme]

There is no comparison between the two of them. They had different purposes, in real life, with Dora being net superior in terms of performance than Anton, the latter being a bit more resilient due to the air cooled engine, but lacking the performance (very slow acceleration), at least in DCS. I would say, go for Dora, you won't regret it. BUT.. I don't know if the engine issue has been fixed yet, though..

[rkk01]

With me flying...

 

Dora is 100 kph faster and I can kill AI Mustangs 1 on 1

 

Anton speed bleeds to 300kph stall in any BFM, but makes a great jabo 

[Lynchsl62]

For me I enjoy the Anton, I have flown all the warbirds through the P-51 Vegas Tour in Mission Editor and the fastest was the Bf-109K4 followed by the Anton. Keep the energy up and it will manoeuvre down low and is smooth and responsive on the controls, let the energy bleed and it is a dog - though not as bad as the P-47. It has great fire power and is a  challenge. I cannot dogfight at all, but I really enjoy the Anton responsiveness and ruggedness.

 

That said the Dora has the R4M

 

Eric Brown was really impressed with the A4, yes I wish we had the A4 with less weight as I do wish we have the F4/G2, but as the most respecyed test pilot ever, I will always go with Eric Brown

Edited May 11, 2021 by Lynchsl62

[Art-J]

Define "better".

 

Graphics wise - Dora is the second oldest warbird module in DCS and it shows both outside and inside as far as geometry detail and accuracy is concerned. But at least it got a cockpit textures repaint two years ago and that's a very nicely textured pit now. Anton - being second newest warbird, is a masterpiece of 3D geometry both in and out. External textures - same thing (courtesy of talented community skinners competition)... though for some strange reason it has pretty meh and washed out pit textures.

 

Performance wise - Dora is a hot-rod, Anton, with its standard, 1.42-ATA rated engine, is a bit of a dog, unfortunately.

 

Armament - you know the difference from "the other sim" - firepower vs ammo count - subjective matter.

 

External stores - Dora seems to have more of them, but since they're all somewhat buggy / glitchy and underdeveloped DCS-style, don't pay too much attention to them.

 

Edit - one more subjective opinion about Anton. You asked in another thread about how P-47 is presented in "the other sim" and you probably have a general idea now which side made it more competitive. Let's just say, that the same applies to how A-8 is portrayed in both sims.... but in this particular case, the order is exactly the opposite - A-8 in DCS handles like -47 in competing sim, if you know what I mean.

Edited May 11, 2021 by Art-J

[sublime]

I know all about them historically etc. Better is definitely what was meant when you addressed it being the older warbird and the difference in graphics textures.  Is it that bad?  I don't think the p51 looks so bad..

[Art-J]

Well, DCS Dora is not dramatically bad from my point of view (some innacuracies can even be considered an advantage - for example too narrow cover over the dashboard makes forward visibility better than in Anton  ), though I'm personally not that anal about German planes in general.

 

I recall more knowledgeable and rivet-counting enthusiasts of Luftwaffe birds used to point out too thick wing profile, incorrect wing dihedral, too wide machine guns cover, incorrect landing gear legs angle, too flat profile of lower half of radiator cowling etc. Don't get me wrong, it still looks like a Dora, but compared to impressive amount of detail that went into external Anton 3D model, you can tell gfx artists at ED gained a LOT of experience during these 4-5 years between releases of these two planes. Even the Dora in competing sim looks noticeably better, but of course, it relatively new product as well.

 

Lack of good custom skins doesn't help DCS Dora either. There are tons of them available in mods/skins, but all of them were made for game version 1.5.xx and are not quite compatible with 2.5.xx - 2.7 nowadays. The guy who made them doesn't play DCS anymore, unfortunately, so I don't think we'll ever see them updated. Pity, because they were awesome when they worked.

[Jyge]

Depends what you want to do. If you are offline player for Dora there is only the boring stock campaign. For A-8 there is at least the Horrido campaign from Reflected. So far I have only played few missions - I like it very much so far, I already played their Bf-109 campaign which was excellent, so I am putting high hopes on this one too.

 

I am not sure how finished they are. I have not looked at the Dora for a long time, the ground handling at that time was quirky and very doubtful, the A-8 at the current state feels an accurate replication of the accounts I have read about Focke-Wulf, maybe they did some fixes meanwhile on Dora too.

[sublime]

That's a really good point too.  I otherwise probably would really prefer flying the Dora; I've never been a big A8 guy in any sim. The lack of content would be an issue though; I got a few other a/c that suffer that issue. The original p51 campaign is godawful for example.

With what you and art said I doubt I'll go for the D unless I just love flying it that much when it's free to play.  Now I need to perhaps narrow this down between Anton/Kurfurst.  Idk why but I never really liked K4 me109s. If it was a 109 F4 I'd have fallen for it.  

Edited May 17, 2021 by sublime

[Jyge]

Yeah, well I have always been a Bf-109 kind of guy,  I rather have K-4 than none, but I dislike sims preferring to bring out exotic variants like K-4 for the online arenas and completely ignore historical mainstays. I would prefer to see F-4 or G-6 in the game. FW-190 D-9 and A-8 fit the bill better by being more standard late war types, without being too ueber with too much steroids. Nevertheless, the K-4 feels pretty well done and also here you have the excellent campaign from Reflected - would just feel more historical with Gustav. I hope there are more to follow I really would not mind a Dora campaign from them. So if I measure the modules by the time they kept me occupied and happy I am happier with K-4 and A-8 and D-9 was more or less wasted money, although I think I got it dirt cheap in some sales action.

[Mogster]

1 hour ago, Jyge said:

Yeah, well I have always been a Bf-109 kind of guy,  I rather have K-4 than none, but I dislike sims preferring to bring out exotic variants like K-4 for the online arenas and completely ignore historical mainstays. I would prefer to see F-4 or G-6 in the game. FW-190 D-9 and A-8 fit the bill better by being more standard late war types, without being too ueber with too much steroids. Nevertheless, the K-4 feels pretty well done and also here you have the excellent campaign from Reflected - would just feel more historical with Gustav. I hope there are more to follow I really would not mind a Dora campaign from them. So if I measure the modules by the time they kept me occupied and happy I am happier with K-4 and A-8 and D-9 was more or less wasted money, although I think I got it dirt cheap in some sales action.

ED didn’t choose the K4, Ilya Shevchenko (Luthier) chose it for is DCS WW2 Kickstarter. It would be interesting to know what EDs choice of initial WW2 modules would have been.

[grafspee]

Bf-109 K-4 and Fw-190 D-9 were produced in almost identical numbers, 1700 and 1800, so nothing extra ordinary about K-4.

When we get Anton with increased engine rating, thing will project a bit better for anton.

 

Edited May 17, 2021 by grafspee

[MrExplosion]

17 hours ago, grafspee said:

When we get Anton with increased engine rating, thing will project a bit better for anton.

 

Where did you get the information, that we will get the improved engine? 

I am under the impression that ED will never touch the Anton again.

[grafspee]

1 hour ago, MrExplosion said:

 

Where did you get the information, that we will get the improved engine? 

I am under the impression that ED will never touch the Anton again.

ED is constantly improving their modules including free stuff as well, i'm not sure from where you got this impression.

About your question, info was included in newsletter some time ago, about F-8 variant and ED stated that modeling of the increased ratings is ready, probably ED will release this updates with F-8 variant, but this is my only speculation.

ED sold copies of F-18 and F-16 in record numbers, it is obvious that primary focus is directed to complete this modules asap, they for sure don't want to displease so many customers. So expect that other plans may have been deleayed.

Edited May 18, 2021 by grafspee

[amazingme]

1 hour ago, grafspee said:

ED is constantly improving their modules including free stuff as well, i'm not sure from where you got this impression.

About your question, info was included in newsletter some time ago, about F-8 variant and ED stated that modeling of the increased ratings is ready, probably ED will release this updates with F-8 variant, but this is my only speculation.

ED sold copies of F-18 and F-16 in record numbers, it is obvious that primary focus is directed to complete this modules asap, they for sure don't want to displease so many customers. So expect that other plans may have been deleayed.

 

The are different teams modern vs WWII as far as I know..

[grafspee]

6 minutes ago, amazingme said:

The are different teams modern vs WWII as far as I know..

Still nothing in the way to transfer some guys in to modern team

Different teams guarantee that work on modern and ww2 stuff is continuous, but it does not say how fast

Edited May 18, 2021 by grafspee

[MrExplosion]

3 hours ago, grafspee said:

ED is constantly improving their modules including free stuff as well, i'm not sure from where you got this impression.

 

Okay, I won't hold my breath though.

[rkk01]

I’ve been sharing the bulk of my recent flight hours between Dora and Anton and really like both.

 

Anton for A2G and Dora for A2A

 

I have seen some criticism of the Dora sounds... but it sounds good to me! (perhaps updated???)

 

Had a rare fly in the Spitfire IX yesterday and that model is (IMHO) a dog in comparison to either FW or the 109... 

 

Spitfire cockpit sounds are horrid - sampled from my old lawnmower??? No way do they do justice to this iconic aircraft. Cockpit view is also strangely weird