An Open Letter to the Community

[Rikus]

What problem has weekly check of dvd?

 

Greetings

[G3]

weekly dvd check, already perfect.

it has no problem, it's the solution most would prefer to stay with,

and the reason many opt for the hard copy cd/dvd in the first place.:thumbup:

all my fingers, toes, arms and legs are crossed hoping they do not change

the cp on the cd/dvd.

[Dudikoff]

No, only games distributed in DVD, not for the download version. Counter Strike Source has a DVD version and you can't play online in Steam with it if it's cracked, at least, AFAIK.

 

But the point was that most of the people will only play DCS offline and it offers no more protection in that regard than other CP methods. Plus, call me oldfashioned, but I still prefer to have a hardcopy which I can install wherever and whenever I want. And have its big box on the shelf :)

[192nd_Erdem]

But the point was that most of the people will only play DCS offline and it offers no more protection in that regard than other CP methods. Plus, call me oldfashioned, but I still prefer to have a hardcopy which I can install wherever and whenever I want. And have its big box on the shelf :)

 

Steam games can still be sold as retails, so you can have that big box on the shelf still :)

 

Though, singleplayer Steam games can be cracked(but can't be updated or be played MP). No matter what you use it'll get cracked anyway. Steam's best sides are ease of use and the ability to reach your game anywhere.

[muamshai]

Okies, seems that all systems are cracked or have their own problems.

Let's go to old system. Post your pics with your game CD, and the gods will note your name using pen and notepad :D

 

/get me a DCS coat

[jctrnacty]

jctrnacty

 

Best copyprotection is no copyprotection. If people want to pay for it, they wil. If they don´t they will download torrent a crack it.

I want to buy DVD russian version and then US-multi. If it could be possible to send money straight to ED (account number) I would do that.

[ARM505]

Despite the very strong response from ED, they are fortunately placed in that they have a large and loyal following, the vast majority of whom are well aware that in this niche world we live in, piracy can mean the death of our hobby. Hence, whilst I believe ANY copy protection can and will be bypassed, loyal customers will still accept the hassles associated with aggressive CP, and shell out the cash. It's just a pity that the option to give them even more cash (by buying the Russian version) has been made more difficult than it needs to be. I personally believe that a lot of potential sales have been lost, and that's a pity - they need our support.

 

So, as mentioned earlier - they could have gone cheaper on the CP, and been more agreeable to international options for the Russian version - ultimately, I firmly believe that they would have had more money in the bank had they gone this route. IMHO.

[Heatseeker2K3]

Hence, whilst I believe ANY copy protection can and will be bypassed, loyal customers will still accept the hassles associated with aggressive CP, and shell out the cash.

 

But... if the CP fails to protect the product anyway why should we (paying customers) have to bother with reactivations, running out of activations, waiting for more activations..

[Dudikoff]

Steam games can still be sold as retails, so you can have that big box on the shelf still :)

 

But can I install it anywhere and anytime? Even without internet connection or if Steam goes bust?

[Gary]

Despite the very strong response from ED, they are fortunately placed in that they have a large and loyal following, the vast majority of whom are well aware that in this niche world we live in, piracy can mean the death of our hobby. Hence, whilst I believe ANY copy protection can and will be bypassed, loyal customers will still accept the hassles associated with aggressive CP, and shell out the cash. It's just a pity that the option to give them even more cash (by buying the Russian version) has been made more difficult than it needs to be. I personally believe that a lot of potential sales have been lost, and that's a pity - they need our support.

 

So, as mentioned earlier - they could have gone cheaper on the CP, and been more agreeable to international options for the Russian version - ultimately, I firmly believe that they would have had more money in the bank had they gone this route. IMHO.

 

As some on this forum know, I couldnt agree more with your views.

 

A real shame. Its like we want to support these guys and cant..(and yes I know the Russian version wasnt meant for us.!)

[rapid]

But can I install it anywhere and anytime? Even without internet connection or if Steam goes bust?

 

Steam wont go bust.

[192nd_Erdem]

But can I install it anywhere and anytime? Even without internet connection or if Steam goes bust?

 

Well, you can't. But I don't believe any BS fan out here will be playing this game on top of himalayas with a laptop.

 

Also, chances of Steam going bust is far far more slim than ED or Starforce :)

[RedTiger]

The main thing you have to question about Steam, other than whole DRM/CP thing, is whether or not BS through Steam could be modded.

 

I don't know the ins and outs of how Steam works, but games seem to be very heavily integrated within it. When you download and install the game, it is 100% done through Steam. It doesn't create a separate folder under program files like a Windows install would. When you decided to uninstall, you're doing so through Steam. The game's data files, from what I can tell, are mostly in the Steam folder.

 

And this is the strange part because it literally takes like half a second to uninstall even a very large game. No progress bar and very little apparent CPU use like you would see uninstalling with Windows. You click on it, select the option to remove, boom, its done.

 

I'm a dummy when it comes to this type of thing, but this just all seems very 3rd-party unfriendly to me.

[GranCalvo]

The main thing you have to question about Steam, other than whole DRM/CP thing, is whether or not BS through Steam could be modded.

 

I don't know the ins and outs of how Steam works, but games seem to be very heavily integrated within it. When you download and install the game, it is 100% done through Steam. It doesn't create a separate folder under program files like a Windows install would. When you decided to uninstall, you're doing so through Steam. The game's data files, from what I can tell, are mostly in the Steam folder.

 

And this is the strange part because it literally takes like half a second to uninstall even a very large game. No progress bar and very little apparent CPU use like you would see uninstalling with Windows. You click on it, select the option to remove, boom, its done.

 

I'm a dummy when it comes to this type of thing, but this just all seems very 3rd-party unfriendly to me.

 

Steam supports mods 100%.

[th3flyboy]

Steam supports mods 100%.

garrys mod is an excellent example, you create an addons folder, and you install the addons there, and they are in game, no steam replacing them when steam updates it if it doesnt replace core files.

 

furthermore, i have heard that if steam goes bust they will release a no steam patch for all the games.

[Kurtz]

Another mod example would be Mare Nostrum mod for Red Orchestra which recently moved over to STEAM. From an Admin point of view the dedi server updating can be automated. The client end updating is automatated and seemless. I add custom content on a weekly basis to the server, which i also add to a redirect server which offers clients high speed ingame compressed content downloading.

STEAM would have offered a day one worldwide cash injection to the BS devs, minimised piracy(lets face it, people only check the torrent sites after being denied access to a product). The advertising potential through the STEAM community is massive. Games can be played offline. I can install/play any game in my STEAM list in any location i can login. Games can be backed up to HD. There is no downside to STEAM that ive seen. The fact that ED chose a massively unpopular CP that was no doubt going to recieve a community backlash, as well as prompt every hacker in town jumping at the chance to bitch slap starforce, is beyond me.

Everybody knew that DCS Blachshark was going to be a supermodel title, then ED went and put that bit piple on her nose ;)

I love heli sims so i'll still buy it, regardless of SF, but i think this whole situation was forcast and easily avoidable.

 

ps- dont get me wrong ED, I still love you for building Blackshark :) but the CP issue though is a little silly.

Edited November 4, 2008 by Kurtz

[GranCalvo]

Information about steam: http://store.steampowered.com/about/

[Kuky]

Steam wont go bust.

 

I wouldn't be so sure about that... nothing lasts forever :book: Everything comes and goes

[SUBS17]

Most people don't even know that DCS exists so eventhough its been put on torrent so long as the sim is on the shop shelves it'll still sell quite a few copys I reckon. Same thing happened to Alllied Forces it was on torrent but the vast majority of people bought it either online or from shops. In fact its still so popular they are still selling.:thumbup:

[deviletk]

I also think that many "sim clueless persons" that download BS will think its crap. Not crysis graphics enough for game mode and way way way too hard and complex a la naturale. Uninstall follows some days after.

 

They on the other hand that for some weird reason dont know about BS but really want this level of realism, will see it, test it - buy it.

 

Pure speculations on my part.

 

Regards

Alex

[RedTiger]

Steam supports mods 100%.

 

So, lets be specific here. MODMAN will work with my Steam copy of Black Shark? Can you explain how?

 

Realize that if the answer to this is "no" then you are expecting modders to create multiple formats for their mods. Who says everyone will be willing to do that when we have very good pre-established methods of creating and applying these mods?

 

How will Steam handle the third-party developer tools that DCS will have? Will Steam let me use the 3rd-party MiG-21 that someone developes using a non-Steam version? Will there be a Steam version of said tools that are not compatable with the hardcopy version?

 

I'm kinda skeptical of this.

[RedTiger]

I wouldn't be so sure about that... nothing lasts forever :book: Everything comes and goes

 

I would be inclined to agree with you, but I think Steam is becoming the standard way to distribute online now. Direct2Drive is still around, but I get the feeling that Steam is becoming the standard.

 

My prediction; Microsoft will attempt to purchase Steam in the near future.

[SUBS17]

I also think that many "sim clueless persons" that download BS will think its crap. Not crysis graphics enough for game mode and way way way too hard and complex a la naturale. Uninstall follows some days after.

 

They on the other hand that for some weird reason dont know about BS but really want this level of realism, will see it, test it - buy it.

 

Pure speculations on my part.

 

Regards

Alex

 

You're forgetting about all the people who used to own LB2 they'll be up for a sim like BS but I think the Apache would be awesome when its done. :pilotfly:

[rapid]

Me been a LB2 fan who also awaits the add on mod of the Apache.:thumbup:

[Stalintc]

So, lets be specific here. MODMAN will work with my Steam copy of Black Shark? Can you explain how?

 

Realize that if the answer to this is "no" then you are expecting modders to create multiple formats for their mods. Who says everyone will be willing to do that when we have very good pre-established methods of creating and applying these mods?

 

How will Steam handle the third-party developer tools that DCS will have? Will Steam let me use the 3rd-party MiG-21 that someone developes using a non-Steam version? Will there be a Steam version of said tools that are not compatable with the hardcopy version?

 

I'm kinda skeptical of this.

 

It will work in the same way that you mod any other game I would imagine...

 

Dangerous Waters for example uses the exact same LWami mod as the one for the standard retail version, since it is exactly the same file structure once you get to the folder. The method for installing this mod was the same too... apart from pointing the installer to a different directory. Likewise the JSGME mod enabler still works in the same way in a STEAM environment.

 

It is very similar to a person perhaps wanting to install their copy of a game to differently named directory, the mod utilities and other gubbins is still going to work just the same.

 

I cant see there being a problem to be quite honest.

 

Apart from patching games, multiplayer server searching and starting up the game STEAM has nothing to do with your mods.

 

There is nothing to stop you backing up your folders either when you install a mod. personally I back up my entire STEAM folder every so often, so that if my machine goes down all I have to do is drag and drop my STEAM folder back and im laughing!

 

But the point im getting at is that it will still be the same folder structure as any other DCS Black-Shark install apart from being in a STEAM folder, the exe's etc etc will be the same.

 

I hope this is somewhat helpful :)

 

Cheers

 

Stalintc

Edited November 4, 2008 by Stalintc