already in development DLSS is now free

[chroma_aus]

Userbase alienation aside, devs should always strive to keep vendor choice available. I switched to AMD last generation after years of Nvidia, simply because their cards were no longer making sense at the price point. Locking the community into RTX (or any other vendor for that matter) when there are open alternatives available would be shortsighted and quite possibly detrimental to the community in future, when it comes time for upgrades.

[Kappa-131st]

On 10/12/2022 at 11:08 AM, BIGNEWY said:

DLSS has been requested but I have no news to share. The team is very busy with multithreading. 

multithreading AND DLSS will be a game changer to drastically increase FPS and allow to open new opportunities for graphic improvements to allow ED to remain competitive, improve the gaming experience, especially for VR users

[Cab]

On 12/29/2022 at 4:15 AM, Kappa-131st said:

multithreading AND DLSS will be a game changer to drastically increase FPS and allow to open new opportunities for graphic improvements to allow ED to remain competitive, improve the gaming experience, especially for VR users

Apparently ED thought so too. 

[Dragon1-1]

Yup, pity I'm not going to benefit from it, what with still being on 1080Ti. I don't think I'll be upgrading anytime soon, though, my finances aren't looking that good. That said, multithreading alone will likely be of help, and I'm hoping Vulkan will further improve things.

[Qiou87]

On 12/29/2022 at 11:15 AM, Kappa-131st said:

multithreading AND DLSS will be a game changer to drastically increase FPS and allow to open new opportunities for graphic improvements to allow ED to remain competitive, improve the gaming experience, especially for VR users

Will it though? I experienced DLSS in VR in "that other popular civilian flight sim" and I found it very lackluster. Dials became unreadable and overall the picture in my Reverb G2 was very blurry despite using "Quality" preset. The increase in smoothness wasn't all that great either, probably due to CPU bottleneck (even if my 5600X is no slouch). It basically looked like I had lowered the render target of the headset (I know how DLSS works and that is basically what it does, however the machine-learning-assisted upscaling should bring back most of the detail, which did not happen for me).

Fully agree about multithreading to remove CPU bottleneck. However for graphics, although I do enjoy DLSS on pancake as I barely notice a difference visually but see benefits to power usage and/or smoothness, DLSS on VR has so far NOT impressed me.

Edited January 5, 2023 by Qiou87

[Hoirtel]

7 minutes ago, Qiou87 said:

Will it though? I experienced DLSS in VR in "that other popular civilian flight sim" and I found it very lackluster. Dials became unreadable and overall the picture in my Reverb G2 was very blurry despite using "Quality" preset. The increase in smoothness wasn't all that great either, probably due to CPU bottleneck (even if my 5600X is no slouch). It basically looked like I had lowered the render target of the headset (I know how DLSS works and that is basically what it does, however the machine-learning-assisted upscaling should bring back most of the detail, which did not happen for me).

Fully agree about multithreading to remove CPU bottleneck. However for graphics, although I do enjoy DLSS on pancake as I barely notice a difference visually but see benefits to power usage and/or smoothness, DLSS on VR has so far NOT impressed me.

 

I still haven't got around to trying in in the other sim. I had heard it was improved recently (DLSS 2.X) maybe not?. From what I understand DLSS 3.0 is supposed to be better with VR, however its really doing a similar thing to reprojection so I think that as we go forward DLSS will take over as a single VR assistance technology so there will be gains but not much more that we can have now. It might just be that much better quailty, however as a meta user I do think their reprojection is fantastic in DCS now. 

[SharpeXB]

2 hours ago, Hoirtel said:

From what I understand DLSS 3.0 is supposed to be better with VR

DLSS 3.0 does not work with VR

[Rifter]

From the way how DLSS3 is working I doubt that it will ever be a reasonable method for VR. Since DLSS3 is not “looking forward” as all VR reprojection approaches do for the motion estimation, but rather “looks backwards”, DLSS3 is not able to create additional frames without a significant latency increase. Which again is exactly what nobody wants for VR in a flightsim.

[tomcat_driver]

On 10/14/2022 at 3:01 AM, SkateZilla said:

Requested vs Confirmed, 2 different things.

Confirmed 2023!

[MadKreator]

5 hours ago, Qiou87 said:

Will it though? I experienced DLSS in VR in "that other popular civilian flight sim" and I found it very lackluster. Dials became unreadable and overall the picture in my Reverb G2 was very blurry despite using "Quality" preset. The increase in smoothness wasn't all that great either, probably due to CPU bottleneck (even if my 5600X is no slouch). It basically looked like I had lowered the render target of the headset (I know how DLSS works and that is basically what it does, however the machine-learning-assisted upscaling should bring back most of the detail, which did not happen for me).

Fully agree about multithreading to remove CPU bottleneck. However for graphics, although I do enjoy DLSS on pancake as I barely notice a difference visually but see benefits to power usage and/or smoothness, DLSS on VR has so far NOT impressed me.

 

Same here. I found in the other civilian flight sim, that I only play in VR now, that I actually have better performance and better visuals with dlss turned off. In pancake I turn it on and it seems to help, but not so much in VR for me. DCS I only play in pancake because I like seeing all of my controls and helios screen etc. So I’m excited for the feature, even though at this point graphics wise, on my system I don’t really need it.

I am curious, and strictly curious, of whether if dlss was implemented right now,  would there be any benefit. Or if Multicore/ multithreading would need to be implemented first for users to see any real improvement with DLSS or FSR.  @SkateZilla?  Maybe there is too many variables to know for sure 

[SkateZilla]

1 hour ago, MadKreator said:

Same here. I found in the other civilian flight sim, that I only play in VR now, that I actually have better performance and better visuals with dlss turned off. In pancake I turn it on and it seems to help, but not so much in VR for me. DCS I only play in pancake because I like seeing all of my controls and helios screen etc. So I’m excited for the feature, even though at this point graphics wise, on my system I don’t really need it.

I am curious, and strictly curious, of whether if dlss was implemented right now,  would there be any benefit. Or if Multicore/ multithreading would need to be implemented first for users to see any real improvement with DLSS or FSR.  @SkateZilla?  Maybe there is too many variables to know for sure 

DLSS Offers the ability to Render a lower resolution and upsampling/upscaling using the tensor cores that would other wise sit idle on your RTX2K, RTX 3K and RTX4K GPUs.

Multi-threading not withstanding.

As for "the other sim", in VR The Sim's DLSS 3.0 is disabled as it doesnt support VR.

DLSS 3.0 inserts Fake frames to generate smoothness, but increases frame latency, which is something you dont want in VR at all.

1 hour ago, tomcat_driver said:

Confirmed 2023!

Never been happier to eat a foot burger

Edited January 5, 2023 by SkateZilla

[SharpeXB]

It’s worth noting that in many situations you’re CPU limited in DCS and in that case DLSS won’t improve anything. Now DLSS 3.0 will still double your frames in that case because they’re fake frames. 

[SkateZilla]

Just now, SharpeXB said:

It’s worth noting that in many situations you’re CPU limited in DCS and in that case DLSS won’t improve anything. Now DLSS 3.0 will still double your frames in that case because they’re fake frames. 

they are Fake "Adjusted" Frames, the Tensor cores predict adjustments based on motion vector in the the rendering pipe, adjust the frame pixels to show motion and throw that between 2 frames so a 10 px motion shift becomes a 5 px shift, making the motion smoother.

[ColinM9991]

1 minute ago, SharpeXB said:

they’re fake frames. 

Only if Frame Generation is switched on, which requires Hardware Accelerated GPU Scheduling. As far as I understand it, you can still use DLSS3 without HAGS but you won't get Frame generation.

[SkateZilla]

2 minutes ago, ColinM9991 said:

Only if Frame Generation is switched on, which requires Hardware Accelerated GPU Scheduling. As far as I understand it, you can still use DLSS3 without HAGS but you won't get Frame generation.

DLSS 3.0 without frame generation is DLSS 2.0

[ColinM9991]

1 minute ago, SkateZilla said:

DLSS 3.0 without frame generation is DLSS 2.0

Thank you for correcting me there, I've been looking for information on 2 v 3 but it's hard to not stumble across the marketing showcases that skip any technical detail.

Edited January 5, 2023 by ColinM9991

[SharpeXB]

1 minute ago, ColinM9991 said:

Only if Frame Generation is switched on, which requires Hardware Accelerated GPU Scheduling. As far as I understand it, you can still use DLSS3 without HAGS but you won't get Frame generation.

Well I think frame generation is the whole purpose of DLSS 3.0. There would be no point in running it with HAGS off. 

3 minutes ago, SkateZilla said:

they are Fake "Adjusted" Frames, the Tensor cores predict adjustments based on motion vector in the the rendering pipe, adjust the frame pixels to show motion and throw that between 2 frames so a 10 px motion shift becomes a 5 px shift, making the motion smoother.

Right but the point is they aren’t bound by your CPU limit. If you’re limited to 45fps by your CPU you’ll get 90fps with DLSS 3.0. 

2 minutes ago, ColinM9991 said:

Thank you for correcting me there, I've been looking for information on 2 v 3 but it's hard to not stumble across the marketing showcases that skip any technical detail.

 

They’re different. I think 2.0 is upscaling and 3.0 is frame generation. 

[MadKreator]

4 minutes ago, SharpeXB said:

It’s worth noting that in many situations you’re CPU limited in DCS and in that case DLSS won’t improve anything. Now DLSS 3.0 will still double your frames in that case because they’re fake frames. 

I don’t have any issues fps wise since I cap mine at 60 anyway so helios gauges move nice and smooth, allowing me to crank the graphics and such up and let me run ssao and sslr without any noticeable difference. ( averaging in the 85-100 range normally) I can definitely see the cpu binding in almost every scenario. When my fps starts dropping below 60 around heavily active airports or large missions, its for sure not the graphical side lol 

[MadKreator]

@SharpeXB on a quick side inquiry. According to your signature 19-13900k @6.2.. Does it push that with the ASUS Ai overclock? Or do you have the know how to manually tweak that.. Impressive number in my book! Every time I see you post and read your sig, I can feel the dollars falling from my wallet sooner than later lol 

[SharpeXB]

14 minutes ago, MadKreator said:

According to your signature 19-13900k @6.2.. Does it push that with the ASUS Ai overclock?

Yes that’s from the AI overclock feature. 
PS this runs DCS at 4K 120FPS on the display I have

Edited January 5, 2023 by SharpeXB

[SkateZilla]

23 minutes ago, SharpeXB said:

Well I think frame generation is the whole purpose of DLSS 3.0. There would be no point in running it with HAGS off. 

Right but the point is they aren’t bound by your CPU limit. If you’re limited to 45fps by your CPU you’ll get 90fps with DLSS 3.0. 

They’re different. I think 2.0 is upscaling and 3.0 is frame generation. 

if the scene by itself is a stuttering high frame latency scene, adding AFG will only make it worse,

People are getting caught up in the skewed numbers, w/ DLSS 3.0 your getting 300 Fps, wrong, you're getting 1/2 to 1/3 that, and the other frames arent rendered they are motion shifted.
 

So you're basically now seeing nVidia advertise, 300%x Performance increase, in reality it's 50%, and the rest is just using tensor cores to create filler frames in the pipeline to boost the FPS numbers.

Turn off AFG/RT, and look at the benches again, the RTX 40 series isn't as powerful as advertised, they boosted the parts of the GPU that have nothing to do with raw rendering, and used those parts to create artificial frames, to boost the FPS count.

 

i wont be long until reviewers start posting "Native FPS" when Dealing with nVidia Scores

Edited January 5, 2023 by SkateZilla

[MadKreator]

9 minutes ago, SharpeXB said:

Yes that’s from the AI overclock feature. 
PS this runs DCS at 4K 120FPS on the display I have

 

I just told my wife that you cost me another $2000…. She gave you the “ I’m NOT f’ing impressed” look j/k ..that’s awesome. Soon enough I will take the plunge, after I get done paying taxes

[SharpeXB]

1 minute ago, SkateZilla said:

if the scene by itself is a stuttering high frame latency scene, adding AFG will only make it worse,

It certainly adds artifacts. It’s not perfect for sure. I’ve only tried it in that other big civy sim and it seemed kinda ok because that doesn’t really have fast action. For an FPS or racing sim or this? I dunno…

[SharpeXB]

7 minutes ago, MadKreator said:

I just told my wife that you cost me another $2000…. She gave you the “ I’m NOT f’ing impressed” look j/k ..that’s awesome. Soon enough I will take the plunge, after I get done paying taxes

See how this works is I ask her “how much did you spend”? To which she replies “oh I had this coupon so I saved $100”

no.. that wasn’t the question

So by that logic I tell her my PC cost $200 since there was a sale

[Solemn-laugh]

1 hour ago, MadKreator said:

Same here. I found in the other civilian flight sim, that I only play in VR now, that I actually have better performance and better visuals with dlss turned off.

Me too. I occasionally use that other civilian sim (always VR) and found DLSS in VR to be a waste of time for me (factory overclocked 3900 and 5900X) mainly because the text on dials becomes so blurry/smeary. So not assuming it will add much (if anything to VR UNLESS Eagle Dynamics can make a better job of implementing it (no idea if this issue is limited to that other sim, or if DLSS will do this in VR generally).