New F14 Pilot - Takeoff and Landing Questions

[gav88888]

Hi,

 

Just started flying the F14, watched the takeoff and landing tutorials but they don't seem to cover the issue I am having.

 

1 - When taking off from a runway using hot start I use the gear up lever but the wheels don't come up. If I use the gear toggle button they do come up? I also noticed a red light next to the lever is on when using the key but not the lever. Am I missing a step somewhere? I have tried on mil power and afterburner and no difference, I have tried the lever as soon as the wheels leave the ground, or after flying for a bit keeping speed low, but nothing. Also disabling NWS before takeoff, no difference. Also if I use the lever and then the toggle key after it doesn't work, it only works if I use the key only and leave the lever alone.

 

2 - When landing NWS doesnt engage so I can't steer once the speed drops and the rudders no longer work, how do I get this enabled again as im pressing the key but nothing?

 

Thanks

Edited October 5, 2021 by gav88888

[Hiob]

Double check in the controls settings, that you bound those functions to the desired button/switch on your hotas.

Make sure, it's not double bound (except keyboard).

 

It should work just fine then.

[WarbossPetross]

1 час назад, gav88888 сказал:

Hi,

 

Just started flying the F14, watched the takeoff and landing tutorials but they don't seem to cover the issue I am having.

 

1 - When taking off from a runway using hot start I use the gear up lever but the wheels don't come up. If I use the gear toggle button they do come up? I also noticed a red light next to the lever is on when using the key but not the lever. Am I missing a step somewhere? I have tried on mil power and afterburner and no difference, I have tried the lever as soon as the wheels leave the ground, or after flying for a bit keeping speed low, but nothing. Also disabling NWS before takeoff, no difference. Also if I use the lever and then the toggle key after it doesn't work, it only works if I use the key only and leave the lever alone.

 

2 - When landing NWS doesnt engage so I can't steer once the speed drops and the rudders no longer work, how do I get this enabled again as im pressing the key but nothing?

 

Thanks

 

See above. Also the red lights next to the gear and the arrestor hook handles indicate that the gear/hook is in transit. Once it reaches the end position and locks in place the light goes off.

[Spurts]

As to question 2, I never try to engage NWS until I have stopped so I don't know if it can be activated when in motion.  I use differential braking until then. 

[Lt_Jaeger]

It can be engaged anytime the wheels are down and the strut is extended unless you used the emergency system (turn the handle) to lower the gears. If you do this, nws won't work. Not sure if a repair will help, I just re-spawn if it happens on accident. 

[gav88888]

4 hours ago, Hiob said:

Double check in the controls settings, that you bound those functions to the desired button/switch on your hotas.

Make sure, it's not double bound (except keyboard).

 

It should work just fine then.

 

But if I am clicking the lever in cockpit you don’t need a button bound for it? Unless you mean the NWS? For that I have a button bound and it works fine when taxiing to take off, just not landing. 

2 hours ago, Lt_Jaeger said:

It can be engaged anytime the wheels are down and the strut is extended unless you used the emergency system (turn the handle) to lower the gears. If you do this, nws won't work. Not sure if a repair will help, I just re-spawn if it happens on accident. 

I used the button to lower the gear, toggle gear, unless that is the emergency one? 

2 hours ago, Spurts said:

As to question 2, I never try to engage NWS until I have stopped so I don't know if it can be activated when in motion.  I use differential braking until then. 

I tried to engage it whilst rolling to a stop, and also once stopped but didn’t come on. 

[Hiob]

when you engage NWS, does the indicator light illuminate?

Usually, if you click the gear handle with the mouse, it should operate. Only thing I can think of is, that somekind of binding is voiding your action.

But, I'm sorry, I never encountered such a behaviour.

[gav88888]

2 hours ago, Hiob said:

when you engage NWS, does the indicator light illuminate?

Usually, if you click the gear handle with the mouse, it should operate. Only thing I can think of is, that somekind of binding is voiding your action.

But, I'm sorry, I never encountered such a behaviour.

When taxiing for take off the NWS works and I can see the light on, but when landing and slowing down on the runway NWS doesn't work and no light is shown. I am basically stuck on the runway.

 

When clicking on the gear lever it moves up, but the wheels stay down. I have seen loads of videos and the wheels go up after clicking the lever and it goes up, so not sure what I am doing wrong?

 

I will be flying with a mate tonight who has also just got the F14 so I will see if he has the same issues as me.

Edited October 5, 2021 by gav88888

[Hiob]

That's weird, indeed.

Regarding the NWS. Are you in Landing or Take-Off Mode? Maybe NWS is disabled in cruise mode. Master-Arm off?

Regarding the Gear. Only thing left to my imagination is, that the gear is stuck due to overspeeding. I don't know the exact value, but you should retract it as soon as you have a positive climb rate.

 

Have you any caution lights illuminated?

Edited October 5, 2021 by Hiob

[Victory205]

You don’t have the landing gear bypass switch selected by chance?

[Dentedend10]

Also, make sure you actually move the lever, and not turn it. Turning it is the emergency gear activation, so you wanna see the handle move. It happened to me initially.

[IronMike]

It sounds to me as if you are right clicking the gear lever, not left clicking it. When you use right mouse button, it means that you have extended your emergency gear, which can only be repaired if general other damage is present, else you need to respawn/ restart your mission. This is likely also what prevents you to engage NWS after landings. Also, recommend full stick aft deflection, to steer with lateral stick input after landing, helps also with slowing down. Here, check out this (imperfect video), maybe it helps with some aspects. if you do, please read the description, as I recorded it in a rush and corrected all mistakes in the description.
 

 

Edited October 6, 2021 by IronMike

[gav88888]

15 hours ago, Hiob said:

That's weird, indeed.

Regarding the NWS. Are you in Landing or Take-Off Mode? Maybe NWS is disabled in cruise mode. Master-Arm off?

Regarding the Gear. Only thing left to my imagination is, that the gear is stuck due to overspeeding. I don't know the exact value, but you should retract it as soon as you have a positive climb rate.

 

Have you any caution lights illuminated?

 

 

I leave it in TO mode tbh, it gives the heading in the hud, but i can try changing it. I am wondering however if its overly sensitive to my landings. Me and my mate tested it last night, both landing together and he was fine, once he had stopped he enabled NWS and it was fine, me, didn't work, so I did a repair and it worked again. We landed at roughly the same speeds so not sure.

 

Regarding the lever I click it as soon as the wheels leave the ground, it works fine when pressing the key just clicking the lever doesn't, same speeds etc when testing.

13 hours ago, Victory205 said:

You don’t have the landing gear bypass switch selected by chance?

 

Err not a clue, still learning. I will do some googling to find it and check tonight when on.

3 hours ago, Dentedend10 said:

Also, make sure you actually move the lever, and not turn it. Turning it is the emergency gear activation, so you wanna see the handle move. It happened to me initially.

 

I click it with the mouse and I noticed the lever goes up but rotates when it goes up. It doesn't rotate but stay down.

Edited October 6, 2021 by gav88888

[gav88888]

2 hours ago, IronMike said:

It sounds to me as if you are right clicking the gear lever, not left clicking it. When you use right mouse button, it means that you have extended your emergency gear, which can only be repaired if general other damage is present, else you need to respawn/ restart your mission. This is likely also what prevents you to engage NWS after landings. Also, recommend full stick aft deflection, to steer with lateral stick input after landing, helps also with slowing down. Here, check out this (imperfect video), maybe it helps with some aspects. if you do, please read the description, as I recorded it in a rush and corrected all mistakes in the description.
 

 

It sounds like what you said, right clicking not left clicking. TBH I had no idea you had a choice of left or right, I don't recall it being said in any tutorials I watched... I will test this tonight.

 

Thanks for the video as well, I have never seen someone steering on landing using the stick instead of rudders, I will also test this tonight.

2 hours ago, IronMike said:

 

 

[IronMike]

18 hours ago, gav88888 said:

It sounds like what you said, right clicking not left clicking. TBH I had no idea you had a choice of left or right, I don't recall it being said in any tutorials I watched... I will test this tonight.

 

Thanks for the video as well, I have never seen someone steering on landing using the stick instead of rudders, I will also test this tonight.

 

 

Happy if it helps!

[draconus]

On 10/6/2021 at 8:57 AM, gav88888 said:

I have never seen someone steering on landing using the stick instead of rudders...

It's a Tomcat thing. After touchdown you gently pull stick aft to aerobrake while moving it laterally for steering. It won't have an effect without the sufficient air flow over the stabilators so when slowed down you don't use the stick but turn NWS on and use rudders for taxi - note the transition @4:00 in the video above. Use wheelbrakes only when needed and you run out of runway

 

Edit: now this is what IronMike teaches us but it turns out rollout procedure is a bit different IRL - check Victory205's post below.

Edited October 7, 2021 by draconus

[Victory205]

You should use conventional rollout technique applying rudder for directional control during decel on landing rollout. Lateral stick into the wind if there is a crosswind present to keep the upwind wing from rising, while programming aft stick for aero braking as the aircraft decelerates, all while keeping the nose wheel on the ground.
 

lateral stick inputs will cause the nose to track slowly in the direction of lateral stick input, but isn’t a primary technique of control, it’s just something that exhibits the power of the stabilators and is there as a secondary means of helping directional control.
 

The rudders are a more powerful and straightforward means of lateral control. Typically select NWS when at taxi speed. Nosewheel steering may be used during rollout but it should be engaged with the rudder pedals centered to avoid a swerve upon engagement.

 

It’s cool that HB modeled the stab effects, but they aren’t a primary control on rollout. 

Edited October 7, 2021 by Victory205
Clarity/Typos

[gav88888]

Nice, thanks for the info guys.

 

I managed to get some time to test last night and @IronMikethe issue was left click vs right click, all working correctly now. Thanks for the info.

[Tank50us]

On 10/5/2021 at 11:05 PM, IronMike said:

It sounds to me as if you are right clicking the gear lever, not left clicking it. When you use right mouse button, it means that you have extended your emergency gear, which can only be repaired if general other damage is present, else you need to respawn/ restart your mission. This is likely also what prevents you to engage NWS after landings. Also, recommend full stick aft deflection, to steer with lateral stick input after landing, helps also with slowing down. Here, check out this (imperfect video), maybe it helps with some aspects. if you do, please read the description, as I recorded it in a rush and corrected all mistakes in the description.
 

 

 

 

I honestly forgot about that when attempting to land a wounded bird, and ended up doing a belly landing instead of a normal, gear-down landing. Oh well, I managed to avoid sending pieces of Tomcat in every direction, and was able to repair the plane, so there is that.

[IronMike]

On 10/7/2021 at 12:28 PM, Victory205 said:

You should use conventional rollout technique applying rudder for directional control during decel on landing rollout. Lateral stick into the wind if there is a crosswind present to keep the upwind wing from rising, while programming aft stick for aero braking as the aircraft decelerates, all while keeping the nose wheel on the ground.
 

lateral stick inputs will cause the nose to track slowly in the direction of lateral stick input, but isn’t a primary technique of control, it’s just something that exhibits the power of the stabilators and is there as a secondary means of helping directional control.
 

The rudders are a more powerful and straightforward means of lateral control. Typically select NWS when at taxi speed. Nosewheel steering may be used during rollout but it should be engaged with the rudder pedals centered to avoid a swerve upon engagement.

 

It’s cool that HB modeled the stab effects, but they aren’t a primary control on rollout. 

 

 

Thank you for putting that straight @Victory205 - I always wrongly assumed they were and that you guys used rudders only when slower, but makes sense ofc. Now my video appears even worse than it already was, ha! (I really should stop sharing it, or sit my lazy ass down and make a new one...)

Edited October 9, 2021 by IronMike

[Gierasimov]

11 hours ago, IronMike said:

 

Thank you for putting that straight @Victory205 - I always wrongly assumed they were and that you guys used rudders only when slower, but makes sense ofc. Now my video appears even worse than it already was, ha! (I really should stop sharing it, or sit my lazy ass down and make a new one...)

 

I would vote for the new one