Bingo Fuel rotary very slow

[Lau]

Please make the usage of the bingo fuel rotary easier by being able to shift faster through fuel quantities according to the mission bingo, at the moment it takes too much time. I am looking for the same reactivity than the altimeter pressure setting knob just for reference.

My suggestion since it has currently two speeds, is to allow for the left mouse button to be the fast speed and for the right one for the slow speed.

Best,

Lau 

 

Edited April 4, 2024 by Lau

[sLYFa]

Hold the shift key while scrolling, this will increase the rate at which the bingo setting changes.

[Raven (Elysian Angel)]

4 hours ago, sLYFa said:

Hold the shift key

That doesn’t help people in VR. Personally I don’t use a keyboard in my “cockpit” for example…

[Nealius]

Works for me in VR.

[Q3ark]

My shift key works fine in vr too

[Lau]

Hey guys,

@sLYFa thanks for the tip, I had forgotten about that one. That being said it takes two hands to perform the action, with that it is also worth noting that all other airframes of the type can do it with just scrolling the mouse wheel or pressing the left button. Personally I am more inclined to scrolling the mouse wheel over a very reactive rotary bingo fuel button, like what it is done for the altimeter. A one hand and quick job if you see what I mean, like in the real cockpit I suppose.

Best,

Lau

PS: oh! and I forgot, there is also the press and hold the left button while dragging the mouse in one direction or the other, current HB solution in the F14.

Edited March 31, 2024 by Lau

[draconus]

On 3/31/2024 at 12:37 PM, Lau said:

...like in the real cockpit I suppose.

I heard that it's like that in the real cockpit - meaning the bingo setting is slooow.

[Lau]

Thanks draconus,

I also heard the same from maintenance guys, pilots where actually complaining about how slow it was and just living with it since, the smartest people on earth do not need that junk to remember at what fuel state they should divert, even adding that it should be in the RIOs cockpit in the first place since, they have nothing else to do and therefore, have plenty of time to spare to play with the knob. After all it is only lighting a bulb with a « fuel » caution advisory. A detail that might have been more relevant when flying the multi million dollars jet with your butt strapped to it.

No one is complaining about it since very few people are using it and the ones that do, have plenty of time in their missions to use both hands to shift it fasssst. The thing is therefore not slow, it just takes two hands to operate which, does not make sense from a virtual pilot perspective with eyes riveted on lead during the whole mission.

My suggestion since it has currently two speeds, is to allow for the left mouse button to be the fast speed and for the right one for the slow speed.

I know that we are debating in the air since probably HB will never read this, but it bugs me that virtual pilots feedback is not taken into account like the annoying fact that we have to retrim the airplane with WoW every time that we jump to the RIOs seat in SP. The probe light is another one and so forth, but yeah the F4, although in 2020 it was not even an egg and things where already reported and acknowledged by HB with the usual “sorry”, not fair.

At the end of the day the real jet is in a museum and we are flying it every day, therefore I do care about HB feedback on this and customer support means everything. If they can go through so much trouble fixing an outpost in a training mission, they surely can spare some time to improve their customer’s life while using their product.

Best,

Lau

[draconus]

4 hours ago, Lau said:

to improve their customer’s life while using their product

How can they improve something that is properly simulated? Ah, they can remove the unrealistic fast method.

[Lau]

11 hours ago, draconus said:

How can they improve something that is properly simulated? Ah, they can remove the unrealistic fast method.

Hi draconus,

I find it to be quite a stretch that you only quote « to improve their customer’s life while using their product » from my previous message and then take the liberty of writing « How can they improve something that is properly simulated? Ah, they can remove the unrealistic fast method. ». I made the effort of writing a message with detailed explanations that are not to be taken out of context like you are trying to do. I furthermore raise a general problem about customer support and delivery delays and I am not talking about the F4 since, I will not be buying the module for the same reasons. I would like to add that I did found the HB update on the F4 delays very neat and respectful, even if I am not concerned, I read it because I care about the company future, but unfortunately that does not cover any of the points I raised in my previous message.

I believe that you do these types of things because of the role you have been appointed to by ED and third party developers in this forum, might be unofficial but it is there. While I salute the support you are able to give to the end user from time to time, there is no possible denying that you are over protecting ED and third party developers; I just hope that at least you are getting some free modules for all that non sense. With over 900 USD worth of modules, I believe to be in a good position to assess if ED and third party developers are fulfilling their duty and from my previous message it is clear that they are not doing so well. I believe the passion and support from ED’s customers is prepared for anything but that exclude to be taken for fools.

Best,

Lau

Edited April 5, 2024 by Lau

[draconus]

@Lau I like to keep my posts short and as much to-the-point as possible. When I quote, I try to reply to that quote only.

I am not ED employee or any of the 3rd parties', either official or not. You may have noticed I mostly try to help other users but I also don't stop myself from openly commenting DCS things in general or the modules I own. I try to be reasonable and balanced in my judgement but what you read as white knighting may just be the result of my glass-half-full attitude when reacting to Karen attitude. I refuse to further comment on support, HB and DCS in this very thread.

The only affiliation I may have is the DCS Realistic Police . Beware!

[Lau]

7 hours ago, draconus said:

@Lau I like to keep my posts short and as much to-the-point as possible. When I quote, I try to reply to that quote only.

Well you failed on that by quoting only that part of my message and then trying to make me say things I did not write. Keeping it short does not always fit the bill, on that perspective you felt short.

7 hours ago, draconus said:

I am not ED employee or any of the 3rd parties', either official or not. You may have noticed I mostly try to help other users but I also don't stop myself from openly commenting DCS things in general or the modules I own. I try to be reasonable and balanced in my judgement but what you read as white knighting may just be the result of my glass-half-full attitude when reacting to Karen attitude. I refuse to further comment on support, HB and DCS in this very thread.

Over 10k post and not a single marked as solution from the community, how ungrateful of them. There is nothing balanced about what you have written in this topic. If you fancy adding another 10k post like that, please do by all means, but do not try to make me say things I did not write or give me that nonsense. If you have any comments to add to my previous answer, please feel free to open another topic or PM me and I will meet you there.

7 hours ago, draconus said:

The only affiliation I may have is the DCS Realistic Police . Beware!

Now this might be your way of ending this poor exchange with a notch of humor, therefore please forgive me for having a hard time mixing nonsense with humor. I am not aware to have requested anything unrealistic, quite the opposite actually. I requested HB to allow players to simulate a fast hand movement with a left mouse click and a slow one with the right mouse button. Can't pilots turn a button faster or slower to fine tune as they see fit? At the end of the day, it's the same than what it is currently implemented, by just replacing the shift key that requires a second hand by the left mouse button to be able to do the same action single handed.

I finally pointed out that the altimeter is better implemented in my point of view since, it allows for fast and precise pressure settings by simply scrolling the mouse wheel, way easier to use and at the end of the day when we are in the cockpit, this is the type of solution we are all looking for. 

This is what we call customers feedback and it is paramount that HB takes this into account, not this precise example but in general without any doubt.

What on earth is so unrealistic about it ?

Best,

Lau

 

Edited April 5, 2024 by Lau

[draconus]

Just tested: one hand, click and hold, swipe mouse laterally, almost 1000lbs on Bingo setting, takes 2s, another few seconds to find the cursor

[Lau]

1 hour ago, draconus said:

Just tested: one hand, click and hold, swipe mouse laterally, almost 1000lbs on Bingo setting, takes 2s, another few seconds to find the cursor

Thanks for taking the time to test: No way, it just moves by hundreds lbs and it takes a long time to move between 1000 lbs up to 12k for example. Do the same test with the F15E and you will see the difference. The F18C is also faster although not as fast as the F15E.

The F14B can carry a little over 20k Lbs, my first bingo in the mission is at 14k, then 10k and finally 6k around the boat. I therefore do not use the option the way it is simulated to move from one fuel state to the other, it takes too much time.

22 hours ago, draconus said:

How can they improve something that is properly simulated? Ah, they can remove the unrealistic fast method.

You haven’t answered my question: what on earth is so unrealistic about what I am asking ?

Edited April 5, 2024 by Lau

[draconus]

1 hour ago, Lau said:

what on earth is so unrealistic about what I am asking ?

You ask for unrealistically faster bingo setting obviously.

[Lau]

13 hours ago, draconus said:

You ask for unrealistically faster bingo setting obviously.

draconus you just showed me that there is no cure for your bad faith. You go fast over messages and misread the information contained. If you read my message properly you will see that I am not asking for "unrealistic faster bingo setting" and that the answer to my question was therefore not so obvious to you.

Here is my message one more time just for you :

17 hours ago, Lau said:

I am not aware to have requested anything unrealistic, quite the opposite actually. I requested HB to allow players to simulate a fast hand movement with a left mouse click and a slow one with the right mouse button. Can't pilots turn a button faster or slower to fine tune as they see fit? At the end of the day, it's the same than what it is currently implemented, by just replacing the shift key that requires a second hand by the left mouse button to be able to do the same action single handed.

I finally pointed out that the altimeter is better implemented in my point of view since, it allows for fast and precise pressure settings by simply scrolling the mouse wheel, way easier to use and at the end of the day when we are in the cockpit, this is the type of solution we are all looking for. 

This is what we call customers feedback and it is paramount that HB takes this into account, not this precise example but in general without any doubt.

What on earth is so unrealistic about it ?

Best,

Lau

 

 

See, you did not answer before and are still not able to answer this very easy question. There cannot be anything unrealistic about what I am asking since, it is already implemented in game with the shift key, the only thing I am asking is for the shift key to be replaced by the left mouse button for fast scrolling and the right one to fine tune with the current 100 lbs adjustments speed.

Now over this exchange I must admit that I was more interested in how hard you make peoples life than the actual bingo setting. As far as this topic goes, your realistic policing has been based on nonsense. The more interesting part being that after so much ink, nothing will change in game like many other things that required HB attention, but we will leave that for another time when you will choose to discuss about it.

I am done with this topic,

Best,

Lau

 

Edited April 6, 2024 by Lau

[draconus]

12 hours ago, Lau said:

...my first bingo in the mission is at 14k, then 10k and finally 6k around the boat.

Is it your own method or did you take it from RL flights? I'd say I never heard of such bingo setting use case.

[JupiterJoe]

I would rather HB spend the time fixing stuff that needs fixing, or finish implementing stuff they've already laid the groundwork for  (the ability to put out an engine fire for example).

 

In other words, there are bigger fish to fry at this time.

Edited April 7, 2024 by JupiterJoe

[Lau]

2 hours ago, draconus said:

Is it your own method or did you take it from RL flights? I'd say I never heard of such bingo setting use case.

In normal conditions I would have been more than keen in having this conversation, however after our exchange in this very topic, I no longer wish to exchange with you.

1 hour ago, JupiterJoe said:

I would rather HB spend the time fixing stuff that needs fixing, or finish implementing stuff they've already laid the groundwork for.

 

In other words, there are bigger fish to fry at this time.

Yep, F4 here I come!

[RustBelt]

On 4/6/2024 at 2:26 AM, draconus said:

Is it your own method or did you take it from RL flights? I'd say I never heard of such bingo setting use case.

Are you having a particularly hard time in your life right now that clinging to game realism is the only thing holding you together right now?

The Bingo button is slow for the method of interface between the pretend real cockpit and the user interface of the game. While with an absolute rotary encoder it’s fine. Most people are not playing with an absolute rotary encoder to set their bingo. If they’re very lucky like me the have a basic encoder or are using the mouse and or a key/joystick bind and that’s artificially slow for the real input you cherish so much.

So is it “realistic” for the sim engagement of the knob to take significantly more time and effort as well as requiring constantly looking at the knob taking away eye time from other tasks? Or is the same amount of simulated “effort” more correct to “realistically” represent the tomcat? 
 

What definition of Real are you using, and is it appropriate to the tasks intended to be simulated by DCS?

 

Same age old simulator question, Fidelity vs Functionality. 

Edited April 12, 2024 by RustBelt

[draconus]

3 hours ago, RustBelt said:

Are you having a particularly hard time in your life right now that clinging to game realism is the only thing holding you together right now?

No, it came with DCS.

Since real pilots said it's slow I expect it to be slow in the simulation - what's wrong with that? If the real aircraft flies M2 then it should fly M2 in DCS, right?

Have you tested it for yourself? The method I tested with a mouse, one handed, changes 1000lbs in 2 seconds - so what are we really talking about in this thread?

If it was a Wishlist, by all means, please ask what you want - but it's posted in Bugs & Problems.

And lastly if you want to operate rotary without looking at it then you as a user have that option, just bind it to your HOTAS or get the appropriate hardware and set it.

[RustBelt]

Bugs and PROBLEMS. It’s being described as a PROBLEM. Seriously, you Don’t work for or rep ED or HB. Other people get a say here too.