Post Processing (?)

[Eight Ball]

Hello,

 

I know this is just a cosmetic effect, It doesn't add anything to the gameplay. Still, seeing post processing implemented in the DCS series might be a really sweet eye candy :).

 

For those who are unsure of what post processing is, it simulates the depth of field : object your are focusing on are neat and the rest is blurry.

 

Example :

 

Post Processing off

 

Post Processing on :

 

I was editing some pics and I realised how much more "real" it looked like with just a little blur.

 

Just a thought, don't know if it's possible to integrate that in the engine.

Edited March 3, 2011 by Eight Ball

[PeterP]

I think it's not so easy to implement up to now.

But anyway - even if it would be possible there would be hardly no use for it for normal gamplay.

 

Imagine-

You sit in the cockpit and and look through the HUD and switching your eyes permanently between HUD and AOA indicator that is mounted at the HUD on the left (Carrier-landing for instance).

How to tell the simulation you want a crisp interior of the cockpit while you look "inside" but a blurred one when you look "outside"?!

 

How to determine where your focus is?! - A Head-tracker can only tell were your neck is pointing - but not tell were your eyes on...

Yeah- you can get fancy gadgets like eye-tracker (I don't mean Head-Tracker) that tell the engine at what you are looking at the screen.

 

But it would be expensive - develop intensive and useless for game play up to now.

 

But You already have the ability to see "blurred and sharp" in one computer created image today!

 

You just need a stereoscopic set-up - simply called "3D".

And no need for post-processing any more. ;)

Only a 120Hz monitor a pair of shutter-glasses and a GPU that can handle it.

 

Already available at affordable prices.

And let your brain do the "post-processing" ! :)

 

P.S.

Nice Image !

Edited March 2, 2011 by PeterP

[sobek]

How to determine where your focus is?! - A Head-tracker can only tell were your neck is pointing - but not tell were your eyes on...

 

Like all the shooters do it, where you Z-axis points is what will be sharp (see ARMAII, e.g.). Although i agree that this feature has the potential to become a PITA to get to work so that gameplay does not suffer.

[Nate--IRL--]

Post Processing is more that just Depth of field (HDR etc) as is implemented in DCS. It is editable to a degree through the Lua files, so start digging through those.

 

Nate

[aaron886]

Not that that's actually realistic. Now, motion blur... that's another story. But your eye doesn't really work like a camera, in so far as F-stop is concerned. Motion blur in TASTEFUL quantity (for those with damn supercomputers) would be awesome, though.

[Eight Ball]

Sorry I didn't know that.

Would you mind giving some info about it ?

 

From the HDR .lua :

 

-- HDR config file

 

hdr = {}

 

-- сдвиг спектра солнца (spectral shift)

hdr['ss_R'] = 1.05

hdr['ss_G'] = 0.97

hdr['ss_B'] = 1.27

 

-- sun glow radius

hdr['glow_radius'] = 3.0

 

-- пределы яркости (brightness limits)

hdr['minL'] = 1.0

hdr['maxL'] = 3.0

 

-- коэффициент усиления солнечной короны

hdr['sMagn'] = 0.03

 

-- коэффициент усиления blur

hdr['bMagn'] = 0.35

 

-- время адаптации

hdr['aTime'] = 180.0

 

-- уровень яркости

hdr['level'] = 1.0

 

-- bright pass level

hdr['bLevel'] = 0.4;

 

I guess this is the one (blur) I have to edit ? Any information on what means the others ?

All I can find when I'm searching for it are mods, mostly related to FC.

 

Not that that's actually realistic.

Not sure what do you mean. depth of view is not realistic ?

Edited March 2, 2011 by Eight Ball

[Insanatrix]

I think DOF would be cool but it would probably create alot of neck strain because rather than move your view to just be able to see a gauge you would have to focus your virtual eye's on it.

[Nate--IRL--]

Haven't a clue :) Sorry. I'd be interested to know what you do find though.

 

Nate

[aaron886]

Not sure what do you mean. depth of view is not realistic ?

 

Yes. When we're talking about your eyes, you are able to control what you focus on almost instantly. This would be forced on you, which is nonsense.

[Eight Ball]

Well I'm trying but I don't see any difference, except for the R,G,B.

 

hdr['ss_B'] = 0.27

 

hdr['ss_B'] = 1.27

 

yeah...

 

I've tried all others and nothing changes...

 

 

-- сдвиг спектра солнца (spectral shift)

hdr['ss_R'] = 1.05

hdr['ss_G'] = 0.97

hdr['ss_B'] = 0.27

 

-- sun glow radius

hdr['glow_radius'] = 3.0

 

-- пределы яркости (brightness limits)

hdr['minL'] = 1.0

hdr['maxL'] = 5.0 (instead of 3)

 

-- коэффициент усиления солнечной короны

hdr['sMagn'] = 1.03 (instead of 0.03)

 

-- коэффициент усиления blur

hdr['bMagn'] = 0.85 (instead of 0.35)

 

-- время адаптации

hdr['aTime'] = 280.0 (instead of 180.0)

 

-- уровень яркости

hdr['level'] = 3.0 (instead of 1.0)

 

-- bright pass level

hdr['bLevel'] = 1.4; (instead of 0.4)

Edited March 3, 2011 by Eight Ball

[Eight Ball]

Yes. When we're talking about your eyes, you are able to control what you focus on almost instantly. This would be forced on you, which is nonsense.

 

Well no, depth of view is something real :)

Put your fingers 3 cm infront of your right eye and focus on it. Background is really blurry.

The more you move your finger away the less blurry the background is.

 

Of course, you have instant autofocus, but that's not exactly what I'm talking about.

 

I don't know how to exactly explain how to integrate that ingame but just like Sodek said you can find this effect in ArmA for example. When you look through your ironsight, the ironsight itself gets a little bit blurry. Because the game "understands" you are looking far away and there would no reason for you to focus on your ironsight itself

 

In DCS you would most likely never get a blurry cockpit when focusing on one of your gauge, because they're all more or less at the same distance from you. IMHO for it to be usable the blur should only apply in cockipt vs exterior. If the majority of your screen is "filled" with cockpit then exterior is a bit blurry and vice versa.

It would not look like my screenchot. I was simulating a heavy zoom from a camera. this is completely different.

Edited March 3, 2011 by Eight Ball

[sam777777]

hmm.

This is a great idea in my opinion, just a couple of problems/notes:

 

1) This has been done in Rise Of Flight, large performance hit and the fact that it focused on the center of the screen always meant it could get clunky, but it added to the immersion 10000x :thumbup:

 

2) This is very realistic, as others have already pointed out.

 

3) This can be achieved in game already using stereoscopic techniques or a 3d monitor. However both are impractical and 3d tv's are a scam (3d tv's without glasses have been around since the late 90's)

[Nate--IRL--]

I suspect the files to achieve this would be in here somewhere --> C:\Program Files\Eagle Dynamics\DCS A-10C\Bazar\shaders\PostMotionEffect

 

Happy Hunting and Back up first!

 

Nate

[aaron886]

Well no, depth of view is something real :)

Put your fingers 3 cm infront of your right eye and focus on it. Background is really blurry.

The more you move your finger away the less blurry the background is.

 

Of course, you have instant autofocus, but that's not exactly what I'm talking about.

 

 

Apparently you didn't read my post too well or misunderstood it. I understand the way my eyes work pretty well, thanks. I've spent many years studying the images they produce. :doh:

 

The fatal flaw in your idea is that in real life, you choose what you want to focus on and do so subconsciously and almost immediately. Blurring the outside world as result of having a certain amount of cockpit filling the screen will never work for that reason. You can't force the user to change what they're looking at just because the cockpit fills the screen, or their virtual "head" is pointed in one direction. Until you have some device that tracks the exact position of their eyeball, this idea is fruitless, IMO.

[Eight Ball]

lol, I understood your post and I know you're right.

I just think you misunderstood what I was trying to say.

 

First I've said it simulates DOF, which means it's as close as possible to reality without being reality thus I said it looked real.

 

I know, theorically, it seems completely "fake" (and it is) but I can assure you, for having experienced it myself on ArmA for years, if it's properly integrated it feels real.

In ArmA you just have a slight blur, not annoying at all and it doesn't keep you from clearly see the blurred area.

There were a lot of bad feedbacks about the motion blur, the bloom,...but I can't recall of anyone disliking the PP/DOF.

 

I don't know how it works, I don't know how to explain it, I don't know how it could properly be integrated into DCS, I perfectly understand your point but my best advice would be : try it.

 

;)

 

I suspect the files to achieve this would be in here somewhere --> C:\Program Files\Eagle Dynamics\DCS A-10C\Bazar\shaders\PostMotionEffect

 

Happy Hunting and Back up first!

 

Nate

 

OK, thanks, will have a look at it.

No worries about the back up, already have 2

just in case... :)

Edited March 3, 2011 by Eight Ball

[aaron886]

Can't hurt to try, but there's not a lot of situations I can think of where you would want to do what ARMA does by blurring out iron-sights. That's a pretty specific case. This is a flight sim, not a shooter. :smilewink:

[celticcoho]

Can't hurt to try, but there's not a lot of situations I can think of where you would want to do what ARMA does by blurring out iron-sights. That's a pretty specific case. This is a flight sim, not a shooter. :smilewink:

This is a Flight Sim??? Damn, I do a whole lot of Shooting!!!!The only Blur i get is when the target blinks, or as is said, sucks it up, before the explosion!!!!:music_whistling: Hope i was politicly correct???

Edited March 3, 2011 by celticcoho

[winz]

I know, theorically, it seems completely "fake" (and it is) but I can assure you, for having experienced it myself on ArmA for years, if it's properly integrated it feels real.

Irl you move your view by moving eyeballs, in sims moving your head to control view is the best we can get so far.

 

In flight sims most of your information comes from looking at the flight instruments. And you can (and should) scan briefly them even while staring out of the cockipt. You can do it even without moving your view. Having to move my entire head for a brief instrument check, just because center of the view is pointing somewhere 40miles ahead would be a pita and not realistic at all.

 

and don't compare it with arma, arma only has ironsight and most of your info comes from allways on-top focued hud...hell, you don't even need that hud, just like irl. And when you zoom-in on ironsight, the only thing you care about is what you see in the ironsight.

[Eight Ball]

I wasn't comparing with ArmA, was just saying there are games outhere with PP and it works great.

 

Sam777777 mention rise of flight which is also a flight sim. I've browsed several forums and no one seems to bitch about PP.

Actually PP is always welcome while HDR and Bloom not...

 

Just think out of the box, I've never said it should be identical to PP effect in others games, I've clearly stated I didn't how it could properly be integrated into DCS, all I said was it's a nice eye candy.

 

I feel like most of the people saying "hell no" just never played a game with PP.

Ok, on the paper it looks like crap but ingame, if properly implemented, it is nice.

And as far as I've experienced it, PP was always an option, you were never forced to activate it.

[jib]

If a future version of Track IR had a Head tracker and eye tracker the this would be possible and very very cool.

It is also technically possible right now. I work with disabled children that use eye tracking to control there computers.

Someone should seriously develop this idea!