Use of wheel brakes after touchdown

[Depth]

Secondly, brakes deployed at said speed (175) for 30% (no calibration on the cockpit, just visually).. when at the first part of the runway.. Next, reduce throttle to idle, and open brakes fully at midway the runway..

 

Finally, upon touchdown, engage anti-skid, NWS, and slam on the brake once you have aligned the wheels.. Be careful of jittery. They'll total your nosewheel. With practice, you'll know when too much rudder correction is enough to keep you centered on the runway..

You touchdown half way down the runway at 175 knots with NWS then slam the brakes? :huh:

[GGTharos]

Stop offering your 2c. Make sure you know what you're talking about first ...

 

Here are my 2 cents.. Firstly, your approach speed should be takeoff speed + 30 KIAS ..

 

Wrong. The correct speeds are described in the -1.

 

Meaning: Takeoff ROTATE = 145 KIAS... Landing speed = 175 KIAS..

 

Once more, wrong. Landing are speeds also described in -1, and I don't recall anything about an approach speed of 175.

 

Secondly, brakes deployed at said speed (175) for 30% (no calibration on the cockpit, just visually).. when at the first part of the runway.. Next, reduce throttle to idle, and open brakes fully at midway the runway..

 

... what? Wrong. You land at the beginning of the runway, not mid-way, and certainly not at such a high speed.

 

Finally, upon touchdown, engage anti-skid, NWS, and slam on the brake once you have aligned the wheels.. Be careful of jittery. They'll total your nosewheel. With practice, you'll know when too much rudder correction is enough to keep you centered on the runway..

 

If you would like a track let me know..

 

No thanks. I suggest you learn proper landing technique before offering to educate people. :)

[Depth]

I would like to see the track...

[Snoopy]

I would like to see the track...

 

With some circus music in the background :pilotfly:

[Tailgate]

Where's the hook and arresting cable when you need it? :D

 

eta:

 

The gliderport that I used to frequent had a barbed wire fence at the end of the runway (yeah, the airfield was on a ranch), and I've seen a couple of gliders that landed long, and the nose resembled something that went through a tomato slicer. Obviously touch and go's were not an option.

Edited January 18, 2012 by Tailgate

[cichlidfan]

:megalol::megalol:

[Outlaw24]

With some circus music in the background :pilotfly:

 

Yes, why don't you entertain us with a track :lol:

[MagnumHB]

Who needs a track? This video should suffice: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGAmpysnaxM

[Depth]

A bit more on-topic, I just made a quick mission to land at Batumi and it went much smoother with the airbrakes. I used to only use wheelbrakes to slow the plane not giving airbrakes much thought.

 

But I'd like some comment anyway, is there anything I should do different?

 

I don't have rudder pedals or a trackIR so it might look a little clunky when I taxi or look around :P

Batumi Landing.trk

[WildBillKelsoe]

Stop offering your 2c. Make sure you know what you're talking about first ...

 

 

 

Wrong. The correct speeds are described in the -1.

 

 

 

Once more, wrong. Landing are speeds also described in -1, and I don't recall anything about an approach speed of 175.

 

 

 

... what? Wrong. You land at the beginning of the runway, not mid-way, and certainly not at such a high speed.

 

 

 

No thanks. I suggest you learn proper landing technique before offering to educate people. :)

 

I just suggested my technique, that's all. And I know I could be wrong. Anyways, he's free to try it man..

[hopeless]

Damn my landings don't look anywhere as smooth as that. I think I flare too early.

 

Depth I think yours was great.

 

I need more practice.. :joystick:

[Depth]

Damn my landings don't look anywhere as smooth as that. I think I flare too early.

 

Depth I think yours was great.

 

I need more practice..

 

Thanks, that was with with a very light load, not a speck of ammunition and about 40% fuel I think

 

Made another one, this time with 100% weight on the aircraft. Touchdown was way too hard and I bounced. What is the desired vertical velocity for touchdown and what's the best way to achieve this? Steeper flare or more thrust?

Batumi Landing Heavy.trk

[GGTharos]

Less than 200fpm. In any case, if you don't have computed speed, just go by AoA, it'll 'fix' the airspeed for you.

 

Made another one, this time with 100% weight on the aircraft. Touchdown was way too hard and I bounced. What is the desired vertical velocity for touchdown and what's the best way to achieve this? Steeper flare or more thrust?

[159th_Viper]

Have not watched the track, but if you bounced her you came in too slow.

[Agg]

I see I have been doing it wrong all along, I used to slam the breaks as soon as I got her on the ground. I tried the other approach earlier today with letting the speed brakes do most of the work and that seemed to work very well, and if that's what the guys do in real life then that's what Ill be doing in the sim as well ;)

[Depth]

Have not watched the track, but if you bounced her you came in too slow.

Less than 200fpm. In any case, if you don't have computed speed, just go by AoA, it'll 'fix' the airspeed for you.

 

Thanks guys, went alot better. I used ILS and GPS for both landings and I assumed that once my airspeed hit the donut on the airspeed indicator all was well and fine but a little extra made all the difference :smartass:

 

My first try I overshot the field and aborted so I just quit and hit fly again. That meant that it reloaded the lighter loadout and I thought I was flying at 100% weight when in reality I was flying closer to 60%. Didn't notice it until a few feet above ground, very odd experience that

 

I think I hit the ground at less than 100fpm on the heavy landing but I nearly continued off the airstrip haha

Batumi Landing Heavy 2.trk

Batumi Landing Light 2.trk

[159th_Viper]

Here we go - a landing at 106% weight when you're in a hurry to get back home to the Missus :D

 

Batumi Landing Heavy in a hurry.trk

 

Disclaimer: Never mind the alignment issues - as said, in a hurry.....:P

[effte]

Aero braking is only if you have plenty of runway to spare. It is not the method for maximum performance.

 

Coasting to a stop without using the brakes is fine, if saving brake wear is your primary concern. If in any doubt about the landing distance available, brake. That means: Get the nose down ASAP and brake. No aero braking.

 

Same goes if there is traffic behind you to the same runway. You won't get any fans if you force aircraft behind to go around while lazily coasting down the entire length of the runway trying to save on brake wear.

 

Aircraft anti-skid and car ABS are two different beasts. Car ABS pulses the brakes, causing noise, vibration, tyre wear and dotted lines on the asphalt. Aircraft systems are generally way more advanced and use wheel speed sensors to modulate brake pressure to obtain just the right amount of braking. In other words, you can mash down on the pedals and you will be fine - as long as you are below the brake energy limits given in the flight manual. Yes, it will wear on the tyres but not the way it does in cars, and tyres are cheaper than airframes.

 

(In airliners, you can find autobrakes with various settings, providing preset rates of deceleration. Rather neat feature, especially when you want to make that turnoff!)

 

Above the brake energy limits, you may end up with hot brakes, brake fires and what not. OTOH, if you have to choose between risking a brake fire and running off the far end of the runway, it's a no-brainer.

 

On a hot (30 deg C) day at 4000 feet, the caution zone where you risk tire deflation due to blown fuse plugs begins at 110 KIAS. The danger zone, where you evacuate and call for the red trucks, begins at 130 KIAS.

 

On a standard day at sea level, caution zone is at 120 KIAS and the danger zone at around 150 KIAS.

 

A-10 maximum sink rate is 600 fpm and 33,200 lbs, decreasing to 350 fpm as the aircraft gets heavier. It's in the book.

 

In my experience, bouncing is usually indicative of either touching down at too high a rate of descent (less so the more damping you have in your landing gear) or landing at too high speed. Of course, that's not from flying A-10's... and I haven't really experimented with bouncing in DCS. :)

 

Does anyone know if the A-10 has received carbon brakes, or if it's still all steel?

 

Cheers,

Fred

[Depth]

Here we go - a landing at 106% weight when you're in a hurry to get back home to the Missus :D

 

[ATTACH]61472[/ATTACH]

 

Disclaimer: Never mind the alignment issues - as said, in a hurry.....:P

 

One of your bastard colleagues slipped you laxatives before you headed out? :D

[effte]

As the song goes: "If you've just been out for mexican, and your stomach is in knots..." ;)

[159th_Viper]

One of your bastard colleagues slipped you laxatives before you headed out? :D

 

:megalol: Nope.....

 

Egg-Timer, a battery and some loose wires strapped to a JDAM..........Bastages!

 

:P

[Eddie]

Same goes if there is traffic behind you to the same runway. You won't get any fans if you force aircraft behind to go around while lazily coasting down the entire length of the runway trying to save on brake wear.

 

Actually, in the military world, braking to exit the runway quickly will actually cause the guy coming in behind you to have to execute a go around. As well as other potential issues.

 

Fighters/Attack aircraft generally land with an overhead pattern and you can easily have 4 aircraft (all from the same flight) on the runway at the same time at various stages between touchdown and exiting at the end of the runway.

 

Additionally as has been said before, when you are in an armed aircraft, exiting at anywhere other than the designated taxiway (generally at end of runway) will cause problems as there will be no arming crew there to put the safety pins back in to any remaining weapons, guns and flare dispensers. And without pins you're not going ANYWHERE near the ramp.

[effte]

Eddie,

both valid points for USAF ops at own bases. Thank you for pointing that out.

 

Cheers,

Fred

[Depth]

:megalol: Nope.....

 

Egg-Timer, a battery and some loose wires strapped to a JDAM..........Bastages!

 

:P

:lol:

 

Also, challenge accepted. Split-S into landing:

Batumi Landing in a hurry.trk

Edited January 18, 2012 by Depth

[sobek]

Aircraft anti-skid and car ABS are two different beasts. Car ABS pulses the brakes, causing noise, vibration, tyre wear and dotted lines on the asphalt. Aircraft systems are generally way more advanced and use wheel speed sensors to modulate brake pressure to obtain just the right amount of braking. In other words, you can mash down on the pedals and you will be fine - as long as you are below the brake energy limits given in the flight manual. Yes, it will wear on the tyres but not the way it does in cars, and tyres are cheaper than airframes.

 

Yes, bad analogy, but the brakes still suffer for it, more than they have to if you can use the whole runway, even below the energy limit.