DCS World TARGET profile for TM Cougar and Warthog + MFDs

[lxsapper]

Appendix E in the Setup PDF has been updated with instructions on how to disable the Microsoft Store (which is the likely culprit in Windows 10).

 

I have this problem as well and this along with other solutions, do not work for me. Having the TARGET profile load up right away on boot does work. But not every time. My work around for this is Stop the profile, exit TARGET. Disconnect the Warthog Stick and Throttle USB plugs (or turn them off on my chinese USB Hub with a switch for every port), connect them again, make sure TARGET is started on Administrator mode and relaunch the profile. Usually works first time, but may take more than one try.

I also have a seperate issue where my joystick will sometimes not be functional after launching thrustmaster combined, stoping the profile, disconecting just the stick, reconnecting and running the profile again also clears this for me. I suspect this isn't really related to the first issue and it's something to do with my hardware itself.

Anyway if this can help someone else, it's my experience with it.

[Majik]

I also have a seperate issue where my joystick will sometimes not be functional after launching thrustmaster combined, stoping the profile, disconecting just the stick, reconnecting and running the profile again also clears this for me. I suspect this isn't really related to the first issue and it's something to do with my hardware itself.

Anyway if this can help someone else, it's my experience with it.

 

 

I had this exact problem last year; many people online seemed to have the same problem, and I found many supposed solutions from googling, but in the end playing around with USB legacy mode in the BIOS is what ultimatley fixed it for me. YMMV

 

 

I'd also make sure power management is off for the combined hotas once target is on (it's seperate from the settings for just the joystick and throttle)

[Charlie122sq]

Hi, i updated to 2.46, i put the .lua flie for F14 Lantirn mod from CTS¡s custom luas files and 2.46 profiles for the keyboard and the hotas cougar. I selected SC and set the Lantirn value for F14 in 2. In controllers i have new options in F14 Pilot section to turn on the Lantirn pod in LMFD, even i have Air Source options in RMFD and set slew axis for Lantirn. But i don't have any other option like S4 buttons, laser latch, WHOT/BHOT, etc... set in the hotas, just in keyboard i have keyboards commands without modifier. I can't make it work

 

Edited May 30, 2020 by Charlie122sq

[tomeye]

I tried once more, if you lower your cargo and press paddle AI says "released" but no release takes place. The DCS code seems broken for release. However, RCtrl+RAlt+RShift+P releases normally.

 

 

Additionally when using to huey only TX4 (21) works from MIC. We are missing 20 + 22.

[Home Fries]

Hi, i updated to 2.46, i put the .lua flie for F14 Lantirn mod from CTS¡s custom luas files and 2.46 profiles for the keyboard and the hotas cougar. I selected SC and set the Lantirn value for F14 in 2. In controllers i have new options in F14 Pilot section to turn on the Lantirn pod in LMFD, even i have Air Source options in RMFD and set slew axis for Lantirn. But i don't have any other option like S4 buttons, laser latch, WHOT/BHOT, etc... set in the hotas, just in keyboard i have keyboards commands without modifier. I can't make it work

 

Sounds like you have it set up correctly, but I can't duplicate the error. With exception of the Slew axes, all LANTIRN commands are keyboard commands without the JoyBtn30 modifier. I did find a bug with H4P reverting from BHOT/WHOT to DLC, but this can be worked-around by using H4R instead. I was able to use all S4 commands as well as laser latch and the trigger settings. BTW, your keyboard layout looks okay from what I can see as well.

 

I'm assuming you're using both Warthog Stick and Throttle, and not the Hornet stick.

[Home Fries]

Testing on my own and reading on the huey sub-forum it seems that only auto (RCtrl+RShift+K) and manual (RCtrl+RAlt+RShift+P) unhook works.

I suggest you assign either of these to long tempo paddle.

 

Ok, I think since the Huey doesn't use landing gear I can assign a tempo to the paddle switch. However, I need to know exactly how sling loading works since it's been a while and my knowledge is obsolete.

 

Do I need to have a short for hook and long for pilot unhook, or is autounhook sufficient? Which is preferable, and how does autounhook work?

[Home Fries]

Additionally when using to huey only TX4 (21) works from MIC. We are missing 20 + 22.

This is by design with the Huey. Trigger does the radio selected with the radio selector, and TX4 should activate the selected radio.

[tomeye]

Ok, I think since the Huey doesn't use landing gear I can assign a tempo to the paddle switch. However, I need to know exactly how sling loading works since it's been a while and my knowledge is obsolete.

 

Do I need to have a short for hook and long for pilot unhook, or is autounhook sufficient? Which is preferable, and how does autounhook work?

 

 

Hook already works with paddle in your current config. I think tempo paddle would be fine for unhook.

When you enable the autounhook function it will unhook the cargo when it hits the ground.

 

The standard unhook is more realistic while autounhook is more user friendly.

[tomeye]

This is by design with the Huey. Trigger does the radio selected with the radio selector, and TX4 should activate the selected radio.

 

 

How do I map Vaicom and Discord then in Huey?

 

Apologies for my ignorance, I am still learning :)

[Home Fries]

How do I map Vaicom and Discord then in Huey?

 

Apologies for my ignorance, I am still learning :)

 

Page 17 of the Setup Guide PDF starts the specific VAICOM configuration instructions. If I"m missing something or they need to be more clear, please let me know.

[tomeye]

Page 17 of the Setup Guide PDF starts the specific VAICOM configuration instructions. If I"m missing something or they need to be more clear, please let me know.

 

 

When you select the huey profile there is no DX20 and DX22, this is what I mean. I think for every profile the MIC should be same.

[Home Fries]

Hook already works with paddle in your current config. I think tempo paddle would be fine for unhook.

When you enable the autounhook function it will unhook the cargo when it hits the ground.

 

The standard unhook is more realistic while autounhook is more user friendly.

 

Do you think hook would be better as TEMPO Long and Unhook as TEMPO Short?

[tomeye]

Do you think hook would be better as TEMPO Long and Unhook as TEMPO Short?

 

 

Very good idea, hook as long tempo.

[tomeye]

I checked some profiles and MIC DX20-23 is not constant among them. I read the pdf file and I think we need some constant DX keys to map to external programs like discord, SRS and voiceattack.

 

 

 

What do you believe?

[Home Fries]

2.46a (Hotfix 1) is up. It fixes the UH-1 Cargo Hook/Unhook as well as the F-14 LANTIRN H4P bug.

 

Note: the database was updated, so be sure to rebuild your profile.

[Home Fries]

I checked some profiles and MIC DX20-23 is not constant among them. I read the pdf file and I think we need some constant DX keys to map to external programs like discord, SRS and voiceattack.

 

 

 

What do you believe?

 

I have reserved DX20-23 to comms, and in doing so have even remapped the combinations that use these commands (such as the MFDs). However, not all modules use all commands because not all modules have three discrete radio buttons.

 

I have tried to match the layout of the source aircraft as closely as possible. This is why for helicopters you normally have a single comm button (usually the trigger) and you select the radio. It's also why the MiG-21, P-51, and other single-radio aircraft use one comm button instead of three buttons. SRS and VAICOM both support this.

[overalien]

I have reserved DX20-23 to comms, and in doing so have even remapped the combinations that use these commands (such as the MFDs). However, not all modules use all commands because not all modules have three discrete radio buttons.

 

I have tried to match the layout of the source aircraft as closely as possible. This is why for helicopters you normally have a single comm button (usually the trigger) and you select the radio. It's also why the MiG-21, P-51, and other single-radio aircraft use one comm button instead of three buttons. SRS and VAICOM both support this.

 

 

Hi Home Fries

Because of this difference in DX mapping between say F18, A-10, F-14 and the frustration this causes with using VAICOM and SRS with a single PTT for SRS, I have done extensive modifications to the code to force similar DX for similar Radios across all aircraft with VAICOM and SRS being the basis instead of the aircraft. . This deviates a lot from your stock approach, but really works for me to help the muscle memory and VAICOM / SRS integration at the cost of some realism. In addition I have remapped Intercom on the F14 to DX29 which helps a lot with avoiding ghost keying the ICS microphone on VAICOM when using the MFDS. Personally I believe this to be more user friendly across the board compared to the "close to the real aircraft" approach. I also hacked the zoom function to include an automatic TrackIR precision trigger at low FOV and made some other tweaks. Naturally I groan with each new update since I have to reintegrate my code changes every time. If you like, I can send you my hack job to have a look at and consider adoption, if more players prefer this DX mapping approach... Let me know.

 

 

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[tomeye]

I also like the fact of realism you tried to put with assigning combinations per aircraft and of course the ease of your software.

 

Perhaps common DX mapping for radio is a wider topic as @overalien mentioned above.

 

 

 

I would like to know how you map discord or TS while having Vaicom/SRS.

[Charlie122sq]

Sounds like you have it set up correctly, but I can't duplicate the error. With exception of the Slew axes, all LANTIRN commands are keyboard commands without the JoyBtn30 modifier. I did find a bug with H4P reverting from BHOT/WHOT to DLC, but this can be worked-around by using H4R instead. I was able to use all S4 commands as well as laser latch and the trigger settings. BTW, your keyboard layout looks okay from what I can see as well.

 

I'm assuming you're using both Warthog Stick and Throttle, and not the Hornet stick.

 

Nope, is Hotas cougar with cougar stick

[Home Fries]

Hi Home Fries

Because of this difference in DX mapping between say F18, A-10, F-14 and the frustration this causes with using VAICOM and SRS with a single PTT for SRS, I have done extensive modifications to the code to force similar DX for similar Radios across all aircraft with VAICOM and SRS being the basis instead of the aircraft. . This deviates a lot from your stock approach, but really works for me to help the muscle memory and VAICOM / SRS integration at the cost of some realism. In addition I have remapped Intercom on the F14 to DX29 which helps a lot with avoiding ghost keying the ICS microphone on VAICOM when using the MFDS. Personally I believe this to be more user friendly across the board compared to the "close to the real aircraft" approach. I also hacked the zoom function to include an automatic TrackIR precision trigger at low FOV and made some other tweaks. Naturally I groan with each new update since I have to reintegrate my code changes every time. If you like, I can send you my hack job to have a look at and consider adoption, if more players prefer this DX mapping approach... Let me know.

I also like the fact of realism you tried to put with assigning combinations per aircraft and of course the ease of your software.

Perhaps common DX mapping for radio is a wider topic as @overalien mentioned above.

I would like to know how you map discord or TS while having Vaicom/SRS.

 

Fellas, I'm glad we're having this conversation. I started this profile years ago for the Cougar when the only modules were the A-10C, Ka-50, and FC3 (then the P-51 shortly after). The baseline was the A-10C and the only voice solutions were TS3 and the TS3-based TARS (a spiritual predecessor to SRS).

 

Since then I have modified the code to include the Warthog and then two years ago I changed VAC/TARS support to VAICOM/SRS. Now that I'm very close to the stack limit that TARGET can handle, I will need to revamp my comms code again to streamline it. I have already tried to make the Warthog Mic Switch as standardized as possible, but I'm not sure I'll be able to do the same level of standardization with the Cougar without sacrificing some functionality.

 

Here's what I try to do with comms:

1. Single Radio: T1 (Cougar) or MSD (Warthog). MSU/MSP for TS3/Discord (often shared with T1 for Cougar, but sometimes T3 Up).
   
2. Dual Radio: T4/T5 (Cougar Left/Right) or MSR/L (Warthog). MSU/P TS3/Discord (T3 for Cougar).
   
3. Three Radios: T2/4/5 (Cougar) or MSR/L/D (Warthog). Again, MSU/P or T3 for TS3/Discord.
   

I changed the helos to match their HOTAS (trigger is normal for helos, except for the Ka-50 which uses the pickle button), but you should always get MSP for TS3/Discord. I also changed the F-16 to do Up/Down on the TQS, which matches the actual F-16.

[Home Fries]

Nope, is Hotas cougar with cougar stick

 

Ok, I'll try to duplicate with the Cougar.

[=36=Witcher]

So... I'm following the discussion even though I don't use VAICOM, but I'm really interested in the whole project (as Home Fries surely knows :))

 

Being a Software Engineer when outside of the cockpit, I can't help but reason about the whole code base. I know we're about to hit the "critical mass" of the script, so I think that the time for a major overhaul is coming.

 

Now... for sure, TARGET scripts are not meant to be THAT module, and what Home Fries achieved here is quite impressive IMHO. Nonetheless, we need room for further improvements.

 

So, here's my first thoughts: I think we should find start to branch the scripts according to... something. I don't know exactly what the best way do this can be, but the first thing that comes in my mind is to split the code base between Cougar and Warthog base. I think this should help split the code base pretty much evenly, and would also help reduce the complexity.

 

What do you think, Home?

[tomeye]

Fellas, I'm glad we're having this conversation. I started this profile years ago for the Cougar when the only modules were the A-10C, Ka-50, and FC3 (then the P-51 shortly after). The baseline was the A-10C and the only voice solutions were TS3 and the TS3-based TARS (a spiritual predecessor to SRS).

 

Since then I have modified the code to include the Warthog and then two years ago I changed VAC/TARS support to VAICOM/SRS. Now that I'm very close to the stack limit that TARGET can handle, I will need to revamp my comms code again to streamline it. I have already tried to make the Warthog Mic Switch as standardized as possible, but I'm not sure I'll be able to do the same level of standardization with the Cougar without sacrificing some functionality.

 

Here's what I try to do with comms:

1. Single Radio: T1 (Cougar) or MSD (Warthog). MSU/MSP for TS3/Discord (often shared with T1 for Cougar, but sometimes T3 Up).
   
2. Dual Radio: T4/T5 (Cougar Left/Right) or MSR/L (Warthog). MSU/P TS3/Discord (T3 for Cougar).
   
3. Three Radios: T2/4/5 (Cougar) or MSR/L/D (Warthog). Again, MSU/P or T3 for TS3/Discord.
   

I changed the helos to match their HOTAS (trigger is normal for helos, except for the Ka-50 which uses the pickle button), but you should always get MSP for TS3/Discord. I also changed the F-16 to do Up/Down on the TQS, which matches the actual F-16.

 

 

I see that for helos or single radios, MSD and MSU/MSP are both mapped to DX21. Is this correct?

[Home Fries]

So... I'm following the discussion even though I don't use VAICOM, but I'm really interested in the whole project (as Home Fries surely knows :))

 

Being a Software Engineer when outside of the cockpit, I can't help but reason about the whole code base. I know we're about to hit the "critical mass" of the script, so I think that the time for a major overhaul is coming.

 

Now... for sure, TARGET scripts are not meant to be THAT module, and what Home Fries achieved here is quite impressive IMHO. Nonetheless, we need room for further improvements.

 

So, here's my first thoughts: I think we should find start to branch the scripts according to... something. I don't know exactly what the best way do this can be, but the first thing that comes in my mind is to split the code base between Cougar and Warthog base. I think this should help split the code base pretty much evenly, and would also help reduce the complexity.

 

What do you think, Home?

 

Problem with breaking the code that way is that I'll have to do twice the work, or I'll have to develop one, then port it (which will be a configuration management nightmare with updates). However, if I can figure out a way to alias &Joystick and &HCougar, I could have over 90% of the stick solution with one code base. I'd still have to do the throttles individually but that isn't a big deal.

 

I'm thinking three things are going to happen, and sooner than later (though I need a big block of uninterrupted time to make it work). First, I'll tweak the communications routines. I have completely separate routines for Cougar and Warthog because I ported the Warthog later and I wanted to be able to compare the code side by side. I could combine much of that and use the same variables, and I will need to streamline the comms code. This means that the PTT Common option will go away (this is obsolete since SRS became the game standard anyway). That will reduce the permutations in the comms. options (especially true in the Cougar routine). Next, I'll stop programming for every single option and start programming for a common denominator (or series of popular options). This is where I could use your input on what you all use and what you don't care about.

 

Next, I'll start globalizing as much as I can, particularly with MFDs. Right now there is a convention, but each module library has its own MFD routine. Globalizing the MFDs and then calling individual routines to re-assign differences is less efficient programming, but may reduce the stack overhead.

 

Finally, I'll move the non-DCS programs like IL-2 and Elite Dangerous to a separate profile. I'll ideally want to update the CTS EXE to have a new GUI and call different files, but nothing else needs to change.

 

I welcome any other inputs or suggestions

[overalien]

Problem with breaking the code that way is that I'll have to do twice the work, or I'll have to develop one, then port it (which will be a configuration management nightmare with updates). However, if I can figure out a way to alias &Joystick and &HCougar, I could have over 90% of the stick solution with one code base. I'd still have to do the throttles individually but that isn't a big deal.

 

I'm thinking three things are going to happen, and sooner than later (though I need a big block of uninterrupted time to make it work). First, I'll tweak the communications routines. I have completely separate routines for Cougar and Warthog because I ported the Warthog later and I wanted to be able to compare the code side by side. I could combine much of that and use the same variables, and I will need to streamline the comms code. This means that the PTT Common option will go away (this is obsolete since SRS became the game standard anyway). That will reduce the permutations in the comms. options (especially true in the Cougar routine). Next, I'll stop programming for every single option and start programming for a common denominator (or series of popular options). This is where I could use your input on what you all use and what you don't care about.

 

Next, I'll start globalizing as much as I can, particularly with MFDs. Right now there is a convention, but each module library has its own MFD routine. Globalizing the MFDs and then calling individual routines to re-assign differences is less efficient programming, but may reduce the stack overhead.

 

Finally, I'll move the non-DCS programs like IL-2 and Elite Dangerous to a separate profile. I'll ideally want to update the CTS EXE to have a new GUI and call different files, but nothing else needs to change.

 

I welcome any other inputs or suggestions

 

 

Yep. I think you're in the right track. The issue is that this wonderful software caters for every possible permutation of hardware software and supported games as an all in one package! It's a herculian task which has been most admirably delivered, but must be a nightmare to maintain and incrementally expand. Perhaps a poll to your users might give an indication of who is doing what with it right now might help you to focus? Modularising and setting it up on GIThub may also elicit some collaborators and might create developmentvspecialisation for various features to reduce the pressure and workload on you.... Something to consider.

 

 

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