jojo

I need to retry. Last time I did it, I designated the IP with throttle button as expected. When going into attack mode, the HUD switch to "OBL mode", so I don't know if you can still perform overfly update in this mode ?

I'm totally lost by your post, but I will try to explain how it should work. There are 2 ways to update the INS during navigation: - vertical overfly: REC (Recalage) on PCN or "NAV Update/MAGIC unlock" on stick. - designation = OBL selected on PCA (oblique): "Magic Slave/AG Designate/INS Position Update" on throttle. To perform an offset attack: - you entrer the Initial Point in the PCN as a "PREP" waypoint ("but" in French) - you define the target as BAD ("but additionnel" in French). - select the Initial Point as DEST on PCN - select "PI" (Point Initial in French) on PCA. - when in range, designate the Initial Point with diamond at the bottom of the HUD and use "Magic Slave/AG Designate/INS Position Update" command on throttle (same command as CCPR designation, because indeed it's using TAS sensor). - then you will be guided toward the target which is the BAD point. During the attack: - don't use the BAD button on PCN - don't hit VAL button before the end of the attack. After the end of the attack, you should be able to use VAL button to update INS position, because indeed, Initial Point designation is like OBL update. On the other hand, if you don't select "PI" option on PCA, you can perform vertical overfly or OBL update on Initial Point, and after VALidation, hit "BAD" button on PCN and perform a classical CCPR attack on the BAD poisition. This is how it should work at least...

I did ask to a pilot. No it never worked in game.

I'm sorry, you closed the thread in the bug report, so I can't answer you there. I think there is a big misunderstanding. The problem isn't to hope for a direct hit with a single bomb in CCIP. The problem as I see it in my test, is that if you press the trigger when the pipper is over the target, the first bomb is consistently long, about 200ft long in my test (60m). Yes there is a processing delay which means that the bomb will be dropped some times after the trigger press. What Ergo tried to explain, it's that the delay is known by the system. So the pipper is rised up to account for the release delay. So when the pilot press the trigger, actually he is making a target designation, with very short time CCRP. (By the way, on Hornet & Harriet, if the pilot makes a designation with the dashed pipper, it will transition from CCIP to CCRP, but this would most likely happen with free fall bombs, not high drag). So the pilot has to maintain the trigger pressed and hold still until the last bomb is released, and the first bomb of the salvo will land closer to the target in the centre of the pipper than the 60m long currently. I talked with Jean-Louis Bernard. The guy is a former Dassault Aviation engineer. He worked on the support of Mirage F1 EQ sold to Iraq during the war with Iran. http://les-heros-de-bagdad.over-blog.com/ http://www.editions-jpo.com/fr/home/221-les-heros-de-bagdad-tome-2-9782373011319.html https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCego5xtVXGPakwbYc2Rld9A I asked him about CCIP, and if he had some video about CCIP attack run. Unfortunately it isn't the case. But what he told me matches Ergo description. So the hexagonal pipper represent the impact point of the salvo. There should be a "hole" in the bomb fall line (BFL) which represent the last bomb of the salvo (missimg feature). So all bombs will fall between the pipper and the hole in the BFL, give or take a few meters. We are talking here about Mirage F1 EQ5 from the 80', nothing as fancy as Mirage 2000N or Mirage 2000D. I noted you asked to your "SME" at EC 2/5 and I'm happy about that. I'm sure it will be low priority since they don't use high drag bombs anymore. But I'm confident it will work as described by Ergo and Jean-Louis Bernard. All that doesn't mean it is recommended to attack pin point targets with a single bomb in CCIP. Of course you should set a bomb salvo, put the target(s) between the pipper and the hole in the BFL (inside the salvo projected impacts line), press the trigger and wait until all bombs are released. The CCIP on the Mirage 2000C is only used with high drag bombs, so currently only Mk-82SE and BLG-66. I don't understand why it would make other forms of bombing inaccurate ? This is about improving CCIP accuracy. And you are ruling out any modification before SME answer. Or did you already get an answer ? Question: are you also system coder for Razbam ?

I think got this picture here, extracted from Mirage 2000 EG landing video. You can see that at some point, the speed indication jumps up.

No, that just means that none of this module cared to include release delay in the CCIP targeting. So far, trying to aim with the centre of the CCIP cue, at 500kt and around 300ft I get consistently around 200ft miss distance. Since it's repeatable, it's accurate. F-5E doesn't have CCIP. I will try to make a proper testing video in the coming days.

There are people here with background in the industry or the Air Force. And like Razbam they may not be allowed to release evidence on the open just to make a point. And there are a bunch of Dassault fighters from the 80'-90' that are using the same system. Like I said: since EC 2/5 involvement, they tweaked some systems, but not everything, far from it. CCPI and high drag bombs are a thing of the past. It's fun for us to play with, but the last time they used it in action was probably 1991, and the video of 1999 was just for the show. Back then, the Mirage 2000-5F just got declared operational, and Mirage 2000C was still mainly into the AA business. When Mirage 2000C was re-focused to "gun slinger" in AG alongside Mirage 2000D, we saw them with Mk-82 and GBU-12 = CCPL to avoid small arm arms fire. So I would totally understand that "BF" bomb mode was not high on the priority list for AdA. You are dismissing the case on the the assumption that it's according to specs as it is. We are just asking you to check with your SME. :book: You don't have to take all that we say for granted, just note into the things to check with the guys of EC 2/5 please.

Maybe you can ask your SME to produce a HUD video of high drag bomb (BF) attack run in 20° dive, even the “official” simulator will do. Just something like “ok, let me check with the guys at Orange AB and I’ll come back” would suit me. Because so far, you are assuming that Baltic Dragon wrote Razbam M-2000C manual under EC 2/5 supervision. But it isn’t the case. And while overall he did a great job, there are some places where it could be improved.

From day one I said the new RWR is great. But: 1- it’s missing a few weapon systems in the library (and these are weapon systems encountered during the aircraft service time). 2- it’s advertised as customisable, but you denied the need because of the SME. 3- I was just suggesting a way to avoid loosing the custom file at each DCS World update.

I suggest you check back with the team. If my memory serves me right, the manual was mainly written by Baltic Dragon and before EC 2/5 got involved in the project. And high drag bombs lost AdA favours after Al Jabber strike raid in 1991. 20° to 30° dive are perfect for CCPL, not so much for CCIP with high drag bomb. There is in this topic a video in game showing the delay between trigger press and bomb release. And the bombs impact roughly were the pipper is at release moment, not at trigger press. You also have Ergo, who worked on Mirage 2000 weapon system coding IRL who explain to you that this delay should be taken into account in the targeting system. And I know him personally, so I’m sure he isn’t a mythomaniac. What he explains means that when the pipper is over the target, the pilot presses the trigger and hold still until bomb release. 0.5s at 500kt is 128m. Sure we can train to press the trigger 0.5s in advance, but this hazardous.

Thanks :thumbup:

Yes. That's AdA conclusion after Al Jaber attack too. Multiple Jaguar A were hit, but they all returned home. On the other hand, Ouadi Doum attack went OK. The thing is that if you pop up, using CCPL makes more sense, it will allow you stand off range from small arm fire and AAA, even from MANPAD if you do it properly. But in a pop up to release high drag bomb at 20° dive angle, you are overly exposed. So IMHO, the manual is wrong. And with speed, you can perform level attack run at 200-300ft.

I know. And how practical is it ? You're even more exposed in that kind of attack run. All the point of high drag bomb is to increase time between bomb separation and impact to give time to the aircraft to leave the bomb blast area. If you dive, you should better use free fall bombs, you would release from further away. During Desert Storm, French Jaguar A attacked Al Jaber air base in Kuwait. They were flying so low they had to climb up for bombs arming delay. (High drag SAMP 250kg and BLG-66 IZ). They released in level flight. During Ouadi Doum raid in Northern Chad it was the same. There was a time when AdA used to perform firing demonstrations for high rank officials. These videos are old and difficult to find. But even the Mirage 2000N were releasing high drag bombs in low altitude level flight.

NO. CCIP on Mirage 2000 isn't meant to be use in dive. There are some missing symbology in the HUD to help the pilot to fly level.

Well done.:thumbup: Then the problem is the delay between the trigger press and the bomb release, and this is the module.

I'm dropping the bombs in pairs and I'm targeting individual trucks. Do as I said, play you video at x0.5, and you will hear the release sound past the target. At least for the last attack run we can hear the release. The X appears past 520kt, and I don't care since it's a bug. That symbol should be for a "too close" (risk of going through fragmentation enveloppe), not for too fast.

I'm sorry, but watching your video in slow motion, it appears that you are pressing the trigger when the CCIP cue is past the target (klong noise at release). You have to prepare to press the trigger just as the cue reaches the target. Maybe there is room for improvement, but it's doable. This isn't perfect text book release, this was a video for someone who couldn't release at all in CCIP. But I do get some hits.:joystick:

With the radar scanning 4 lines, it's covering vertically 32 000ft at 40Nm, 16 000ft at 20Nm. I would say 12 000ft at 15Nm. So the closer, the easier it is to have a contact outside vertical scan zone. SO you have to adjust your radar elevation. Then "cold" targets (tail aspect) are detected much closer than "hot" targets (nose aspect). But really it's the same thing most radar equipped fighters...there is nothing much you can do about it.

First, here is what is written on the PDF provided by Zeus on Page 1 onthis thread: Secondly, this is what I'm trying to explain: there is no definitive list of "this threat code" = "this specific threat" for Mirage 2000C. The number of symbols it can display is limited, so it's customized depending on the threat encountered during the mission. So it would make perfect sense to want to customize the threat library depending on the order of battle of a specific mission (or MP MP map for instance: Caucasus/ Persian Gulf/ Syria...). Thirdly, the Mirage 2000C did participate to air cover for operations over Bosnia and Kosovo (Deny FLight, Deliberate FOrce...). So had to deal with the Serbian Air Defense system, and they were using SA-2, SA-3 and SA-6. http://www.ausairpower.net/APA-2009-04.html HQ-7 is a copy of Crotale SAM system. Crotale was exported to Irak, and Mirage 2000C did participate to CAP over Irak during Gulf War and After (Operation Daguet/ Desert Storm, Alysse/ Southern Watch). These are threats Mirage 2000C had to deal with during its active service. Razbam offered us the possibility to customize decoy program and now SERVAL threat library. My request is just to put those files in a place where it won't be overwritten by each update, like we do for HOTAS profile for instance. Last but not least: your SME are in active service. M-2000C is just one training tool amongst others. They may not think of every aspect of the game, you have a much wider base of customers. But if every time we request something, your answer is "get lost, our SME said so", this isn't very productive :( But I suppose you are following that rule: "The three most dangerous things in the world are a programmer with a soldering iron, a hardware type with a program patch and a user with an idea."

Yes DTC would be great, but it wouldn't solve the missing SA-2 and SA-3. And being able to place a custom file in "saved games" would solve the problem of customization lost after update :smilewink: https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=287891

You have to set your scan elevation. You can use min/ max (x1000ft) next to radar cursor. Big bombers can be detected head on close to 80Nm. Flanker at 47Nm. A little bit less for smaller fighters.

I tried to dig to add these systems myself. I failed, but these radars are not specified in the same files as all the rest. These SAM are WIP and defined in specific files. It must be possible, but I don't know how ?

From what is explained, AdA gave Razbam the symbols that the system can display. I'm adding that from what I saw on other systems, but close to this one: There is no such thing as one real life table. AdA has a unit (called EPIGE) which is managing and programming threat library. They would customize that library on each deployment. So a same symbol can be used for different threats depending on the deployment. I followed Razbam logic. The higher threats are identified individually. But since the number of symbols is limited, sometimes it's a type of threat rather than a specific individual identification. I just added a little bit more discrimination. I had to use what was left available in the alphabet. But overall, anyone guess is as good as mine. :smilewink:

I already posted this link several times, but it will be good for those who missed it. It's the point of view of a British pilot in exchange in the Ads, and flying the Mirage 2000C from 1993 to 1997. Ian Black flew the Mirage 2000C RDI after the Lightning and Tornado F3. It's a good point of view avout what was the Mirage 2000C RDI in the 90'. https://hushkit.net/2016/10/13/mirage-2000-pilot-interview-cutting-it-in-the-electric-cakeslice/

Yes, because nothing else was available :D But it became true with Mirage 2000-5F :thumbup: I would say that indeed it’s a good module to make the transition from FC3 to full fidelity module, because it simple and very handy. It’s true too that you should fly with wingman in MP, with any module, but even more with Fox 1 shooters. But the question was for a module to make his newbie life easier in MP, I don’t think M-2000C will provide that.