Raistlen007 Posted September 12, 2014 Posted September 12, 2014 (edited) Hi everyone, just a quick video I made for the r/hoggit community. I believe some of you may find it helpful. Edited September 12, 2014 by Raistlen007 The youtube wrapper isnt working 3
baltic_dragon Posted September 12, 2014 Posted September 12, 2014 Nice vid and good landing! I was wondering though if anyone had a situation doing a mission when he had to switch to manual reversion? For more information, please visit my website. If you want to reach me with a bug report, feedback or a question, it is best to do this via my Discord channel. Details about the WinWing draw can be found here. Also, please consider following my channel on Facebook.
Raistlen007 Posted September 12, 2014 Author Posted September 12, 2014 I have had a few situations that called for it. It has happened usually after severe structural damage to wing or tail which led to hydraulic failure. The control surfaces stopped working completely, and manual reversion allowed me to regain control of the aircraft.
Teriander Posted September 12, 2014 Posted September 12, 2014 Nice vid and good landing! I was wondering though if anyone had a situation doing a mission when he had to switch to manual reversion? I've had a few occasions where I've lost hydraulics due to damage taken. The best solution I've found was to eject. Still alive baby, still alive. Don't worry, Uncle Sam gives you a new A-10 so fresh and so clean.
Fox One Posted September 13, 2014 Posted September 13, 2014 I find it absolutely unbelievable that after all those years, they still haven't fixed the pitch trim working in reverse in manual reversion mode. My DCS videos
Raistlen007 Posted September 13, 2014 Author Posted September 13, 2014 I find it absolutely unbelievable that after all those years, they still haven't fixed the pitch trim working in reverse in manual reversion mode. It may not be a bug. All the real flight manual says on the topic is that Pitch is trimmable but roll is not. It doesn't say anything about reversal. However, Consider what manual reversion actually does. Instead of the control surfaces being moved under their own power, the electrical trim tabs drive the control surfaces through aerodynamic means. For example, when you pitch down in manual reversion, the elevator trim tabs will move down, increasing aerodynamic lift, causing the tail to rise, causing your nose to dip down. So what happens if you trim down while in manual reversion? well, in normal operation the trim tab would move down to increase the elevator lift to cause the tail to move upward, causing your nose to go down. But in manual reversion, the trim tab going down would cause the elevator to go up. So with the tail lift spoiled, it would go down, causing your nose to go up. I hope that makes sense.
Raistlen007 Posted September 13, 2014 Author Posted September 13, 2014 A-10 trim tab operation and overall aerodynamic response does not differ in manual reversion. The flight manual states that this is incorrect. In manual reversion mode pitch trim is still possible, but roll trim is not possible, since in manual reversion mode aileron control are disconnected from the stick and the stick instead controls the aileron trim tabs. The following is an excerpt form the A-10C flight manual: Selecting MAN REVERSION also closes hydraulic shutoff valves preventing unexpected return to hydraulic powered flight control. Manual reversion trim is provided only in pitch.ROLL MRFCS. To achieve roll control when hydraulic pressure is not present, the flight control mode switch must be set to MAN REVERSION. When MAN REVERSION is selected, stick commands are disconnected from the aileron actuators and connected to the aileron tabs. In this tab drive mode, the aileron tabs fly the aileron surface to the position commanded by the stick. Feel at the stick is proportional to air loads on the tabs.
Yurgon Posted September 13, 2014 Posted September 13, 2014 Hi everyone, just a quick video I made for the r/hoggit community. I believe some of you may find it helpful. Good video, thanks! :thumbup:
Eddie Posted September 13, 2014 Posted September 13, 2014 ...snip... Noodle was referring to pitch trim.
Raistlen007 Posted September 13, 2014 Author Posted September 13, 2014 Noodle was referring to pitch trim. If that's the case, he is probably correct. It sounded like he was referring to the entire trim system, which would be incorrect.
Snoopy Posted September 13, 2014 Posted September 13, 2014 If that's the case, he is probably correct. It sounded like he was referring to the entire trim system, which would be incorrect. Noodle knows A-10, he is correct. Like he said, I have no use for manual reversion because it simply is not modeled correctly in the sim plus even losing both engines I have never lost hydraulics to need manual reversion. If manual reversion behaved the real world like it does in the DCS World almost ever Functional Check Flight after a phase inspection we would be crashing A-10s. This was one of the first bugs I submitted to ED when I was a tester was that with engine loss you didn't lose hydraulic pressure. Needless to say over 4 years later they didn't fix it because they don't believe me and they feel the fans spinning would keep hydraulic pressure from bleeding off. If that was the case we wouldn't have had a manual reversion option designed into the A-10. v303d Fighter Group Discord | Virtual 303d Fighter Group Website
Raistlen007 Posted September 13, 2014 Author Posted September 13, 2014 If that was the case we wouldn't have had a manual reversion option designed into the A-10. You can lose hydraulic pressure without engine loss. There is a famous cause of a pilot landing the A-10 in manual reversion because severe damage to the wing caused hydraulic pressure loss, regardless of engine functionality.
Snoopy Posted September 13, 2014 Posted September 13, 2014 You can lose hydraulic pressure without engine loss. There is a famous cause of a pilot landing the A-10 in manual reversion because severe damage to the wing caused hydraulic pressure loss, regardless of engine functionality. You don't have to tell me about any A-10 famous cases, I've worked A-10s on and off for almost 20 years. Because of this I know exactly how both the right and left hydraulic systems work and that engine failure is not the only way. v303d Fighter Group Discord | Virtual 303d Fighter Group Website
SkateZilla Posted September 13, 2014 Posted September 13, 2014 Have the mission designer trigger Hydraulic failure... I'd like to see a group of 10 people try that mission, as soon as you get in cockpit for air start you loose hydraulics :) Windows 10 Pro, Ryzen 2700X @ 4.6Ghz, 32GB DDR4-3200 GSkill (F4-3200C16D-16GTZR x2), ASRock X470 Taichi Ultimate, XFX RX6800XT Merc 310 (RX-68XTALFD9) 3x ASUS VS248HP + Oculus HMD, Thrustmaster Warthog HOTAS + MFDs
Raistlen007 Posted September 13, 2014 Author Posted September 13, 2014 I Little known fact: the reason why a right engine failure during takeoff is considered more critical than a left engine failure in the A-10, is because the loss of R HYD system pressure will cause the slats to extend a few seconds after losing the engine, increasing drag significantly and resulting in degraded Single-Engine Rate of Climb (SEROC). In DCS, this doesnt happen because hydraulic pressure doesnt bleed off properly. Very informative. Thank you for the additional input.
ApoNOOB Posted September 13, 2014 Posted September 13, 2014 Everyday you learn something new. I guess this is a point for the wishlist?
elchacal Posted September 13, 2014 Posted September 13, 2014 Great vid! It has been very helpful, thanks a lot! :thumbup: [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
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