Downloading up-to-date nVidia drivers will soon require GeForce experience

[SharpeXB]

...

[NineLine]

Wall of text

 

Wound a little tight I think ;)

 

At this point I think you might want to head over to nVidia's site and type walls of text to them, unless this is a campaign to raise up troops against nVidia, which wouldnt be proper for this forum I dont think... either way, time to relax, you dont like it, some people do... meh.. not sure where this thread is going now.

Edited October 21, 2015 by NineLine

[SharpeXB]

When I go to the Startup menu in Windows 10 which is now in Task Manager.

I don't even see GFE listed there. It was there in Windows 7

Does that mean it doesn't even start up in W10?

[NineLine]

When I go to the Startup menu in Windows 10 which is now in Task Manager.

I don't even see GFE listed there. It was there in Windows 7

Does that mean it doesn't even start up in W10?

 

Mine doesnt launch unless I launch it manually, I think if you turn on notifications for driver or software updates something might be running... not sure though, never paid it much attention.

[Yurgon]

either way, time to relax, you dont like it, some people do... meh.. not sure where this thread is going now.

 

In circles, I guess. :)

 

The thing is, people keep saying it's not all that bad and why is it bad and why don't you just accept it and you can easily switch it off and just ignore it if you don't like it.

 

I felt I had to give a more in-depth reply, which I did. And now people are probably going to pick out individual points and tackle them or repeat things that had been said several times already, by which time I will feel compelled to respond once again, and then you will say that we are going in circles and then we can just link to this post instead of running yet another iteration of the same discussion. :smartass:

[SharpeXB]

Hey this is interesting.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2015/07/25/windows-10-automatic-update-problems/

 

Although it might be old news. Windows 10 updates are mandatory and include(ed?) driver upodates that conflicted with GFE. I'm not getting driver updates from W10 afaik?

 

But the idea of forced updates is clearly to reduce problems. Maybe the GFE being mandatory thing is along the same lines.

 

Conspiracy theory:

MS: We are tired of people complaining that their PCs don't work because they didn't run updates so we're going to make them mandatory. That includes graphics cards

 

Nvidia: Hey you're interfering with our program that does the same thing.

 

MS: ok here's the deal. You can use your own program but it has to be mandatory too.

 

Nvida: ok deal.

Edited October 21, 2015 by SharpeXB

[dburne]

The driver update deal with Windows 10 is one of the main reasons I have not gone with Windows 10 at this point.

[SharpeXB]

Well if you have W10 then you can ditch GFE and get your drivers from MS apparently.

[sobek]

What freedom is being snatched away by this simple little program, which is really no more than a fancy control panel...

 

Because it's not ok to demand usage data from me in return for up to date drivers. I pay for the hardware. Contrary to the bonkers TOS that corporations like facebook sport, that makes me a customer and not a product.

 

It starts with people being ok with stuff like this or the steam EULA and through those peoples sheer ignorance of data security and what can be accomplished with the data they so readily give away we end up with some governments not seeing any harm in successively undermining or even outlawing PGP, the TOR network, etc. You see why i don't want to discuss this here? :P

[NineLine]

Because it's not ok to demand usage data from me in return for up to date drivers. I pay for the hardware. Contrary to the bonkers TOS that corporations like facebook sport, that makes me a customer and not a product.

 

It starts with people being ok with stuff like this or the steam EULA and through those peoples sheer ignorance we end up with some governments not seeing any harm in successively undermining or even outlawing the PGP, the TOR network, etc. You see why i don't want to discuss this here? :P

 

Sorry, I must have left my tin foil hat in my other pants... :D

 

No doubt the fall of man kind is started with nVidia collecting data on their customers! ;)

 

Anyways, my opinion is its fine. Just my opinion of course.

[SharpeXB]

So you want them to make all these great products for you but don't want to give them the data that helps them do it?

[sobek]

No doubt the fall of man kind is started with nVidia collecting data on their customers!

 

No, but nice strawman. :thumbup:

 

Case in point, i guess.

[sobek]

So you want them to make all these great products for you but don't want to give them the data that helps them do it?

 

How come they did just fine until now?

 

If they want my data, they should ask.

[cichlidfan]

I gave up on my data when I applied for a home mortgage. :P

[Toxe]

Why on earth are people so adamant that any additional software that scans for games and allows taking videos and performs convenience tasks should be bundled with the driver? It's simply bloat. It's not needed for the driver, nor is it needed for the OS or any application that uses the hardware.

 

It's a convenience tool, and while it may be the nicest convenience tool on the planet (though many people who ran it made statements to the contrary), it's still nothing more than an additional tool (see how I snuck in the word "additional"? ;)).

 

For a lot of people GFE is probably a pretty neat tool that adds some welcome features to their gaming experience. (Not for me though, but who cares.) And to get it out there to people bundling is basically the only option.

 

If people would have to go to the Nvidia site and look for an additional download no one would use it.

 

Well, I guess the other option would be going the Windows route of bugging the hell out of users with "Here is something you should know!" popups or notifications, but **** that.

 

So yeah, adding it to the driver was the only sensible thing Nvidia could have done to get it out into the wild. Nothing wrong here.

 

What is wrong of course is installing it by default, without telling people exactly what they get and what it is for and not giving them a clear and easy choice, and all that account and data collecting stuff.

[SharpeXB]

Running Windows 10. GFE does not even launch when you start up. I dot remember how 7 was, I know you could disable it there in config.

 

You have to launch it separately. Even when it's running it hardly uses any resources.

 

I get the whole avoiding bloatware issue. It's a fine concept. But in reality any of these background processes will slow your PC down as much as carrying and extra grocery bag in the trunk slows down a Ferrari.

[NeilWillis]

 

What is wrong of course is installing it by default, without telling people exactly what they get and what it is for and not giving them a clear and easy choice, and all that account and data collecting stuff.

 

So why is it you're happy to give your bank manager all this data and far more when they are about as trustworthy as a ferret in a chicken coop, but when it comes to other commercial organisations that just want info regarding who you are, what you have (mostly for guarantee purposes anyway), and other basic stuff that is not sensitive, and will not in any way result in compromise to you?

 

Car insurance companies happily tell all and sundry that you had a crash x years ago, and sell it to anyone ready to buy it. To buy groceries or fuel, you will end up with a loyalty card account with just the same account details and sales trending records.

 

How is Nvidia bucking any trends by keeping an account for you, which you have already consented to when you registered for your guarantee just like with any other purchase, and as they and any other company already have done for decades?

 

Oh and they don't just install software without your consent either, so please stop implying that they might! You have clear and easy choices - install updates automatically with an efficient tool, which it is up to you whether you use or not, or don't!

 

Just stop making out it is some kind of hardship or conspiracy, it is neither, and it won't eat up all your computer resources either, so don't suggest that. It is just a simple, efficient, easy way to keep your graphics card running, and up to date! It isn't a sinister plot to take over the world, wreck your gaming experience or rob you!

Edited October 22, 2015 by NeilWillis

[jay43]

The only people that should be worried about data collection is the ones that have something to hide the low life scum that look and download sick pictures and videos of kids.

One the hardest things to police is the internet and if signing up and agreeing to data collection with companies like MS, Intel, Nvidia, etc etc helps the authorities find and ween out these low life scum then i'll sign up cause i have nothing to hide.

You can not get away from data collection, even if you don't agree to it someone is still watching and monitoring.

[BaconSarnie]

Im one of those people online who refuses to sign up to this and that cos I dont want my details out there, I refuse to install bloatware progs that everyone else uses etc etc etc

I've been using GFE with Nvidia drivers since it came out pretty much. I see no issue with using it. I just dl the drivers and install it all, no ifs no buts no worries.

I cant see the issue many of you have using it.

[dburne]

Guys no offense, but this is really getting far away from the issue being discussed. The issue is Nvidia's decision that beginning in December, to get the latest driver updates will require an installation of GeForce Experience, which to date has been an optional program that includes features some may like and prefer to use, and some may have no use for.

 

There are many PC enthusiasts, such as myself, that prefer to control what programs they have installed and use and do not care for having to have extra software they really don't need or want, just to be able to get the latest drivers - something we have always been able to do.

 

Perhaps someday I will give GFE a try, and who knows maybe really like it. Currently the only thing in there I might have interest in is Shadow Play, but I am not that interested just yet.

 

But I like that being an option for me, rather than a requirement. Currently there is nothing in the program that I feel I would want or use, and would rather not have it installed to get the latest driver update from Nvidia.

[SharpeXB]

It's an incredible 70 pages written about a little process that uses about 2mb of your RAM when it's running in the background. And the min system spec for DCS is a machine with 8,000mb of RAM

 

And if that performance hit is something you can't tolerate, the service can be disabled in about 4 seconds on your startup config.

[Toxe]

So why is it you're happy to give your bank manager all this data and far more when they are about as trustworthy as a ferret in a chicken coop, but when it comes to other commercial organisations that just want info regarding who you are, what you have (mostly for guarantee purposes anyway), and other basic stuff that is not sensitive, and will not in any way result in compromise to you?

 

It isn't even that much about giving data. The real question is: Why do they want it in the first place, what are they going to do with it and how can they make sure that this data doesn't fall into the wrong hands or gets stolen or abused? (Spoiler: They can't. And they never will.)

 

We are already giving away enough personal information about ourselves (and worse: friends and family) to companies and governments so the reaction should not be "oh, what harm could it be if I provide data to one more company?".

 

The only people that should be worried about data collection is the ones that have something to hide [..]

[..] and if signing up and agreeing to data collection with companies like MS, Intel, Nvidia, etc etc helps the authorities find and ween out these low life scum then i'll sign up cause i have nothing to hide.

 

You are joking, right? I mean... you don't seriously believe this, right? :lol:

 

70 pages [..] 2mb of RAM

 

You might want to check your numbers.

[dburne]

It's an incredible 70 pages written about a little process that uses about 2mb of your RAM when it's running in the background. And the min system spec for DCS is a machine with 8,000mb of RAM

 

And if that performance hit is something you can't tolerate, the service can be disabled in about 4 seconds on your startup config.

 

It is not about the program itself, it is there now available for anyone that would like to us it, as an option.

I am not debating the merits of the program, how large or small the process is, how much ram it uses, or how it might be disabled in the startup.

 

It is about Nvidia requiring it in order for users to have access to the latest drivers. This is a large change from the business practices they have done for years. I do not care for that path they are going down. And I am certainly not alone in this line of thinking.

[SharpeXB]

You might want to check your numbers.

In W10, in Control Panel, as near as I can tell "GeForce Experience Service (I think that's it?) is using about 2mb in the background.

When the program is actually launched (which you don't need to do even to run Shadowplay) it uses about 250mb. Which is still nothing but you don't even need to run it at all while gaming.

My machine has 32,000 mb of RAM so I won't bother disabling it.

 

And regarding data (from the link at the beginning of this thread)

"Q: What data does GeForce Experience send to NVIDIA?

A: The application collects data needed to recommend the correct driver update and optimal settings including hardware configuration, operating system, language, installed games, game settings, game usage, game performance, and current driver version. If a user is not signed into an NVIDIA account, this data is not personally identifiable. If a user is signed into an NVIDIA account, the data is personally identifiable. All data collected is protected by NVIDIA's privacy policy."

 

Eagle Dynamics probably has more personally identifiable data on you than Nvidia does.

[NineLine]

No, but nice strawman. :thumbup:

 

Case in point, i guess.

 

Not all data collection is for nefarious reasons is my only point. Generally nVidia seems like they only want to offer better products, I cant see much more than that from anything they suck out of my PC... If you people would fill out those registration cards in the box this would have never happened :P