Mirage 2000 Discussion (On Topic Only)

[Azrayen]

That is all correct and modeled as such :)

Cool!! :thumbup:

 

The only thing not incorporated is the 40kg pull allowing that extra emergency performance. (...)

We have thought of the following possiblities: 1. An emergency button/key that while pressed and at full stick deflection will engage the extra performance. 2. When pulled back all the way for some period of time it kicks in

 

Would love to hear thoughts on the issue.

Best course I think is to let player choose which option he prefers (through option>special you can add the checkbox you want there).

Regarding the timer: Like Teeter, I think it should be very short, in order to:

- allow the pilot to pull max (physical) joystick deflection then

-- stay there if he want to override the elastic stop

-- relax pressure a little bit if he want to stay at the simulated elastic stop

I haven't made-up my mind regarding the reversed timer (i.e. limitation to x seconds before automatically going back to elastic stop. Not sure it's useful... nor appropried.

 

ED supposedly does this with the Su-27, where the hard stops can be reached by holding down the wheelbrake button/key while inflight.

Interesting, didn't remember that, will definitely have to try.

A good idea for choice of control (avoid to dedicate another button to this).

 

Azrayen : are you certain about the 290°/s roll rate ? I thought it was 270

See jojo's answer, couldn't have done better. :)

[Home Fries]

What did we do this time?

;)

Just a reference to the S-3 Viking tanker, albeit with homage to the classic Monty Python skit.

And FWIW, I am an honorary Norwegian. :D

[Corrigan]

Just a reference to the S-3 Viking tanker, albeit with homage to the classic Monty Python skit.

 

I did catch that, just couldn't resist. Although I have to add, once Viggen is released people on multiplayer servers will start saying that a lot more. :D

[Ganesh]

The only thing not incorporated is the 40kg pull allowing that extra emergency performance. We have not figured out a slick way of introducing it as it is something that shouldn't be part of normal flight and it's hard to simulate the effect of having to pull back 40kg (which is a hell of a lot) on a desktop joystick.

 

We have thought of the following possiblities: 1. An emergency button/key that while pressed and at full stick deflection will engage the extra performance. 2. When pulled back all the way for some period of time it kicks in

 

Would love to hear thoughts on the issue.

 

Ok, how about this:

 

You are in flight and pull back the stick completly (e.g. our heavy fat TM WH stick)

Then you press a button (a strong one would be best) and HOLD IT!

Holding it you go now in neutral position, release and pull then the imagined 40kilos.

The AC stands in its position of course like a trimmer set (reminds me on my huey trimmer)

 

So you have something to do (imaginary) and you need a little bit of time for 0,5-1sec.

 

I would like this procedure if it´s realistic & possible but... i have my doubts now.

What do you think?

[pered]

I did catch that, just couldn't resist. Although I have to add, once Viggen is released people on multiplayer servers will start saying that a lot more. :D

 

Because they'll be spaming those AIM120s at us.

[fixen]

Ok, how about this:

 

You are in flight and pull back the stick completly (e.g. our heavy fat TM WH stick)

Then you press a button (a strong one would be best) and HOLD IT!

Holding it you go now in neutral position, release and pull then the imagined 40kilos.

The AC stands in its position of course like a trimmer set (reminds me on my huey trimmer)

 

So you have something to do (imaginary) and you need a little bit of time for 0,5-1sec.

 

I would like this procedure if it´s realistic & possible but... i have my doubts now.

What do you think?

 

I like your idea. Personally I don't like the idea of pulling the stick back and after a while it kicks in (or immediately). What if i wan't to make a looping on max but without using the emergency stick pull.

[smnwrx]

Bloody Vikings! :D

 

Hoover love

[jvanhoog]

Button press please.

[OxideMako]

I like your idea. Personally I don't like the idea of pulling the stick back and after a while it kicks in (or immediately). What if i wan't to make a looping on max but without using the emergency stick pull.

 

Yeah, should just do it the same way they do on the SU-27. (hold a button down for the duration) The time delay thing would screw up tight turns when you don't want to use the elastic stop.

[Ultra]

I'm in favor of a button as well.

[wolle]

Sorry if this has been answered before: will the mirage originally ship (in the coming days) with a simplified flight model or external flight model?

[Azrayen]

@ wolle: it hasn't been answered more than a few dozen times :D (kidding, ask away!)

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=152890 see page 2

 

@ CptSmiley: cool :)

[Corrigan]

I think that'll work out great, CptSmiley. Thanks for listening to our feedback!

[Svend_Dellepude]

I vote for the button option as well.

Full aft and then press and hold a button is a good way to do it.

In fact that's what i have done in target on my F-15 profile.

Full aft will only do 8G's, a press of the paddle gives around 9G and when i release im back to 8.

[wolle]

It will feature EFM boss :)

 

That's excellent news!

[Home Fries]

Okay guys talking about it and seeing your opinion, we're going to go with the button situation for now. That would prevent any unexpected behavior and it is being done the same way as other modules.

 

For us, it will be the AP Disconnect button on the HOTAS stick. Keep in mind this is different than the AP Standby button that just temporarily disengages autopilot.

 

So the AP Disconnect button always will disconnect AP if active, but will also allow the usage of the stick hard stop while pressed

 

Where are the AP Disconnect and AP Standby buttons on the actual M2000 HOTAS?

 

Reason I ask is if you think about the TM Warthog, the stick is essentially the same as the F-16. On the F-16, the paddle switch (which doesn't exist on the A-10C but is there on the TM Warthog) is used for AP Standby, and that seems to be the perfect button for enabling the mechanical stop (it's also the button I use for wheel brakes when required).

 

I do like to map things as closely to the source aircraft HOTAS as possible, hence the reason for the question.

Edited December 15, 2015 by Home Fries

[Croaker47]

Yeah, good choice on the button. Sometimes you just have to yank and bank, and it's better if that's a more predictable experience (Like if you have to yank and you want a max-g from the start).

[Dee-Jay]

... Do not know if it has been already said (?) ... but on M2000, paddle works the opposite of many A/C.

 

The paddle I am talking about is the black part on this picture:

 

 

While on F-16 (for instance) pressing the paddle is to put the A/P into STBY, on M2000, when paddle is pressed, A/P is set to "standby" and you got the full manual control (including trims). When paddle is depressed, (depending on, if, no advanced AP mode are selected) A/P is going into a sort of CWS (Control Wheel Steering like in B737, or equivalent to the Attitude mode on F-16) and the aircraft is automatically trimmed for this attitude (IIRC, if pitch and roll is less than 10° ... but I am not 100% sure about the values)

Edited December 15, 2015 by Dee-Jay

[OxideMako]

Okay guys talking about it and seeing your opinion, we're going to go with the button situation for now. That would prevent any unexpected behavior and it is being done the same way as other modules.

 

For us, it will be the AP Disconnect button on the HOTAS stick. Keep in mind this is different than the AP Standby button that just temporarily disengages autopilot.

 

So the AP Disconnect button always will disconnect AP if active, but will also allow the usage of the stick hard stop while pressed

 

Awesome! Good to see developers who keep their customers concerns in mind:smilewink:

[Hook47]

Okay guys talking about it and seeing your opinion, we're going to go with the button situation for now. That would prevent any unexpected behavior and it is being done the same way as other modules.

 

For us, it will be the AP Disconnect button on the HOTAS stick. Keep in mind this is different than the AP Standby button that just temporarily disengages autopilot.

 

So the AP Disconnect button always will disconnect AP if active, but will also allow the usage of the stick hard stop while pressed

 

Perfect! Thanks a ton for taking our input

[Aginor]

Sounds like a good solution, thanks for the update, CptSmiley!

[OnlyforDCS]

I wonder if anything could be done with FFB sticks, maybe some kind of increased resistance could be programmed in, past a certain point?

[Para_Bellum]

The button solution is IMO the best choice.

[Conroy]

About EFM, a nice video. It's really an amazing nice toy!

 

[ame]

[/ame]

[PiedDroit]

Okay guys talking about it and seeing your opinion, we're going to go with the button situation for now. That would prevent any unexpected behavior and it is being done the same way as other modules.

 

For us, it will be the AP Disconnect button on the HOTAS stick. Keep in mind this is different than the AP Standby button that just temporarily disengages autopilot.

 

So the AP Disconnect button always will disconnect AP if active, but will also allow the usage of the stick hard stop while pressed

Will there be an option not to use the button?

Without any timer or whatever, just get max G when going to full range?

In my case the full range is already hard to reach, I don't need a button on top of that, would be nice to have a choice.

Thanks