DCS World - F-14B Tomcat by Heatblur Simulations - AIM-54A-Mk60 - Tacview Debrief

[Jabbers_]

[OnlyforDCS]

 

Part II! Nice! Thank you Jabbers, keep em coming! :thumbup:

[Sam]

Perfect timing ! Thank you !

[OnlyforDCS]

Perfect timing ! Thank you !

 

I think Nick (BlackLion) mentioned that there was a way to launch the Phoenix so it burns directly off the rail (without the drop off) and so it doesn't loft.

 

This could help with close range shots.

 

Did you manage to see or test any of that Jabbers?

[CaptJodan]

Really enjoying these looks into missile behavior. I've enjoyed all the preview videos of the Tomcat, but this series definitely touches on the big question mark that has been on my mind since this aircraft was started. Glad to be able to know a little about what to expect (if you're ready for the missile) when the module drops.

[DefaultFace]

I think Nick (BlackLion) mentioned that there was a way to launch the Phoenix so it burns directly off the rail (without the drop off) and so it doesn't loft.

 

This could help with close range shots.

 

Did you manage to see or test any of that Jabbers?

 

If you watch videos of them IRL most of them tend to ignite much sooner than in DCS. They drop, almost immediately ignite, but continue falling a bit till they pick up speed, and about the time they ignite in DCS, is where they pitch up again to level and then loft away.

 

That being said this might be one of those things about the missiles that is DCS controlled, and can't be changed by HB atm.

[Strikeeagle345]

If you watch videos of them IRL most of them tend to ignite much sooner than in DCS. They drop, almost immediately ignite, but continue falling a bit till they pick up speed, and about the time they ignite in DCS, is where they pitch up again to level and then loft away.

 

That being said this might be one of those things about the missiles that is DCS controlled, and can't be changed by HB atm.

 

Yeah, i believe the second it leaves (no longer attached to the jet) the aircraft its all in DCS / EDs hands at that point.

[OnlyforDCS]

Okay managed to find Blacklion213's post on this. . Here is the relevant part of the quote:

 

Also, there is a very handy ACM mode for the missile. Once selected, the missile can simply be boresighted against targets at closer than 10 nm and the missile comes off the rail within a second of pressing the trigger (vs 3 seconds for a conventional launch). You don't need a radar lock, just pull the trigger and it finds the target quite reliably. The motor will also still be burning when it finds its target, so it has plenty of energy to chase and torment.

 

Yeah launching with the ACM boresight mode within 10nm is going to be crazy scary.

[DefaultFace]

Sounds more or less the same as a Maddog shot with the 120s.

[Whiskey11]

I think a large part of what we are seeing with the close range shots is the 7G limit that was put on the missile while the motor is burning to give it the correct loft behavior. I remember HB mentioning that the way DCS's missiles work, to get proper loft behavior they had to put that 7G limit in place or the missile wouldn't loft at all. I think it was in their white paper on the Phoenix?

 

It'd be nice if ED would give missiles a more accurate missile track. It's ESPECIALLY telling on the longer range shots how the Phoenix bleeds energy almost immediately after the loft and doesn't track down from the loft altitude without pulling insane G and losing all of it's energy when a more gentle descent would retain energy better.

[Jabbers_]

Sounds more or less the same as a Maddog shot with the 120s.

 

What?

[Jabbers_]

I think a large part of what we are seeing with the close range shots is the 7G limit that was put on the missile while the motor is burning to give it the correct loft behavior. I remember HB mentioning that the way DCS's missiles work, to get proper loft behavior they had to put that 7G limit in place or the missile wouldn't loft at all. I think it was in their white paper on the Phoenix?

 

It'd be nice if ED would give missiles a more accurate missile track. It's ESPECIALLY telling on the longer range shots how the Phoenix bleeds energy almost immediately after the loft and doesn't track down from the loft altitude without pulling insane G and losing all of it's energy when a more gentle descent would retain energy better.

 

Exactly this, HOWEVER, they adjusted that parameter today to make the missile a bit more aggressive, so further testing is now needed ;)

[Whiskey11]

Exactly this, HOWEVER, they adjusted that parameter today to make the missile a bit more aggressive, so further testing is now needed ;)

 

Awesome!!!! :joystick:

 

What?

 

Maddoging an AIM-120 means you launch it without a radar lock by "bore sighting" it like you would an AIM-9. It goes active when it leaves the rail and locks onto whatever the radar sees first. Useful if your F/A-18C's radar is AWOL while trying to lock onto a target coaltitude and closing with you... it really only works within 10nmi.

Edited January 24, 2019 by Whiskey11

[Eldur]

Yeah launching with the ACM boresight mode within 10nm is going to be crazy scary.

 

Even without that the 54 is going to be a total "game changer" in an environment in which practically all other missiles can easily be spoiled while being asleep at the stick if shot at more than 6nm...

[Sealpup]

Maddoging an AIM-120 means you launch it without a radar lock by "bore sighting" it like you would an AIM-9...

 

Almost right. 'Maddog' means the missile has no datalink support, and is thus looking for the brightest radar return to kill. That could mean a boresight shot, but it could also mean it was locked and fired normally and the launching aircraft needed to break lock for some reason (IE sudden need to go defensive).

[umkhunto]

Exactly this, HOWEVER, they adjusted that parameter today to make the missile a bit more aggressive, so further testing is now needed ;)

Test everything. Repeat.

[Jabbers_]

Awesome!!!! :joystick:

 

 

 

Maddoging an AIM-120 means you launch it without a radar lock by "bore sighting" it like you would an AIM-9. It goes active when it leaves the rail and locks onto whatever the radar sees first. Useful if your F/A-18C's radar is AWOL while trying to lock onto a target coaltitude and closing with you... it really only works within 10nmi.

 

I know what Maddog is, i was more concerned with his comment saying it sounds more like maddoging a 120 and how it at all applied to this video.

[DefaultFace]

Uhhh, replying to the guy above me.....? Not sure what there is to be confused about...

[Jabbers_]

Uhhh, replying to the guy above me.....? Not sure what there is to be confused about...

I was originally asking you what? You said sounds like a maddog 120... but nothing in this video sounds like that. So if you could explain what you meant maybe we can get some clarification.

[pimp]

Mad Dog 2020 :)

[Bad Idea Hat]

Mad Dog 2020 :)

 

 

 

 

"Why is the MiG-21 is a ground crew favorite?"

[DefaultFace]

I was originally asking you what? You said sounds like a maddog 120... but nothing in this video sounds like that. So if you could explain what you meant maybe we can get some clarification.

 

I was replying to the post above mine. The one talking about shooting Phoenixs in ACM mode to go hunt for whatever the onboard Radar deems fit. Kind of like what you can do with the 120...

[turkeydriver]

I was replying to the post above mine. The one talking about shooting Phoenixs in ACM mode to go hunt for whatever the onboard Radar deems fit. Kind of like what you can do with the 120...

 

pretty much the same- The AIM-54C and AIM-120- at least A and B? share the same TWT IIRC.

[Jabbers_]

I was replying to the post above mine. The one talking about shooting Phoenixs in ACM mode to go hunt for whatever the onboard Radar deems fit. Kind of like what you can do with the 120...

 

Sorry, I didnt get that.

[Coxy_99]

ECM FTW