Flying the Tomcat in VR, during moonless night

[Kenan]

Flying the Tomcat in VR during daytime is pretty challenging to me, having to look/focus hard at the airspeed and altitude gauges in order to be able to read them, and at the same time, look in front of me to regain my situational awarness.

 

 

It's not a big deal..after some time, I got the hang of it..however, flying during night (no moon) is a completely different story.

 

 

I have to use Night Goggles in order to figure out where I'm flying..but at the same time, I have to turn them off every time I want to check my altitude and airspeed gauges...which in turn makes the flying a real pain in the a** and I get disoriented quite often...sometimes close to hitting the deck...

 

 

How do you guys fly at night? Bare in mind..I'm referring to moonless, pitch-dark nights...in Hornet, I can see my altitude and speed indicators right in front of me and relying on instrument flying is a lot easier..especially keeping the altitude steady..(by manual way, not by using autopilot)

 

 

 

in Tomcat, during night, having to look low to the left every few seconds and than look back at the HUD makes me completely loose awarness of my surrounding..

 

 

Any tips, hints, would be appeaciated...

[TonyG]

Instrument flying (on steam gauges) takes practice. I'm comfortable flying in most phases of flight without NVGs, AAR and NOE flying being the exceptions.

 

 

 

You need to develop a scan between instruments, to detect trends and stop them, on the steam gauges. With practice, it's actually easier than flying with digital displays.

 

 

Practice, practice, practice. I find the immersion on night flights in the Tomcat to be amazing in VR.

[Longiron]

Flying instruments doesn’t require you to heads up and look out the canopy.

I’m not going to lie, I took the cat for a swim a few times because of panic when I can’t see the horizon at night over the water.

 

Learning to trust the instruments, ie not having to bring you’re head up in a panic looking for the ship, takes practice.

Everything you need is right in front of you, the ADI is excellent and all gauges are right next to it, making it easy to keep it all in sight and monitor them all together.

[probad]

tomcat's hud is not a flight instrument, your scan doesnt need to go up

[Kenan]

Thanks for the reply guys..so, I guess I should just focus completely on instruments..wonder if RL pilots followed that route under the same conditions..I mean, flying in pitch dark in a simulator, solely relying on instruments is scary enough...could only imagine what it must have felt like for the real pilots..

[probad]

it's just basic ifr. even civilians can get certified in it.

there's a hood in the l-39 to ensure the trainee uses only the instruments.

 

the all-weather interceptor is a pedigree running back to the night fighters of ww2, you bet your ass they flew on nothing but the instruments the whole time.

interception in general was a heads-down affair, aircraft like the f-106 have atrocious views out the windscreen. instrument flying was requisite because flying by the numbers is how you nail the most efficient intercept geometry.

 

the f-14's console is laid out pretty logically for heads down flying with such dominating vdi and hsi displays. details like the scrolling poop squares on the vdi which help against disorientation scream for it.

Edited April 30, 2019 by probad

[Sandman1330]

Flying on NVG, we position the goggles such that we can see underneath them simply by moving the eye. They don’t sit right against the eyes, one can look around them.

 

You then look through the goggles at the outside, and under/around them to see the instruments. Think of having 2 toilet paper tubes about an inch from your eyes, you can still see around them.

 

DCS doesn’t allow this in VR, as the goggle takes up your entire field of view. It’s been requested before to have it only take the center of your view to allow us to look around them, but not yet implemented.

[WindyTX]

Flying on NVG, we position the goggles such that we can see underneath them simply by moving the eye. They don’t sit right against the eyes, one can look around them.

 

You then look through the goggles at the outside, and under/around them to see the instruments. Think of having 2 toilet paper tubes about an inch from your eyes, you can still see around them.

 

DCS doesn’t allow this in VR, as the goggle takes up your entire field of view. It’s been requested before to have it only take the center of your view to allow us to look around them, but not yet implemented.

Yep requested a multitude of times over the last 3 years still no joy, the VR NVG mod breaks integrity unfortunately.

 

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk

[Larkis]

There is a NVR VR Mod? Please Link :D

[WindyTX]

Sorry I haven't got it anymore I think it may have just been on DCS1.5.

 

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk

[Jazz_44]

It really depends on what stage of flight you're struggling with at night. I assume it would mainly be a Case 3 recovery.

 

Remember that in the F14, the actual speed is not important as your AOA is the key. As long as you keep 15 units AOA, you are "on speed" and that can be easily read on the AOA indexer with VR and NVG at night, or just by using the instrument lights.

 

Altitude below 1000ft is available on the HUD as well as your VSI when set to landing mode. hope this helps.

[VF31_Subsonic]

my issue flying at night in vr with the rift is more about the fact that it looks like your looking through dirty lenses reflecting light back at you more than anything. The instrument scan is no issue especially with the design of the cat. I have to jack my gamma way do to counter the said lens affect.

[Kenan]

Altitude below 1000ft is available on the HUD as well as your VSI when set to landing mode. hope this helps.

 

 

I did set the HUD to landing mode but couldn't find this info. Could you please clarify?

[Bad Idea Hat]

Reading the book Flight of the Intruder made me learn that my only useful reference would be the internal gauges. I'm strictly head down on launch, and almost completely head down until the ball call on recovery. I've even started turning the flashlight on and pointing it at the backup horizon.

[Strikeeagle345]

I did set the HUD to landing mode but couldn't find this info. Could you please clarify?

 

that ALT tape on the HUD is slaved to the Radar Altimeter. Make sure you have it on for it to work.

[Skyspin]

Hello Everybody,

For flying at night, very dark night you might be interested in this CASE 3 mission for the F-14 and F-18...

Link: https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/3301552/

[Tinkickef]

Thanks for the reply guys..so, I guess I should just focus completely on instruments..wonder if RL pilots followed that route under the same conditions..I mean, flying in pitch dark in a simulator, solely relying on instruments is scary enough...could only imagine what it must have felt like for the real pilots..

 

Real life pilots in IMC weather, where there is no external visibility, keep their head movements to an absolute minimum. It helps avoid getting the leans.

You scan the blind flying panel by moving the eyes not the head where ever possible.

 

I was not instrument rated, but had an instrument awareness flight during training, literally flying a much loved and ill treated C172 into cloud, then attempting to turn around immediately and exit it again. It was like flying in a bowl of milk. On starting the turn to the left, it immediately felt like I was leaning to the right, because of my vestibular system giving erroneous messages, reacting to the new acceleration vector.

Moving the head to look around the cockpit would very quickly make things worse as was pointed out by the instructor.

 

Without the prompting of the instructor, particularly in regard to keeping tabs on the VSI, it is pretty obvious I would have died fairly quickly.

 

I seem to remember that VSI having a mind of its own and steadfastly avoiding staying at zero, much preferring to be around the 200 fpm mark and worse. So porpoising around the turn with maybe a 500ft total vertical divergence from the given altitude, and quite a few knots above or below the given airspeed made me realise that instruments were not cool and clouds were to be avoided.

So maybe 250ft above and below the set altitude in a turn executed like a playful dolphin. The instructor once we had a view out the cockpit again, wryly pointed out that the expected standard of deviation on instruments was less than 50ft. Superhuman stuff. I thought I was Orville Wright and Chuck Yeager rolled into one. I found I was not. Very humbling experience.

 

I found it amazing how quickly things go south on instruments if you don't keep up the required scan, process the information and react immediately. God knows what partial panel is like....

 

In those days, home PC flight sims were not around, and I have not set foot in a cockpit since the early - mid 90s, so I have no idea how I would fare on instruments in real life now, but my recollection of that flight seems to be that RL instrument flying is far more disorienting than it is on a sim.

 

So as my instructor said...just swivel those eyes.

 

It would be interesting to hear our IMC rated, RL jet jockeys comments on this.

Edited May 5, 2019 by Tinkickef

[Sandman1330]

I don’t have a lot of actual IMC time as the helicopter I fly isn’t rated for icing (which we get a lot of up here in Canada), but the biggest thing they emphasized for us during both fixed wing and helicopter IFR training is to memorize attitude and power settings. Attitude + power = performance. So at a given speed, you should be flying a given attitude and power setting. Maintain this attitude through your turns and you will maintain altitude. Crosscheck the altimeter and airspeed to ensure you’re still on. Don’t use the VSI, especially in older aircraft as the amount of lag in that instrument is significant. You’ll see the altimeter hand start to move before the VSI moves accurately.

 

As for the leans, I’ve never really had an issue with them. Like I said, I haven’t done much actual IMC, but it’s never been much of an issue. I find you’re most likely to get out of sorts transitioning to instruments from visual (as you enter cloud), it takes a few seconds to get the brain to make the transition.

[VF31_Subsonic]

my issue flying at night in vr with the rift is more about the fact that it looks like your looking through dirty lenses reflecting light back at you more than anything. The instrument scan is no issue especially with the design of the cat. I have to jack my gamma way do to counter the said lens affect.

 

 

Found this to help

 

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/6tca7t/why_you_may_need_to_disable_spud_oled_mura/https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/6tca7t/why_you_may_need_to_disable_spud_oled_mura/https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/6tca7t/why_you_may_need_to_disable_spud_oled_mura/https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/6tca7t/why_you_may_need_to_disable_spud_oled_mura/

[WindyTX]

Real life pilots in IMC weather, where there is no external visibility, keep their head movements to an absolute minimum. It helps avoid getting the leans.

You scan the blind flying panel by moving the eyes not the head where ever possible.

 

I was not instrument rated, but had an instrument awareness flight during training, literally flying a much loved and ill treated C172 into cloud, then attempting to turn around immediately and exit it again. It was like flying in a bowl of milk. On starting the turn to the left, it immediately felt like I was leaning to the right, because of my vestibular system giving erroneous messages, reacting to the new acceleration vector.

Moving the head to look around the cockpit would very quickly make things worse as was pointed out by the instructor.

 

Without the prompting of the instructor, particularly in regard to keeping tabs on the VSI, it is pretty obvious I would have died fairly quickly.

 

I seem to remember that VSI having a mind of its own and steadfastly avoiding staying at zero, much preferring to be around the 200 fpm mark and worse. So porpoising around the turn with maybe a 500ft total vertical divergence from the given altitude, and quite a few knots above or below the given airspeed made me realise that instruments were not cool and clouds were to be avoided.

So maybe 250ft above and below the set altitude in a turn executed like a playful dolphin. The instructor once we had a view out the cockpit again, wryly pointed out that the expected standard of deviation on instruments was less than 50ft. Superhuman stuff. I thought I was Orville Wright and Chuck Yeager rolled into one. I found I was not. Very humbling experience.

 

I found it amazing how quickly things go south on instruments if you don't keep up the required scan, process the information and react immediately. God knows what partial panel is like....

 

In those days, home PC flight sims were not around, and I have not set foot in a cockpit since the early - mid 90s, so I have no idea how I would fare on instruments in real life now, but my recollection of that flight seems to be that RL instrument flying is far more disorienting than it is on a sim.

 

So as my instructor said...just swivel those eyes.

 

It would be interesting to hear our IMC rated, RL jet jockeys comments on this.

I have had the leans quite a lot IRL normally when I was flying close formation in cloud as your head is stuck looking at a 45 angle. I used to just get my back seater to talk to me about our actual attitude I also had a slightly weird case of it on the wing the other day in cloud doing a case 2 but it wasn't quite the same, and Jester didn't do a very good talk through of our attitude.

 

With regards to actual instrument flying your scan is everything and needs to be practiced. In order to get accurate it needs to be pretty fast and unless you fly a non HUD aircraft regularly it's hard to stay accurate ( Also I am a bit of a HUD / Glass cripple as I haven't flown steam guages since the Hawk). With the state of the HUD in the F14 and the fact that the instruments are not in the standard T the scan takes even more practice ( I gather the guys flew it almost exclusively head down IMC hence I include it in the non HUD aircraft).

 

FYI the basic scan goes from the attitude indicator (AI) to the ASI back to AI then altimeter back to AI and so on. Depending on what you are doing vary the scan. Scan the VSI more on an ILS or less if you are straight and level for example.

 

 

.

 

Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk

[jmarso]

Here's a couple of instrument flying tips to help get lined up behind the back of the boat at night. (Works for airfields, too- it's basic instrument stuff.)

 

Switch over to TACAN and dial the final bearing (or BRC, whichever you want to use) into the CDI.

 

Your end goal is to have the CDI centered with the head of the TACAN needle at 12 o'clock, on your final bearing.

 

Now, when looking at the TACAN needle (or a VOR needle, or ADF, or whatever you are using), there are a few basic 'truths' you can use to orient yourself using the compass card.

 

1. You are always on the 'tail' of the needle, perspective wise. In a way, you can use the Compass card as a mini-map. The station you have tuned is always at the center of the card.

 

2. Unless you are headed directly TO or AWAY from the station, the head of the needle will always gradually 'fall' on your compass card, while the tail of the needle will always 'rise'. This is important.

 

If you are flying directly TO a station (Head of the needle at 12 o'clock), and then it suddenly swings 180 degrees and points directly behind you, you just overflew the station. This is called 'station passage.' Due to a cone of uncertainty in the signal, the needle will get erratic and fluctuate just before station passage, then steady up again the farther you get from the station.

 

3. If you look at the tail of the needle (where you are) and read the magnetic heading where the tail is, that is the radial you are on from that station. For example, if you are flying a heading of 360, and the TACAN needle is horizontal with the head pointed at 090 and the tail at 270, you are west of the station, on the 270-radial. The bearing to the station is 090.

 

4. To get behind the boat, you need to position yourself on the radial that is the reciprocal of the BRC. So if the boat is headed north, you need to be south of the boat, on the 180-radial. So, depending on where you are, you need to fly a heading to make the tail of the needle 'rise' to the 180 mark. Say you are west of the boat, on the 270-radial at 10 miles. In this case, the tail of the needle is on 270, regardless of the heading you are flying. You need to turn to the southeast, about a 135 heading or so, which should put the head of the needle (at 090) at roughly the 10' o'clock position on your compass card, with the tail (at 270) at about 4 o'clock. As you fly this heading, the head of the needle will gradually fall towards BRC, while the tail rises towards the 180-radial. When the tail is about ten degrees off or so (around the 190-radial), turn further left to a heading of about 030. This is a good intercept angle. The head of the needle will continue to fall from about the 010 mark towards north, but it should be happening gradually. The CDI should be starting to center at this point. Continue easing left until you are on a heading of 360, with the CDI standing centered and vertical. Congratulations, you're on final!

 

The trick at the end is to 'pinch' the needle to that final bearing so you don't overshoot and start oscillating back and forth through the final approach course. However many degrees there are between the head of the needle and the desired final bearing, your flight heading should be about the same number of degrees offset to the other side of the head of the needle. So in our example, once the head of the needle is at about 005 (and falling towards 360), your flight heading shouldn't be more than about 010. The head of the needle should be sandwiched in the middle of the top of the CDI course and your actual heading. Pinch it down gradually until all three are matched up. If it's a carrier approach, there should be little if any wind correction needed provided the mission is built properly. Of course. if you used 'final bearing' in the CDI, the TACAN needle will gradually fall off to the right as the boat plows through the water, requiring that constant right correction for lineup.

 

Once you are lined up on final, you can switch from TCN mode over to ICLS if you plan on using that, and start fine tuning with the needles.

 

This would be a lot easier to understand with pictures; unfortunately, I don't have any. Sorry.

Edited June 30, 2019 by jmarso

[jmarso]

If trying to work out the geometry for intercepting final is using up too much brain matter when you are flying in the dark, there's a pretty simple way to simplify the process as well.

 

From your present position, fly directly towards the boat. (Put the head of the TACAN needle at 12 O'clock.)

 

Make a note of the ship's BRC and work out the reciprocal- you don't even have to do math. Just look at the compass card and read off the opposite heading. So if the ship is headed 030, one glance at the card will tell you the reciprocal is 210.

 

At station passage (when you fly over the top of the ship and the TACAN needle swings), turn to that reciprocal heading +/- 20 degrees. Doesn't matter which direction you offset. In our example with the ship on a BRC of 360, the goal is still to line up on the 180-radial. So after station passage, turn to 200 and fly out to a distance of 10 miles. Since you are flying directly away from the ship at this point, you should remain on or about the 200-radial.

 

At ten miles, turn left to a heading of 030, and start the process of 'pinching' the head of the TACAN needle back to 360 and thereby centering the CDI, establishing yourself on final. Depending on your speed, you may find the CDI already starting to center up in the turn.

 

In instrument flying this is called a 'teardrop' procedure, and is one of the few forms of 'procedure turn' a pilot can use to reverse course during an instrument approach. Upon completion, you'll be established on the 180-radial, heading 360, and established on final, ready to dirty up and switch over to ICLS if desired.

Edited June 30, 2019 by jmarso

[Chuck_Henry]

I found it amazing how quickly things go south on instruments if you don't keep up the required scan, process the information and react immediately. God knows what partial panel is like....

 

Genuine partial panel while IMC is an emergency, period. You will be declaring one with ATC and requesting no-gyro vectors for a PAR or ASR to the nearest suitable airfield.

[Chuck_Henry]

It would be interesting to hear our IMC rated, RL jet jockeys comments on this.

 

Not a jet jockey, but have been IFR-trained essentially 2 going on 3 times now (T-6 in Primary, TH-57 in Intermediate, and soon T-44 for Advanced which will result in my actual NATOPS Instrument Rating).

 

At the risk of oversimplifying matters, I view it as 2 main things.

 

1. Knowing your aircraft's power and attitude settings for desired airspeed and climb/descent rate (or level flight). You should know cold what bank angle you need for a standard rate turn, what pitch attitude and power adjustment you need for standard rate climbs and descents, how to set and fly a 3-degree glideslope, and how to make level speed changes without ballooning or descending. If you don't, you're already setting yourself up for failure.

 

2. Maintaining an aggressive instrument scan. Someone above already mentioned the "hub-and-spoke" method, in which most of your scan is on the attitude indicator and you systematically shift your eyes to the airspeed, altimeter, heading, and VSI. In addition to deviations from desired parameters, you also have to take into account the rate at which the needles are moving (or the trend vectors in a glass cockpit aircraft). That will determine how drastic or subtle the power or attitude correction needs to be. You might also want to spend a little time hawking that particular gauge if you're way off, but avoid the trap of fixating and letting everything else go to crap. It's a science in theory, but everybody has their own techniques. Don't be afraid to use and abuse the trim. Get that VSI exactly where you want it. In a fast jet like the F-14, that's the thing that's going to get away from you the quickest.

[jmarso]

Not a jet jockey, but have been IFR-trained essentially 2 going on 3 times now (T-6 in Primary, TH-57 in Intermediate, and soon T-44 for Advanced which will result in my actual NATOPS Instrument Rating).

 

Interesting. V-22 pipeline? That's the only one I can think of where you'd go to the HT's for intermediate. (I'm a former P-3 guy and VT instructor)