What's wrong with the Jug, wy so little interest ?

[Hueyman]

It's an awesome module as we're already used to with Eagle Dynamics, but it's also an awesome aircraft with rich history !

 

 

I am really surprised in the negative way to see so little interest in it so far ..

 

 

- There are not many liveries ( though not sure if the paintkit was released )

 

 

- No quick/instant missions in Syria

 

 

- Still waiting for rocket implementation and correct bomb damage blast

 

 

- No serious campaing that I'm aware of are in the process of being made using Normandy or The Channel

 

 

- Very little use online

 

 

- Was expecting to see a ton of virtual squadrons rising up, with ground attack role, formation flying etc.. nothing. Proposed multiple times over groups, no one was interested so far.

 

 

 

Is there a reason for that ?

 

 

I know they are hard birds to fly compared to the jet toys but on the long run, I'm afraid most development power will be moer and more dedicated to the jets, in the disadvantage of the helicopters and WWII birds ( like in the civilian sims where the Liners makes most of the $$ )

 

 

Anyway, share your thoughts on that :thumbup:

[Hueyman]

[DOUBLE POST, PLEASE DELETE THIS THREAD ]

[Buzzles]

[DOUBLE POST, PLEASE DELETE THIS THREAD ]

You can do that yourself, edit your first post and look underneath the text box.

[javelina1]

Jug fan too! I would agree, needing some more love. :-)

[Hoops]

Did you ever come across a squadron that is flying the Jug?

[Glow]

Tutorial missions.  I don't want to say, that those are the worst from all the DCS modules, 'cos I haven't try them all, but those are terrible.

If Devs have no time to do those right, why not make video guides, like those in Huey module? I found some YT guides for P47 more smooth and informative, than those delivered with Jug.

 

Teaching about trimming in P47... that was funny.

 

I committed fratricide four times just following instructions.

When I finally get to gun use lesson, my engine was dead, before I get control over the plane...

I though, I can handle Jug just fine, after 80h in free Stang, I'm good with 2- and 3- point landings and most of flight stages... Nop. I couldn't even keep this bird in straight flight.

 

I can understand the low popularity. I wish to have more time to try this module before buy, but more likely I will go for P51 or Spit.

 

[Sydy]

I did my share:

- 2 Campaigns released;

- 1 Kneeboard checklist covering all models;

- 1 Template for MFD Cougars;

- 33 Skins.

 

Well, that’s so far.

Edited February 5, 2021 by Sydy
typo and 33 skins (3 more).

[javelina1]

On 1/16/2021 at 10:23 AM, Sydy said:

I did my share:

- 2 Campaigns released;

- 1 Kneeboard checklist covering all models;

- 1 Template for MFD Cougars;

- 30 Skins.

 

Well, that’s so far.

 

and very appreciated buddy!  I love the Jug.  She's my go too WWII bird!

[PL_Harpoon]

2 hours ago, javelina1 said:

She's my go too WWII bird!

Mine too.

I love the Spitfire for its looks and maneuverability but after several MP missions in the Jug in which I returned home with a damaged engine and more bullet holes than a shooting range target and still managed a safe belly-landing I'm beginning to appreciate what a great airplane it is.

Not to mention its decent (and straightforward) armament.

[Sydy]

6 hours ago, javelina1 said:

and very appreciated buddy!  I love the Jug.  She's my go too WWII bird!

 

Same here!

[Gascan39]

Of the WWII birds, Jug is my fave. Appreciate the skins, they are awesome

[303_Kermit]

Can't wait to fly it online, but I wait untill it starts remotely fly like a P47...

[PL_Harpoon]

16 minutes ago, 303_Kermit said:

Can't wait to fly it online, but I wait untill it starts remotely fly like a P47...

In what way is it not flying like a P-47?

[grafspee]

I wonder what ppl mean by saying. "It is not flying like P-47", Are they owners of real P-47?

Edited February 4, 2021 by grafspee

[Rick50]

Sometimes, it's a "slow burn". Meaning, sometimes the masses leap to jump into something new... other times, it can take a few years, and then suddenly you notice that something's popularity has grown dramatically, even though it's not actually new. I very strongly believe that the P-47 product here is going to be one of those that in say 2 years will, without ryme or reason, suddenly grow in popularity.

 

Seen that happen in music albums, books, games and flight sims. Sure, it's not ideal, as developers need to recoup their time and money investments as early as possible. But... sometimes the delay can have other benefits. It can become popular just before another product gets launched, and that "hype train" can easily help boost the new product too, feeding the two products. It's my belief that DCS WW2 products will get a great boost sometime in future, and possibly result in an expansion of ED. Not sure when that could happen, but I'm guessing that the Marianna's map, WW2 carrier ships to operate from, and the Vought F-4U Corsair could cause a serious boost to DCS WW2 interest that then pushes the Mustang and Jug to greater heights!

 

grafspee, what are you trying to say? You DON'T own a P-47 ?? Everyone on my street has one, except Bill who has three, greedy bugger! LOL!! 

[grafspee]

Im waiting for some WW2 carrier operations.

[kengou]

I love the Jug but it's not that popular for the same reason it's often underrated in real life history too. It's big, and tough, and numerous, but to a casual observer, it doesn't do anything really exciting. It's not super nimble like the Spitfire. It's not super fast and long range like the Mustang. It's not gorgeous looking like a P-38. I know to many of us who know better, it's an aircraft with a rich history and lots of capability, but its merits are more subtle to understand or explain.

[Glow]

New damage model could be a true game changer for this module.

The strongest point P47, according to pilots was power of 8 guns. I couldn't catch that in a sim. If more WW2 planes will get new damage model and will be spectacular to watch, how P47 guns rip a part enemy planes, the popularity of tis module will grow.

 

With new damage model, we need better shrapnel damage simulation as well.

Edited February 5, 2021 by Glow

[Lurker]

33 minutes ago, kengou said:

I love the Jug but it's not that popular for the same reason it's often underrated in real life history too. It's big, and tough, and numerous, but to a casual observer, it doesn't do anything really exciting. It's not super nimble like the Spitfire. It's not super fast and long range like the Mustang. It's not gorgeous looking like a P-38. I know to many of us who know better, it's an aircraft with a rich history and lots of capability, but its merits are more subtle to understand or explain.

 

I think the Jug is beautiful. In fact it is one of my favorite WWII planes. It's huge and imposing size and mass, and it's formidable diving abilities as well as extreme gun platform and flying stability easily make it one my top 3 WWII fighter planes ever. 

 

With all of that said, I did not buy the DCS p47 Mustang in DCS. Even though I own the Mustang, the Spit, and the K4, the Normandy map and the WWII assets pack, I have simply stopped buying DCS WWII related modules and maps. It's a matter of practicality and usability. I love the level of detail of the WWII modules in DCS, I love the flight model, but apart from those two things there are too many things missing for me to get any more enjoyment even out of the modules I do own. Simply put, DCS WWII feels like an afterthought. If it was the only "game in town" I would probably be flying these modules still, but there is another sim out there (whose name we will not mention) that does it better, that feels more complete and more end-user friendly in almost every way imaginable. From performance, to gameplay, single player, multiplayer etc. 

 

I think this is a shame, but that's the way it is currently and I probably won't be flying or buying the Jug (or any other WWII module/map for that matter) in DCS until they somehow close the gap with that other sim in a more meaningful way. 

[Nealius]

Since no one bothered to read the second post in this thread: 

 

[Lurker]

7 hours ago, Nealius said:

Since no one bothered to read the second post in this thread: 

 

 

Ok I don't get it, what's so special about the second post in this thread?

[felixx75]

On 2/5/2021 at 10:25 AM, grafspee said:

Im waiting for some WW2 carrier operations.

??? it's not a F4U... Why waiting for carrier ops?

[Snapage]

Having to sit on the ground for 10 minutes warming up the engine every flight makes it frustrating. To much time on the ground doing nothing but waiting.

[303_Kermit]

On 2/4/2021 at 7:13 PM, PL_Harpoon said:

In what way is it not flying like a P-47?

The Jug is together with Bf109 my most favourite plane. In All Sims I fly i do fly Bf- on Eastern front, and P47 on Western... It's the plane you have to love or hate. And god I love it. I do think that Hub's Zemke Wolfpack was the most dangerous fightergroup of WWII... They made Günther Rall resign of flying  ... I would say strong

 

Being a huge P47 fan I would never say that it was a turn-fighter, and I never heard such opinion form P47 veteran. Actually many of them hated the way the plane flied. The "lady Jug" was surprisingly agile (as Boleslaw "Mad Pole" Gladych described once) for a plane big like a church, true. In my opinion first P47 must fly fast like P47. It was (I'd like to say it in Jeremy Clarckson way)  "THE fastest plane ...in the world" those times, unbeatable on high altitude, so:

1. first are the speeds, they shall match: so far i wouldn't say it match neither on low altitude, nor on high....

there are the data for P-47D10
http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/p-47/p-47.html 
 

High speed: Intercooler and oil cooler flap neutral, cowl flaps closed; flaps and gear up; 2700 R.P.M. with water injection.

 

	Altitude Ft.	Manifold Pressure "Hg.	Torque Brake Horsepower	Turbo RPM	Exhaust Back Press. "Hg.	Carb. Air Temp. °C	True Speed MPH
	0	56	2210	7,200	36.0	32.0	333
	5,000	56	2265	9,400	33.2	27.0	353
	10,000	56	2315	11,600	31.4	23.0	372
	15,000	56	2335	13,850	30.3	23.0	390
	20,000	56	2325	16,200	30.5	26.0	406
	25,000	56	2265	18,650	32.5	33.0	421
	30,000	56	2225	21,400	35.7	43.0	433
	31,000	56	2220	22,000	36.5	46.0	435
	33,000	50.5	2020	22,000	32.0	39.0	430
	35,000	45.8	1740	22,000	30.0	32.0	422
	38,000	39.0	1550	22,000	25.3	23.0	404

  2. Second: Acceleration in dive, excellent control in dive, easy recovery from dive, and zoom climb - easy energy recovery after dive. Unfortunately it's very difficult to put those advantages in numbers. P47 was excellent fighter when flown "energetic style". Allowing to dive down to any target, and than regain the altitude before the speed drops down. 3. Strong , rigid construction. P47 could dive with insane speeds (actually with speeds exceeding the ability to control a plane) without damaging a construction.

I don't see those characteristics in current P-47. That was what I meant sir.

With my best regards
Kermit

 

Edited February 7, 2021 by 303_Kermit

[grafspee]

"Excellent control in dive easy dive recover." Compressibility flaps were installed with no reason. Dives was main pain in P-47, thirst it was though that it is as bad as in P-38 but wasn't so bad after some testing was done.

Still plane could not recover easy from dive.

P-47 wasn't excellent diver. 

For example P-51 has higher dive limits then P-47

P-47 25k ft to 30k ft has limit 300 IAS

P-51 25k ft to 30k ft has limit 350 IAS

P-47 wasn't insane fast, this plane  was entering compressibility at lower mach simple as that, and plane in this state was becoming nose heavy and loost of elevator control  was present as well. So P-47 had to dive in to lower altitude where mach number dropped then pilot was able to pull this bird from dive.

manual states that pull opportunity was showing between 15k and 18k ft. 

Edited February 7, 2021 by grafspee