Normandy 2.0 - Please do it justice

[Captain Orso]

Please make it look like a map of Normandy from 1944. There are sources to download actual scanned Department of War relief maps in various scales with the actual roads, villages, bridges streams, woods, towers, railroads, electrical lines, hill tops. The are literally thousands of photos of every important location in all of Normandy. There is NO reason for anything generic or generated.

I want to recognize all the places I've seen in films and photos since I was a child - Sainte-Mère-Église, the Vieville draw, Carentan, St. Lo, Pointe du Hoc, Arromanches-les-Bains, Villers-Bocage, Caen, Benouville, Ranville, Falaise - I could go on and on.

I want to be able to recognize what I'm seeing, and above all, I want to be able to take a map from the era and use it to navigate, to fly from England and once over the continent, use landmarks to navigate - church towners, roads, notable buildings, railroads, electrical lines - everything pilots really used during the war, and which are taught to use in training films on how to navigate using only visible references.

I am excitedly looking forward to this new developments 

[GUFA]

First off WHY...

With all the choices Ugra could have gone with! just seems Ugra has puckered up for a minority. I won't be buy this map at full price (if at all) and am really not happy with this announcement.

[zaelu]

5 minutes ago, GUFA said:

First off WHY...

With all the choices Ugra could have gone with! just seems Ugra has puckered up for a minority. I won't be buy this map at full price (if at all) and am really not happy with this announcement.

They for sure started to work on an upgrade realizing the map looks bad, performs bad and sells bad.  Then they thought it's a good idea to ask for more money. Now they will be stuck in this suicidal marketing gimmick. They should have started a new WW2 map and do the upgrade slowly for free.

[GUFA]

13 minutes ago, zaelu said:

They should have started a new WW2 map and do the upgrade slowly for free.

Or even as a modestly price DLC...

I like both (and own) Ugra's Maps, sure they could be improved...

So The Top Dogs at Ugra sat down an debated:

Vietnam-Indochina-no

Central America-no

Anywhere in Africa-no

Any other choices that people have asked/begged offered the wife for-no

And finally settled on (Drum Roll Plz) <PROFANITY> a Normandy REE CO/RETREAD...

 

Edited October 8, 2022 by GUFA
spelling fix

[Gunfreak]

The vast majority seems to be very happy with this.

Both ww2 maps are really small, Normandy didn't look good.

So now you get a much much bigger ww2 map, with two huge cities, and it will cost you 15 bucks if you have Normandy 1, or 10 bucks if you have Normandy 1 and Channel map. 

Or if you have none of the ww2 maps you'll now pay 60 bucks for a big ww2 map. Instead of 100 for two small ones.

Edited October 8, 2022 by Gunfreak

[GUFA]

8 minutes ago, Gunfreak said:

The vast majority seems to be very happy with this.

Yeah gonna call B$ls^&*t on that statement...

This Excerpt from the DCS newsletter:

07 October 2022

 

Dear Fighter Pilots, Partners and Friends, 

We are delighted to announce that Ugra Media’s next map will be DCS: Normandy 2. Using the skills developed whilst creating the outstanding DCS: Syria map, the new Normandy 2 map will use the latest DCS mapping technologies to create an epic World War II battlefield.

During the last months, IndiaFoxtEcho Visual Simulation has been improving and completing the features of DCS: MB-339 for its imminent release. These improvements will significantly enhance the unique flying experience that only DCS World can provide.

Please check out below DCS: Normandy 2 map details and the most up-to-date development progress of DCS: MB-339. These modules are both coming soon to your DCS World. 

Thank you for your passion and support.

Yours sincerely, 

Eagle Dynamics

 

So Nothing about any discounts for N1 users or any other "goodies  to be offered. Now if your information that you posted today is correct the great as it should be, there are 2 other maps concerning this area we don't need 3. Will N2 overwrite N1? Even though I just upgraded my SSD to a larger one I do not want 2 Normandy 44 map files on my system will N1+2 be 2 separate terrain folders or not? This is also a gripe when it concerns OnReTech's Sinai map as well.

Frankly ED needs to sort out the map system so we have a base make (1939) with different time era added as layers. This would solve a lot of problems as far as making maps goes.

So If this is an Update why are they passing it off as a "New" map. I just find this as incredibly lazy and dishonest if it is a new map.

I won't be taken for a mug, neither should anyone else

[71st_AH Rob]

20 minutes ago, GUFA said:

Yeah gonna call B$ls^&*t on that statement...

This Excerpt from the DCS newsletter:

07 October 2022

 

Dear Fighter Pilots, Partners and Friends, 

We are delighted to announce that Ugra Media’s next map will be DCS: Normandy 2. Using the skills developed whilst creating the outstanding DCS: Syria map, the new Normandy 2 map will use the latest DCS mapping technologies to create an epic World War II battlefield.

During the last months, IndiaFoxtEcho Visual Simulation has been improving and completing the features of DCS: MB-339 for its imminent release. These improvements will significantly enhance the unique flying experience that only DCS World can provide.

Please check out below DCS: Normandy 2 map details and the most up-to-date development progress of DCS: MB-339. These modules are both coming soon to your DCS World. 

Thank you for your passion and support.

Yours sincerely, 

Eagle Dynamics

 

So Nothing about any discounts for N1 users or any other "goodies  to be offered. Now if your information that you posted today is correct the great as it should be, there are 2 other maps concerning this area we don't need 3. Will N2 overwrite N1? Even though I just upgraded my SSD to a larger one I do not want 2 Normandy 44 map files on my system will N1+2 be 2 separate terrain folders or not? This is also a gripe when it concerns OnReTech's Sinai map as well.

Frankly ED needs to sort out the map system so we have a base make (1939) with different time era added as layers. This would solve a lot of problems as far as making maps goes.

So If this is an Update why are they passing it off as a "New" map. I just find this as incredibly lazy and dishonest if it is a new map.

I won't be taken for a mug, neither should anyone else

I see that you are new here.  One thing to keep in mind on the ED forums is to use the search function and to read everything in the newsletters and the moderators answers to questions before posting your own or going off on a rant.

 

From the same newsletter you quoted above:

DCS: Normandy 2 will be available as a complete map for $59.99 USD. If you have either DCS: Normandy 1944 or DCS: The Channel maps, you can purchase Normandy 2 for $14.99 USD. If you own both, you can purchase DCS: Normandy 2 for only $9.99 USD.

Hope you enjoy the new Normandy map as much as I will.

[Indianajon]

Yes I agree and hope they do it justice. I don't understand the vehement anger this map has produced though? OK, you don't like it, then don't buy it. Why are you all trying to shout down those that are interested. Yes it's the same area but it sounds like it's much more than a simple patch. How many of you would expect to get a free book or coffee simply because you had bought one in previously? If this was just an update then yes I would be angry about paying more, but it's not. It's much bigger and clearly involves lots more work. If you don't want it then fine, but the rest of us don't need to know that.

Sorry for the rant all but these forums seemed to have changed since ED started releasing new upcoming projects week after week. With so much content there is bound to be things individuals aren't interested in but others are. This is a good thing, it's allowing DCS to become more individual and people to focus on what they like. Not everyone is the same and that's a good thing.

[Beirut]

1 hour ago, GUFA said:

 

 

 

So If this is an Update why are they passing it off as a "New" map. I just find this as incredibly lazy and dishonest if it is a new map.

I won't be taken for a mug, neither should anyone else

 

If it includes Paris and London, that in itself constitutes a new map. And given the amount of work involved to make those two cities, and to - hopefully - make them run well, it is anything but lazy.

 

As I obviously have all the maps  this looks like a great deal with the discount. I get Paris and London, plus other improvements, for $10. I think this is a solid good deal. 

 

If you don't like it, vote with your wallet. I will be voting "yes" with mine.

 

 

Edited October 8, 2022 by Beirut

[GUFA]

25 minutes ago, Beirut said:

As I obviously have all the maps 

To be Clear: I'm not against a update/upgrade of 44 France, Southern England, People are entitled to be remunerated for they're efforts. I am new To DCS and my pathway as a latecomer has been to buy all the maps as well. Just don't want 3 maps that are the same area and period.

25 minutes ago, Beirut said:

 this looks like a great deal with the discount. I get Paris and London, plus other improvements, for $10.

Okay let me play "team Ugra", How does Ugra make money off of this?

Edited October 8, 2022 by GUFA
grammar fix

[GUFA]

1 hour ago, 71st_AH Rob said:

I see that you are new here.  One thing to keep in mind on the ED forums is to use the search function and to read everything in the newsletters and the moderators answers to questions before posting your own or going off on a rant.

For a start Simple Question to you are YOU assuming or HAVE YOU COUNTED. Come on be truthful...

1 hour ago, 71st_AH Rob said:

before posting your own or going off on a rant.

This isn't a rant it is me stating my CONDITIONS on which I will buy this product. I am also stated my ambivalence to buying 2 products that are the same (even if the later one is improved).

 

1 hour ago, 71st_AH Rob said:

If you own both, you can purchase DCS: Normandy 2 for only $9.99 USD.

If this is the case call it DLC. Heck If they did southern England and charged 10 bucks, then did France (and my hope WW 2 Central Europe) and charged $10 NTH France, would you really have objected to that?

[Beirut]

16 minutes ago, GUFA said:

To be Clear: I'm not against a update/upgrade of 44 France, Southern England, People are entitled to be remunerated for they're efforts. I am new To DCS and my pathway as a latecomer has been to buy all the maps as well. Just don't want 3 maps that are the same area and period.

 

Yeah, it's a bit fuddled. But if the end result is a very good map offered at a discount, then I don't have a problem with that. 

 

16 minutes ago, GUFA said:

Okay let me play "team Ugra", How does Ugra make money off of this?

 

 

I would imagine they make money off this by selling maps. I don't mean to be snotty about it, but that part seems clear enough. They'll get my money, that's for sure. 

[GUFA]

2 minutes ago, Beirut said:

I would imagine they make money off this by selling maps. I don't mean to be snotty about it, but that part seems clear enough. They'll get my money, that's for sure. 

As I stated on my last post call DLC and be done with it. I imagine Ugra has already importing good chunks of N V1 (thinking of the natural features mainly).

[Gunfreak]

23 minutes ago, GUFA said:

To be Clear: I'm not against a update/upgrade of 44 France, Southern England, People are entitled to be remunerated for they're efforts. I am new To DCS and my pathway as a latecomer has been to buy all the maps as well. Just don't want 3 maps that are the same area and period.

Okay let me play "team Ugra", How does Ugra make money off of this?

 

DCS continues to get new players, and some old players don't necessarily play ww2 yet. WW2 DCS still stuffer from it being kinda half-assed, but hopefully it will be improved,  and more and more players will play ww2 DCS and will want a ww2 map.

New players will now get a big and good looking map(hopefully) for 60 bucks. While DCS ww2 loyalist will get a fancy map for 10 or 15 bucks.

[Scotch75]

I'll actually have to use drop tanks now on the P-51D for the new map. Looking forward to it for $15.70 AUD.

Cheers!



Sent from my SM-G998B using Tapatalk

[GUFA]

5 minutes ago, Gunfreak said:

DCS continues to get new players, and some old players don't necessarily play ww2 yet. WW2 DCS still stuffer from it being kinda half-assed, but hopefully it will be improved,  and more and more players will play ww2 DCS and will want a ww2 map.

New players will now get a big and good looking map(hopefully) for 60 bucks. While DCS ww2 loyalist will get a fancy map for 10 or 15 bucks.

I think a lot of these issues will be resolved once DCS they're intended "Whole Planet" development. It would surely be easier "If" developers are able to start maps in theyre appropriate positions. After that maps can be "stitched" together. Growing a map also becomes a lot easier I would think. Also You start thinking period maps become easier to build. Now I'm no Software developer,but a map could start in 1939 and then you apply different eras as layers should be feasible.

Just let me State "For the Record" that Easier isn't easy .

13 minutes ago, Scotch75 said:

I'll actually have to use drop tanks now on the P-51D for the new map. Looking forward to it for $15.70 AUD.

Cheers!

Just would be nice to fly over BENELUX and Germany as well.

[Beirut]

40 minutes ago, GUFA said:

As I stated on my last post call DLC and be done with it. I imagine Ugra has already importing good chunks of N V1 (thinking of the natural features mainly).

 

Not to get lost in semantics, but all modules are DLC. And I would say again that adding London and Paris is no small thing. And there is no doubt some aspects of the map are being carried over. I can't imagine otherwise. If what is being carried over is good enough or getting a facelift, fine. And let's not lose sight of the discount for previous owners. If we are getting a bigger, better map for $10... that's pretty much the ballgame.

 

If the Normandy V2 map was $60 for everyone, then there might be an issue. But if it's $10, there is no issue. It's $10. 

[Gunfreak]

18 minutes ago, GUFA said:

I think a lot of these issues will be resolved once DCS they're intended "Whole Planet" development. It would surely be easier "If" developers are able to start maps in theyre appropriate positions. After that maps can be "stitched" together. Growing a map also becomes a lot easier I would think. Also You start thinking period maps become easier to build. Now I'm no Software developer,but a map could start in 1939 and then you apply different eras as layers should be feasible.

Just let me State "For the Record" that Easier isn't easy .

Just would be nice to fly over BENELUX and Germany as well.

Someone posted a picture of what they say the new map will cover. And it showed Belgium being within the map border. They claimed this was based on some podcast info. It's not German or Nederlands,  but might give us Bodenplatte stuff.

Edited October 8, 2022 by Gunfreak

[GUFA]

1 minute ago, Beirut said:

If the Normandy V2 map was $60 for everyone, then there might be an issue. But if it's $10, there is no issue. It's $10.

Already stated in previous posts that the Issue isn't price, And yes All modules are DLC. The issue that bugs me is that Ugra resources that could used for a new map are going to be decicated to Normandy 44 instead of a original map. Not all of us "live" in France/ UK and as such care to have 3 maps that are repeating the same ground, era so how about considering why I was so "Luke Warm" on Normandy 44 V.2.0. That said 10 buck Normandy 44 V.2.0 10 bucks I'm there, Just Keep Growing the Map East & South and I'll be a Happy Chappy.l

14 minutes ago, Gunfreak said:

Someone posted a picture of what they say the new map will cover. And it showed Belgium being within the map border. They claimed this was based on some podcast info. It's not German or Nederlands,  but might give us Bodenplatte stuff.

That would be cool if confirmed.

[Beirut]

16 minutes ago, GUFA said:

Already stated in previous posts that the Issue isn't price, And yes All modules are DLC. The issue that bugs me is that Ugra resources that could used for a new map are going to be decicated to Normandy 44 instead of a original map. Not all of us "live" in France/ UK and as such care to have 3 maps that are repeating the same ground, era so how about considering why I was so "Luke Warm" on Normandy 44 V.2.0. That said 10 buck Normandy 44 V.2.0 10 bucks I'm there, Just Keep Growing the Map East & South and I'll be a Happy Chappy.l

 

 

Yeah, and if Heatblur would make me an F-104 and throw in a bottle of 20 year-old Pappy Van Winkle, I'd be a happy chappy too. But it's an imperfect world.

 

As it is, I get London and Paris for $10. I can live with that.

[GUFA]

30 minutes ago, Beirut said:

But it's an imperfect world

Ain't that the truth

31 minutes ago, Beirut said:

Yeah, and if Heatblur would make me an F-104

Rather hoping I IFE do the Zipper with the M339s imminent release. And am also hoping for them to all of the Italian variants. S G to start and another poster suggested a TF module. So 3 modules, Think I'm being overly ambitious.

[Ala13_ManOWar]

4 hours ago, GUFA said:

So If this is an Update why are they passing it off as a "New" map. I just find this as incredibly lazy and dishonest if it is a new map.

I won't be taken for a mug, neither should anyone else

Because, if you knew the old map at all, you'd recognize in the few picks we've already seen, it's not just an "update" to the old map, it's a whole new map encompassing the same area the old one did, and YES, we're happy because it comes at a huge discount for everyone already owning the other two WWII maps, and people like you were b!t€h1ng all around since ever because the old map looked bad shade of green, so now you have your updated/new map with a correct shade of green and plenty of space to fly in from London to Paris. And I have to complain about that?? You people can't stop befuddling me about finding new subjects to complain about, if they don't do what you want it's bad, but if they do it's bad either… If you hate so much DCS I'll just show you where's the exit door .

[Beirut]

11 minutes ago, Ala13_ManOWar said:

Because, if you knew the old map at all, you'd recognize in the few picks we've already seen, it's not just an "update" to the old map, it's a whole new map encompassing the same area the old one did, and YES, we're happy because it comes at a huge discount for everyone already owning the other two WWII maps, and people like you were b!t€h1ng all around since ever because the old map looked bad shade of green, so now you have your updated/new map with a correct shade of green and plenty of space to fly in from London to Paris. And I have to complain about that?? You people can't stop befuddling me about finding new subjects to complain about, if they don't do what you want it's bad, but if they do it's bad either… If you hate so much DCS I'll just show you where's the exit door .

 

I think customers are allowed to complain as long as they bought or keep buying stuff. If someone just sticks with the free version and the two planes and complains about everything else, that might be pushing it. But if the wallet feels the pain and modules are purchased, and this forum is pretty much the only outlet for a bit o' venting about the product, so be it. 

 

Within the bounds of civilized discussion, of course. 

[Ala13_ManOWar]

3 minutes ago, Beirut said:

Within the bounds of civilized discussion, of course. 

And that's usually the problem, too many people these days apparently think they can just pop up and throw random and usually false <profanity>e into the fan and then they just go away leaving the place all swamped, whether they have reasons to do do or not. Apparently they should be kids which never knew the old times where you bought whatever it was, it didn't work as you thought but you had to stick with it and that was all because the guy at the shop had nothing to do with whatever the product you were buying, they just sold it and you buy or not, period. But people these days have a problem with frustration management, and sometimes they just are wrong no matter how much money you spend in whatever the thing. They'll be better using that money at the psychologist rather than spreading their frustrations on how the world is or isn't over the rest or the people on the internet. Grow f&%$g up kids with plenty of whitish hair down there.

[Beirut]

22 minutes ago, Ala13_ManOWar said:

And that's usually the problem, too many people these days apparently think they can just pop up and throw random and usually false <profanity>e into the fan and then they just go away leaving the place all swamped, whether they have reasons to do do or not. Apparently they should be kids which never knew the old times where you bought whatever it was, it didn't work as you thought but you had to stick with it and that was all because the guy at the shop had nothing to do with whatever the product you were buying, they just sold it and you buy or not, period. But people these days have a problem with frustration management, and sometimes they just are wrong no matter how much money you spend in whatever the thing. They'll be better using that money at the psychologist rather than spreading their frustrations on how the world is or isn't over the rest or the people on the internet. Grow f&%$g up kids with plenty of whitish hair down there.

 

 

It only bothers you if you let it bother you. Frustration management is as much for the listener as the speaker. 

 

And this ain't the old times. I remember the old times. I was there. This ain't it. Commerce has changed massively and we're still getting used to it. That said, if someone bought the Normandy map and the Channel map, I think he has a right to interject about Normandy V2, whether his tone pleases you or not.