Deka Simulations announces the DCS: J-8II for DCS World!

[Breakaway]

Interesting jet, I'll give this one a miss but good luck

[Wyvern]

God for fucksake, be happy youre getting another Module. If you dont like it, don't buy it. Why would you all even care? I'm not happy either and would prefer an more modern plane. But <profanity>, can you stop bitching about "this isnt realistic, this isnt that" who gives a <profanity>, its a game in the end. 

You dont like it, don't buy it. 
but dont ruin it for anyone else.

 

[Fromthedeep]

1 minute ago, Wyvern said:

You dont like it, don't buy it. 
but dont ruin it for anyone else.

How can it ruin the module for people who don't care about realism and historical relevancy that other people do care and are disappointed? If you don't care then it doesn't matter what we think, does it?

Edited February 10, 2023 by Fromthedeep

[Captain Slime]

I'm interested in what the AWG-27 listed does for the plane. Wikipedia has basically nothing on it.

[Wyvern]

I, for my part, will buy the plane, as I know that Deka is a highly skilled Developer. Yes I think that the J-8II is an missed opportunity for an more modern Redfor Plane, especiall considering the F-15E and Typhoon coming someday.

Like, when is the J-11A going to be finished?

But just complaining and complaining wont help. I'd understand if it would be an J-20 or an J-16 or something like that. But the J-8II wont have any significant Impact on the setting its going to fly in. So chill out and stop tearing apart a barely announced plane

[Fromthedeep]

1 minute ago, Wyvern said:

Yes I think that the J-8II is an missed opportunity for an more modern Redfor Plane, especiall considering the F-15E and Typhoon coming someday.

LOL, if that's what you think the problem is now I understand everything about your message. Have fun.

[Jun]

Some more images

This is one of the two J-8II exported to US for project Peace Pearl (the other one is preserved in Shenyang Aircraft Corporation (SAC) Museum)

Spoiler

Higher quality image of cockpit and a few different shots

Spoiler

 

 

Edited February 10, 2023 by Jun

[F-2]

21 minutes ago, Fromthedeep said:

You don't gain anything from expressing positive thoughts either. Expressing your thoughts is the point of a forum. (Within the rules) If all you could do is praise the developers you wouldn't have a forum, you'd have an echo chamber.

 

That's also far from ideal, as you put it.

 

It's a Legacy FC3 module, doesn't even deserve to be mentioned.

sure it does it’s part of the game and we are talking about the game, the Ka-50 is similar. It’s been years since these things have been in the game. It’s either non mainstream but still fairly representative or nothing. I really don’t think anyone has any basis to complain nothing new is going on here. A peace pearl J-8 still fires the same missiles as a J-8F, has similar flight characteristics, and is in the Salish class radar range wise. 

[Wyvern]

I get the point of it not being realistic. But it is not only going to be the J-8PP. The J-8II is coming before that and that one is absolutely fine from an Realism Standpoint.
The PP makes no sense, as it isnt a real thing.
My point however does not invalidate my opinion on the entire module and anything I said?

You just act like an Toxic and Immature Kid. 

 

And as F-2 said, it makes no actual difference from an Gameplay perspective. 

but it wouldnt be the DCS community, if there wasnt people just complaining about a new module.

We will see how Deka will turn out with the J-8.
Until then, we will have to wait for more Info.

[Iron Sights]

I’m always happy to see a new module announcement. However, I think we can wait to pass judgement on it as there are no development screenshots yet. For all you know it might just what you wanted. For me, it adds another red 4 jet which equals great! If it’s cool, I’ll fly it.

[Fromthedeep]

6 minutes ago, Wyvern said:

But it is not only going to be the J-8PP. The J-8II is coming before that and that one is absolutely fine from an Realism Standpoint.

No, there will only be a J-8PP.

  

3 minutes ago, F-2 said:

sure it does it’s part of the game and we are talking about the game

Technically it is part of the game but in terms of quality and standards it isn't worthy of mentioning. The Ka-50 is also the first full fidelity product that really kickstarted what eventually became DCS, so I can't really use 2023 standards in good conscience when it comes to decisions by ED in 2009. However, this one and BS3 are highly questionable choices. Then again, it may be part of a strategy where developers move around the ever tightening regulations and political hurdles to make fictional variants and prototypes. Most people seemingly have no issue with that, so I wouldn't be surprised if the next big fixed wing jet by ED was an F-20.

 

8 minutes ago, F-2 said:

A peace pearl J-8 still fires the same missiles as a J-8F, has similar flight characteristics, and is in the Salish class radar range wise. 

A DCS module shouldn't be reduced into its metagaming capabilities if one is interested in the simulation aspect. I suspect that's becoming less and less common nowadays though.

[AdrianL]

3 minutes ago, Wyvern said:

The J-8II is coming before that

"The DCS: J-8II module will include the flyable J-8PP and the AI J-8F."
So it will only be the J-8PP and the AI J-8F. 

 

Where is the info that it will include the J-8II?

[F-2]

Just now, AdrianL said:

"The DCS: J-8II module will include the flyable J-8PP and the AI J-8F."
So it will only be the J-8PP and the AI J-8F. 

 

Where is the info that it will include the J-8II?

Isn’t J-8II the name of all J-8 with the side intakes? So PP and F are both J-8II?

1 minute ago, Fromthedeep said:

No, there will only be a J-8PP.

  

Technically it is part of the game but in terms of quality and standards it isn't worthy of mentioning. The Ka-50 is also the first full fidelity product that really kickstarted what eventually became DCS, so I can't really use 2023 standards in good conscience when it comes to decisions by ED in 2009. However, this one and BS3 are highly questionable choices. Then again, it may be part of a strategy where developers move around the ever tightening regulations and political hurdles to make fictional variants and prototypes. Most people seemingly have no issue with that, so I wouldn't be surprised if the next big fixed wing jet by ED was an F-20.

 

A DCS module shouldn't be reduced into its metagaming capabilities if one is interested in the simulation aspect. I suspect that's becoming less and less common nowadays though.

But it can be reduced to existing or not. J-8PP module is compatible with reality and other J-8 are not. I’m simply pointing out no one will be missing some of the more notable features of the J-8 nor does it do anything that the others don’t.

[Th3ChosenOn3]

Excited for the module, can't wait for more news!

[Fromthedeep]

5 minutes ago, F-2 said:

I’m simply pointing out no one will be missing some of the more notable features of the J-8 nor does it do anything that the others don’t.

Not missing the notable features? How about the lack of Chinese avionics? It won't do things the others don't? It has an F-16 style UFC in it... 

[F-2]

2 minutes ago, Fromthedeep said:

Not missing the notable features? How about the lack of Chinese avionics? It won't do things the others don't? It has an F-16 style UFC in it... 

plenty of Chinese aircraft of this time frame use export components. The later J-7 uses an imported HUD. Different J-8 use a mix and match of various avonics, most of them use Italian and Israeli missiles. Their is little benefit debating purity.

[J20Stronk]

The thing that scares me the most is the SPO10-looking RWR in those cockpit pictures .

[Angelthunder]

I don't see why people complain about a prototype aircraft that was never in production when most requests i see in the DCS World wish list forums are other prototypes like RAH-66 Comanche or a F-20 Tigershark or a BAC TSR.

[J20Stronk]

1 minute ago, Angelthunder said:

I don't see why people complain about a prototype aircraft that was never in production when most requests i see in the DCS World wish list forums are other prototypes like RAH-66 Comanche or a F-20 Tigershark or a BAC TSR.

Guarantee the same people complaining would also do so if we got one that was, "bUiLt In LaRgE nUmBeRs", but had it's radar and other avionics be 100% fictional because access to that info isn't available.

This variant - while not "pure" REDFOR or built in large numbers - at least exists, AND has easily accessible data. 

[MiG21bisFishbedL]

2 minutes ago, J20Stronk said:

Guarantee the same people complaining would also do so if we got one that was, "bUiLt In LaRgE nUmBeRs", but had it's radar and other avionics be 100% fictional because access to that info isn't available.

This variant - while not "pure" REDFOR or built in large numbers - at least exists, AND has easily accessible data. 

If they had gone the Chad route, J-8A, they'd have complained about it being outdated.

[Fromthedeep]

15 minutes ago, F-2 said:

Different J-8 use a mix and match of various avonics, most of them use Italian and Israeli missiles. Their is little benefit debating purity.

As far as I'm aware an early J-8II B would use the Chinese built Type 208 radar and I've seen no indication that any of its avionics would be Western in origin. Not like it matters though, because that would still much more closely replicate the actual PVI, capabilities, limitations and experience that comes with operating a historically relevant variant. Missiles are completely irrelevant to the discussion which revolves around PVI and avionics. 

13 minutes ago, J20Stronk said:

Guarantee the same people complaining would also do so if we got one that was, "bUiLt In LaRgE nUmBeRs", but had it's radar and other avionics be 100% fictional because access to that info isn't available.

This variant - while not "pure" REDFOR or built in large numbers - at least exists, AND has easily accessible data. 

And you believe this is not going to be made up? Please.

[gzj3401]

The key point is that we're going to get a J-8II, aren't we?

As for why the variant DIS chooses is the PP, I think it is more about avoiding legal and political risks.

You all know that the Chinese government has very strict control over its military-related documents (even the very old ones). And it is relatively easy to obtain the documents of the western avionics which were equipped by the PP. So it is the best choice for the team to choose a variant which was developed in cooperation with the West.

"After three years of research, hard work and dedication, Deka Ironwork Simulations is pleased to announce their selection of the DCS: J-8II as their next module. "

Considering the quality of the JF-17, I believe the DIS team has found enough material (documents, data, even somebody) to provide us with an aircraft that fully meets the DCS standards.

[Nahen]

DCS starting to turn towards World of Tanks? This plane was never built... In fact, there will be X-Wings soon... Only named Shenyang X-Wing to make it easier to push them...

[J20Stronk]

22 minutes ago, Fromthedeep said:

And you believe this is not going to be made up? Please.

More believable than the functional station 4/6 HARMs on the Viper, Spanish LITENING on an American Hornet and the entirety of BS3. 

[F-2]

6 minutes ago, gzj3401 said:

The key point is that we're going to get a J-8II, aren't we?

As for why the variant DIS chooses is the PP, I think it is more about avoiding legal and political risks.

You all know that the Chinese government has very strict control over its military-related documents (even the very old ones). And it is relatively easy to obtain the documents of the western avionics which were equipped by the PP. So it is the best choice for the team to choose a variant which was developed in cooperation with the West.

"After three years of research, hard work and dedication, Deka Ironwork Simulations is pleased to announce their selection of the DCS: J-8II as their next module. "

Considering the quality of the JF-17, I believe the DIS team has found enough material (documents, data, even somebody) to provide us with an aircraft that fully meets the DCS standards.

That reminds me, I wonder how far along it is