requested Reconsider the hobbling of the Bushes and Shrubs

[Boosterdog]

I'd oringally incorrectly approtioned blame for this to the grass/clutter setting. 

It seems that there is some ratio applied to small bushes that severly limits the distance in which they appear in comparison to larger trees. That ratio also appears to affect the LOD distances. In the orgiinal Caucauses map, shrubs are predominently used to produce the illusion of dense forrestation under the tree canopy. In the more arrid maps however they are far more of an obvious feature in their own right. 

The problem comes in that, despite now being more than  just close up "filler" they remain treated as such which results in a jarringly short view distances, often in otherwise featureless terrain. Not a big issue for Jets perhaps but for helo players its a different matter. 

Any chance this could be looked at in the future or even put on a slider in their own right, separate from the trees? 

[draconus]

Yeah, the bushes/rocks visibility range setting is asked for since NTTR and PG maps releases.

[Boosterdog]

Yup - Life down low is currently not a DCS strongpoint despite the number of recent releases being Helos. 

[YSIAD_RIP]

Yep.. I starting posted comments on this today as well.

• Looks like an easy low hanging fruit problem for DCS to solve. 
• The Slider option to remove or reduce the surfaceDetails is a very reasonable suggestion! 
• And there should be an FPS increase on the ground as well!

Edited October 27, 2024 by YSIAD_RIP

[MAXsenna]

4 hours ago, YSIAD_RIP said:

Yep.. I starting posted comments on this today as well.

• Looks like an easy low hanging fruit problem for DCS to solve. 
• The Slider option to remove or reduce the surfaceDetails is a very reasonable suggestion! 
• And there should be an FPS increase on the ground as well!

 

And fix the alien growing mushrooms. Trees have some similar issues., the "grow", and then shrink or just changes to some other geometrical different tree. At least for me in Syria. 

[Boosterdog]

24 minutes ago, MAXsenna said:

And fix the alien growing mushrooms. Trees have some similar issues., the "grow", and then shrink or just changes to some other geometrical different tree. At least for me in Syria. 

They wouldny have to fix this if we had more bushes to look at  

[MAXsenna]

They wouldny have to fix this if we had more bushes to look at  

Oh! You mean the real bushes and shrubs with correct lids? I agree! Did this come with Nevada?

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[YSIAD_RIP]

2 hours ago, MAXsenna said:

And fix the alien growing mushrooms. Trees have some similar issues., the "grow", and then shrink or just changes to some other geometrical different tree. At least for me in Syria. 

As a "temporary hack" for Syria I renamed the Syria.sd5 file so that at least I could stop the stones and some other ground clutter from "growing" in.

• \DCS World OpenBeta\Mods\terrains\Syria\surfaceDetails\xxxSyria.sd5 

I hope Ugra Media and Eagle Dynamics can get around to fixing the pop-in Surface Details in a future patch. 

[Boosterdog]

7 hours ago, MAXsenna said:

Oh! You mean the real bushes and shrubs with correct lids? I agree! Did this come with Nevada?

Sent from my SM-A536B using Tapatalk
 

I think so. I think its now a comination of clutter radius and draw distance in the some of the tree and bush models.  But there was always an element of the small stuff close draw from Caucauses (I think).  Only they were hid in the forests to give the impression of density.  Syria was the first map I noticed the unfurling effect to a large degree but there was also one particlar tree type in the Caucauses that drew in a shorter range than the others.  None of this is especially noticable in a jet but in a helo - well you have a lot longer to consider your surroundings. 

5 hours ago, YSIAD_RIP said:

As a "temporary hack" for Syria I renamed the Syria.sd5 file so that at least I could stop the stones and some other ground clutter from "growing" in.

• \DCS World OpenBeta\Mods\terrains\Syria\surfaceDetails\xxxSyria.sd5 

I hope Ugra Media and Eagle Dynamics can get around to fixing the pop-in Surface Details in a future patch. 

Theres that and  the Anabasis_setifera in the surface detail folderfor Syria. In PG its small_bush and small_bush_group.  But we shouldnt have to be removing stuff in 2024. 

[BIGNEWY]

Bush pop in is something we have asked the team to tweak, I know as mostly a helo flyer now it can be disconcerting to see it happen when flying low, I hope we can teak it in the future. 

thank you 

[MAXsenna]

Bush pop in is something we have asked the team to tweak, I know as mostly a helo flyer now it can be disconcerting to see it happen when flying low, I hope we can teak it in the future. 
thank you 

To be honest it's even worse and more noticeable going supersonic in the Viggen 5' off the ground in Afghanistan. And having them pop out THROUGH the snow in Kola makes my Nordic head spin!

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[Boosterdog]

9 minutes ago, BIGNEWY said:

Bush pop in is something we have asked the team to tweak, I know as mostly a helo flyer now it can be disconcerting to see it happen when flying low, I hope we can teak it in the future. 

thank you 

I know both NL and yourself are pushing - so thank you. Im not sure Teak is appropriate to the location though  

[BIGNEWY]

The problem is we also have to consider many systems and the FPS impact it may have. But I agree the setting needs tweaking as it has been set at the current value for a long time. 

[Hiob]

16 minutes ago, BIGNEWY said:

The problem is we also have to consider many systems and the FPS impact it may have. But I agree the setting needs tweaking as it has been set at the current value for a long time. 

Please give us the power to adjust those settings ourselves. At least give us a accessable .lua for this kind of stuff. That would be so awesome.

[Hiob]

A little bit selfish to link that here, but I think those issues are very closely related:

 

[MAXsenna]

A little bit selfish to link that here, but I think those issues are very closely related:
 

Could be, while I'm not sure. Did some testing throughout the maps today.
Syria is the WORST! (Forgot to test PG, while I'm sure it's the same). Couldn't believe it. Caucasus and Nevada doesn't have the "issue" at all. Afghanistan could do better. Sinaï on the other hand amazed me compared to the others. Grass, plowed fields etc. don't have it, while Syria does. Flying over "desert"/non-cultivated ground has the issue of course, while not as intrusive as Syria. And it's really good when you enter grass, farms etc. Because it STOPS!!!!
Need to test Kola some more in the summer time. Winter as I've said before ia just some plain alien landscape down south. Anyone knows if it's better to report issues here in the forum, or on the ORBX site? Oops. Didn't do the SA map. Too many maps. Forgot about it.

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[Hiob]

10 minutes ago, MAXsenna said:

Could be, while I'm not sure. Did some testing throughout the maps today.
Syria is the WORST! (Forgot to test PG, while I'm sure it's the same). Couldn't believe it. Caucasus and Nevada doesn't have the "issue" at all. Afghanistan could do better. Sinaï on the other hand amazed me compared to the others. Grass, plowed fields etc. don't have it, while Syria does. Flying over "desert"/non-cultivated ground has the issue of course, while not as intrusive as Syria. And it's really good when you enter grass, farms etc. Because it STOPS!!!!
Need to test Kola some more in the summer time. Winter as I've said before ia just some plain alien landscape down south. Anyone knows if it's better to report issues here in the forum, or on the ORBX site? Oops. Didn't do the SA map. Too many maps. Forgot about it.

Sent from my SM-A536B using Tapatalk
 

Maybe some of the LoD settings are map specific. I am not 100% sure, but I think back then I unsuccessfully tried to find some .luas to mess with.

[MAXsenna]

Maybe some of the LoD settings are map specific. I am not 100% sure, but I think back then I unsuccessfully tried to find some .luas to mess with.

I've never come across anyone that has mitigated this in any way. Also the grass/clutter slider doed not do anything.
I encourage you to try Sïnai. It's clearly that ORT has excluded farms, fields etc.

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[Hotdognz]

6 hours ago, MAXsenna said:

I've never come across anyone that has mitigated this in any way. Also the grass/clutter slider doed not do anything.
I encourage you to try Sïnai. It's clearly that ORT has excluded farms, fields etc.

Sent from my SM-A536B using Tapatalk
 

The grass clutter slider hasnt done anything for years that I can tell, its like its broken or something

[Boosterdog]

When Syria came out Mustang produced a method of extending the draw distances. You needed a monster PC but it worked and it looked great.. Cant recall if it affected bushes though but it certainly helped in many other regards. Fences and wiping shadows especially, not to mention the trees that were, initally very hobbled. All moot as I think subsequently ED encrypted the files used. The mod effectivley altered the values of the Ultra and Extreme setting  (and somthing about a setting that was there but unused). Obviously since that time Syria has been refined but not to the point something like this would still be a boon for those lucky enough to run very high spec rigs. 

So the draw distances could be altered relatively easily (if bluntly) and there was already an additional level in the game sitting unused as far as I know. 

[BIGNEWY]

We have made a request to the team to take a look at this setting. 

thank you 

[Hiob]

1 hour ago, Hotdognz said:

The grass clutter slider hasnt done anything for years that I can tell, its like its broken or something

That's not true actually. You can even change it in real time while in the cockpit and see the amount of grass increase or decrease. (Well, maybe it's different from map to map)

Edited October 29, 2024 by Hiob

[MAXsenna]

That's not true actually. You can even change it in real time while in the cockpit and see the amount of grass increase or decrease. (Well, maybe it's different from map to map)

Yeah, I can clearly see it. Works in Syria, I know for a fact.

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[BIGNEWY]

Grass slider is for the grass and it works. 

The pop in we are all discussing is more to do with ground clutter and bushes. 

[freehand]

This has been a thing since day 1 including lockon days as I said in a previous post not going to change but would like to be proven wrong. 

Edited October 29, 2024 by freehand