Little details that you've noticed?

[kylania]

I totally know what you mean, like the screech, slam, rip, wind flapping, metal crunching, alarm buzzer whoosh sound I always get! Lets me know I reached the target area.

[Cali]

Something important to remember is that while flying in game, unless you do something major to effect the flight dynamics, there is no easy way to "feel" very slight changes. Unless you have some wicked-sick setup you are always playing the game at 1-g. Sound effects play a crucial role in attempting to convey a feeling. This is why your landing gear has a somewhat loud and obvious "grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr-che-chunk" whenever you are raising or lowering the gear. Its why you hear a faint "chek" whenever you release a bomb. Not saying that you wouldn't hear sounds like that in the real thing, just saying that it helps magnify the fact that you dropped a bomb or your landing gear is all the way down.

 

Yep, games were made like that cause we can't always feel and see things a real pilot would.

[RogueRunner]

Actually you can hear and more importantly feel the gear transition in every thing I've ever flown.

 

You flying small stuff then right :music_whistling:

[Blaze]

You flying small stuff then right :music_whistling:

:D

[BlueRidgeDx]

You flying small stuff then right :music_whistling:

 

I realize we're talking about fighters here, but you can feel the gear coming up and going down (in the cockpit) in everything from a J-41 (twin turboprop) to the DC-10... I wouldn't call those "small stuff".

 

It's a combination of things:

 

1) Gear doors open causing a noticeable increase in wind noise.

 

2) The hydraulic actuators for the gear are pretty stout, and you can feel it when they start moving.

 

3) There is a perceptible "bounce" in the cockpit as the nose gear starts moving.

 

4) Once the wheels are in the wells, the wind noise is drastically reduced.

 

5) You can hear and feel the shimmy as the nose wheel rubs against the "snubber" used to stop wheel rotation...the wheel well is right under your feet.

 

Does an A-10 pilot expereince the same feedback? I don't know. But all the same mechanics and functions are there.

[RogueRunner]

I realize we're talking about fighters here, but you can feel the gear coming up and going down (in the cockpit) in everything from a J-41 (twin turboprop) to the DC-10... I wouldn't call those "small stuff".

 

It's a combination of things:

 

1) Gear doors open causing a noticeable increase in wind noise.

 

2) The hydraulic actuators for the gear are pretty stout, and you can feel it when they start moving.

 

3) There is a perceptible "bounce" in the cockpit as the nose gear starts moving.

 

4) Once the wheels are in the wells, the wind noise is drastically reduced.

 

5) You can hear and feel the shimmy as the nose wheel rubs against the "snubber" used to stop wheel rotation...the wheel well is right under your feet.

 

Does an A-10 pilot expereince the same feedback? I don't know. But all the same mechanics and functions are there.

 

In the J41, perhaps, in the DC10, very doubtful! Do not believe everything you hear in representations of these aircraft from PMDG and others. ;)

 

In the Chieftain for example, an aircraft I fly regularly in RL gear extension is not very loud, and when done late in the approach (2 dots low on the ILS) when the speed is pretty much on Vref already the wind noise is not that drastic. In the C210 again in comparison, gear extension is very very loud.

 

On the MD83 flights I've flown as self loading freight and sitting at the emergency exits over the wings, it was very very difficult to hear the gear going down. Flaps yes, gear, no. On the 732 again, gear extension is very prominent.

 

Like someone already mentioned before, those sounds are most prob included in sim/games to make up for our lack of feedback you will get from being there for real. Like the 'click' when you drop a bomb for instance. Totally artificial I recon and not present in the DCS A10, or not my version at least.

[MTFDarkEagle]

Does an A-10 pilot expereince the same feedback? I don't know. But all the same mechanics and functions are there.

 

Have a look at this post:

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=1025028&postcount=1

[BlueRidgeDx]

In the J41, perhaps, in the DC10, very doubtful! Do not believe everything you hear in representations of these aircraft from PMDG and others. ;)

 

LOL... I spent a few hundred hours strapped to the cockpit door of the J-41 commuting to/from work, so I don't need to rely on anyone else's interpretation. ;)

 

Same can be said for the CRJ-200/700, A319/320, 737-400, SF340, 767 and the DC-10...again, I experienced it with my own butt in the cockpit, so...

 

Can't speak about the Chieftan as I've never flown one - though I did almost have a mid-air with one in a CRJ descending into Burlington, VT but that's different story.

 

But I've had the pleasure of riding up front on the MD-88 several times, and it is easily the best example of the phenomena I explained... even light braking results in a distinct low frequency vibration in the front of the airplane. The sound of the oleo uncompressing during rotation is unmistakeable. The increase in wind noise as the gear doors open is significant. Finally, the vibration and thumping from the nose wheel contacting the snubber feels like someone beating on the bottom of the jumpseat.

 

Just my unsolicited two cents...

Edited November 11, 2010 by BlueRidgeDx

[BlueRidgeDx]

Have a look at this post:

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=1025028&postcount=1

 

Not sure how that relates? I was referring to the aural and physiological "feedback" that an A-10 pilot experiences in the cockpit.

 

My point was that an A-10 is no different than any other airplane, in that open gear doors increase wind noise, rapidly moving (and very heavy) landing gear components impart large forces on the airframe, and hydraulically actuated components operating at 3,000psi given a certain feedback.

[MTFDarkEagle]

Ah, I see what you mean :)

[Cali]

I realize we're talking about fighters here, but you can feel the gear coming up and going down (in the cockpit) in everything from a J-41 (twin turboprop) to the DC-10... I wouldn't call those "small stuff".

 

It's a combination of things:

 

1) Gear doors open causing a noticeable increase in wind noise.

 

2) The hydraulic actuators for the gear are pretty stout, and you can feel it when they start moving.

 

3) There is a perceptible "bounce" in the cockpit as the nose gear starts moving.

 

4) Once the wheels are in the wells, the wind noise is drastically reduced.

 

5) You can hear and feel the shimmy as the nose wheel rubs against the "snubber" used to stop wheel rotation...the wheel well is right under your feet.

 

Does an A-10 pilot expereince the same feedback? I don't know. But all the same mechanics and functions are there.

 

From my F-16 flight, I couldn't hear the AB kick in or the gear coming up or down. I didn't even feel anything when the gear came up or down, no change in wind noise, or shimmy as you call it.

[ESzczesniak]

From my F-16 flight, I couldn't hear the AB kick in or the gear coming up or down. I didn't even feel anything when the gear came up or down, no change in wind noise, or shimmy as you call it.

 

Well, a F-16 isn't an A-10 either. There are good arguments that you should feel/hear the gear and there are good arguments that you shouldn't. To know for sure, we'll need to hear from a real A-10 pilot. Unfortunately, being a single seat plane I don't think too many non-pilots got a back seat ride in this bird.

[DiabloSP]

I'm guessing the titanium bathub that protects the pilot from 23mm fire should reduce a lot any noise generated under his seat, but come on, this is a PC sim, realistic or not, we NEED those sounds and feedback. Every noise gives a little bit more of that "being there" feeling.

[BlueRidgeDx]

From my F-16 flight, I couldn't hear the AB kick in or the gear coming up or down. I didn't even feel anything when the gear came up or down, no change in wind noise, or shimmy as you call it.

 

I'm envious that you got a ride in the viper, and I hear what you're saying.

 

Please don't take this the wrong way, as I genuinely don't mean anything negative by it, but having flown in something one time, all the noises, vibrations and sensations were probably new to you. So it's quite possible that you simply missed these subtle cues amongst the "background noise" of everything else.

 

If I were ever able to sandbag a viper ride, you can bet that my attention wouldn not be focused on gear retraction either.

 

But I'm willing to bet that if you (or anyone) flew in something, say, 20 times, you'd be far more in-tune with the machine, and would be able to pick things out of all the background noise.

 

I don't know how noticeable these things are in an A-10 or an F-16...maybe you're right. All I'm saying is that it's not a "stupid" concept that a pilot could feel/hear these things. Quite often, you can.

[Cali]

I'm envious that you got a ride in the viper, and I hear what you're saying.

 

Please don't take this the wrong way, as I genuinely don't mean anything negative by it, but having flown in something one time, all the noises, vibrations and sensations were probably new to you. So it's quite possible that you simply missed these subtle cues amongst the "background noise" of everything else.

 

If I were ever able to sandbag a viper ride, you can bet that my attention wouldn not be focused on gear retraction either.

 

But I'm willing to bet that if you (or anyone) flew in something, say, 20 times, you'd be far more in-tune with the machine, and would be able to pick things out of all the background noise.

 

I don't know how noticeable these things are in an A-10 or an F-16...maybe you're right. All I'm saying is that it's not a "stupid" concept that a pilot could feel/hear these things. Quite often, you can.

 

I understand what your saying. Normal pilots may hear and feel that kind of stuff, but I didn't hear or feel anything. This is a game and since we don't have the full spectrum that pilots have, they made it easier. Like hearing the gear, flaps instead of feeling them and the change in how the jet reacts. I will however ask some pilots next time I talk to them about things like that.

[Stretch]

When you have the cockpit flood lights on and the canopy open, you get less flood light than with the canopy closed, because half of the flood lights are mounted on the canopy rim.

[Hekktor]

Pilot Ltc Peter Pan - on what plane? I smiled ;)

[mvsgas]

I understand what your saying. Normal pilots may hear and feel that kind of stuff, but I didn't hear or feel anything. This is a game and since we don't have the full spectrum that pilots have, they made it easier. Like hearing the gear, flaps instead of feeling them and the change in how the jet reacts. I will however ask some pilots next time I talk to them about things like that.

 

I will back Cali on this. You can feel some of the stuff and I knew what was happening but you can't here any of it because of the head phones in the helmet and the engine rumble will drown anything else. Also the bumps and vibration are subtle in the F-16. Even when just swinging the gear for ops checks, you can barely feel the or hear it withing the cockpit. The loudest part is when the doors close.

 

I know the Sim is for an A-10 and things are definitely different on that aircraft, I'm just saying I experience the same thing on my F-16 ride.

[BlueRidgeDx]

Thanks, mvsgas.

 

I'll readily concede that I've never flown in a fighter, and that each airplane is different. I was really just reacting to the folks that think it's preposterous that a pilot can feel or hear things like that.

 

There are a great many airplanes where the sounds and sensations aren't nearly as subtle as they apparently are on an F-16.

[mvsgas]

Sorry, I was not correcting nor arguing with your point. You have a good one. I was simply agreeing with Cali. Cheers

[Dimebag1]

Yeah, like most airliners, you will hear the gears extend and retract with a loud clunk, and flaps extending and retracting as well. I know there is a big difference between an airliner and a fighter jet (I worked on airliners, cone-head here).

[Kaiza]

Obviously it differs amongst aircraft, but from the 100 or so hours FJ I have on one frame only, you most definitely hear the gear and speedbrakes, particularly at high speed.

 

It is easy to miss though. The first sense you lose when you 'helmet fire' (you brain falls behind the speed of the aircraft) is your sense of hearing. I remember flying an ILS and forgetting to bring the speed brake in when configuring. The common joke amongst instructors when students did this was to say "Hmm I wonder what that rumbling sound is?" while the students brain exploded wondering why the hell his power settings weren't working.

Edited November 16, 2010 by Kaiza

[Cali]

Yeah, like most airliners, you will hear the gears extend and retract with a loud clunk, and flaps extending and retracting as well. I know there is a big difference between an airliner and a fighter jet (I worked on airliners, cone-head here).

 

I think on every airliner I have flown on I heard the gear and flaps. Maybe because they are so big...

 

Sounds were added to the game like that cause we have no sense of speed (changes due to slowing down with the speed brake open or gear down/up). Back in FC1 I changed my gear sound to were I could not hear it. There were a few times I was wondering why I wasn't picking up speed. I looked down and saw that my gear was still down. It's a habit to always look down and make sure the lights are out now, even if I know I put them up or down.....part of mine checklist.

Edited November 17, 2010 by Cali

[Dimebag1]

Yeah I have the same problem sometimes, but with my airbrake, especially when the controls loose their sound.

[recoil17]

Smoke from burning vehicles can MASK the targeting pod.

 

See this video at 5:50 (not my video)