How about our new hyperlobby players?

[Battle_Rattle]

Hey guys...

 

I wanted to drop a line to ask help from veteran hyperlobby players.

 

To me this game is very cool, but based on my own personal experience (5 months ago) getting up and running and playing online effectively was pretty hard. When you're new, Hyperlobby isn't the greatest place to get a question answered about why "things" happen, it's not the place to find a newbie server (with labels and the easy stuff on) where you can see what your missles and enemy missles are doing etc... So on that note, I really want to emplore people to answer new players questions... about anything really... yes if a player has clearly not done any of the training then you should send them packing lol.... Help our new players understand why they keep getting shot down and why they arent shooting others down. lol... little things will help

 

Here's the reason why.... We're getting some more people, word of mouth about the download may still be there, but certainly there are people buying LOMAC GOLD in the stores... new people means more fun... but we've got to get them trained and staying... Yes there is in game training but it doesnt explain some of the more important things.... when you were new who knew the best cornering speed for an F-15 was about 360 mph? Or that a Tor only has 8 missles to fire? Or when ECM burnthrough happens? Or where a good forum is?

 

So..... unpack what you think are "operational secrets" and get our new players hooked by helping them out with the "little" things... :D

 

 

 

P.S. To those that help noobs and set up noob hyperlobby servers then the above wasnt for you lol

[JonTex]

Right on Brotha :D

[Battle_Rattle]

I swear I'd pay 10 bucks a month to someone with a dedicated server if they would put up maps that would help inexperienced players become killers..... I'm sick of seeing the same players! Yes you! lololol

[Tracker]

Good point Battle_Rattle. We have some really good posts here for pilots in training and pointing them here is a step in the right direction. Its a bit of a catch 22 for those that don't know enough to join a training group (aka squad) and learn things the hard way by joining servers with ACE settings.

 

Unfortunately most servers are set up to serve the majority. Perhaps the community can get together and alternate serving up a mission for pilot training - {EDIT} Five servers, Five days. (Keep the Weekends Open for the Real Deals) This should be a community effort and not just fall on a couple individuals.

 

{EDIT}: I'm not sure what the following post disagrees with :cool: but I certainly Applaude the 504 for setting aside time on Thursdays for Pilots in Training and Havok and I will be putting up the Red_Flag server in similar fashion on Mondays 0800 GMT through Tuesday 0800 GMT With different skill slots and missions throughout the day. We invite skilled pilots from all areas to fly with them and assist as necessary. Pilots in training can find our teamspeak at http://redflag.urad.net/pit.htm

 

Well, that leaves Tue, Wed & Fri for anyone else that has a good heart towards our new pilots. :icon_wink

 

As far as your second post goes Ice. Often its the attitude of the teacher that destroys willingness of the student. Calling Pilots in Training derogatory names and belittling them as you are attempting to do in your post is counter productive. My advice: Keep such things for your own squad, don't spread it through the community.

 

Secrets? Exploits? About the only thing I can offer is in the F15, press 4 then 2 and you will have radar while on the ground :D :rolleyes: .

[Ice]

I tend not to agree. 169th have a public teamspeak and we ARE willing to help new guys. But like you say if they ask dumb questions alot which are answered in the manual or in the training tracks which Shepski spent a huge amount of time and effort creating, then they arent going to last in this sim anyway. Lock On is hard it will allways have a high attrition rate.

 

In short: Help comes to those who help themselves.

[Ice]

Also Tracker. You should know as well as anyone. That ability is not why players get recruited. Attitude is far more important.

[Shaman]

First of all - the manual! Lockon 1.1 manual is a must, yes. Explains hell a lot of stuff.

Then newbies must learn use TeamSpeak. It is easier to explain stuff via voice comm then typing in LockOn.

And at the end, ED still has not released true dedicated server :( That's why you don't see many of those. The only few "dedicated" you get, are set on Ace settings.

[504MrWolf]

Hiya guys the VVS504 are here to help !

 

Check here - http://www.forum.lockon.ru/showthread.php?p=112887#post112887

[S77th-GOYA]

I've offerred advice many times to new players and will continue to do so when my situation allows. But new pilots MUST put themselves through the training offline before coming onto an ace server. I also feel that playing with labels doesn't help a player to learn how to play without labels except in the early stages of training.

[bflagg]

I will say for the record, GOYA has helped me quite a bit and even offered to go

beyond pure netiquette.. (which I haven't had to a chance to take him up on..).

 

If fact most of the S77th was helpfull (and I'm an old time flight sim fan..)

[S77th-Paralyzer]

Hiya guys the VVS504 are here to help !

 

Check here - http://www.forum.lockon.ru/showthread.php?p=112887#post112887

 

I know the 504th are a bunch of friendly guys and I'm sure they would have no problem helping you.

 

The training tracks and manual can probably answer most of your questions but like Goya said if you need help just give us a ring.

[Maulkin]

I have flown the sim for years, I have done all the training (that ncludes the original v1.0 stuff, the 1.03 updated training tracks, the latest v1.1 tracks and even Ironhand's stuff), flown offline many times in many missions and in some cases I do OK, in others I get my ass handed to me and I have to fly the missions multiple times to firgure out what keeps blowing me out of the sky, but for the life of me I can rarely do anything on an online server.

 

Which is frustrating because I prefer flying IL2:Forgotten Battles online far far more than offline. The human component adds so much more.

 

But when I do go online, those few and brief times I feel brave enough, in LOMAC, I will rarely ask questions simply because I am afraid that something I am asking may have been mentioned in the manual and I simply forgot, and never had to use it until now. For example I join a server and I start on the tarmack but my HUD is off and instruments are disabled. Offline, this has never happened to me so I have no idea what is going on. Obviously, the master power switch needs to be turned on, and I am sure this is detailed in the manual somewhere, but I dont know this and I fear to ask. So I log off and give up. (It's SHIFT-L in case you dont know)

 

Or perhaps I read something in the manual but dont fully comprehend what it means. For example a key is designated EOS/TV but so far I have only used the 'O' key for the Su-25T. I had no idea the 'O' key was useful for the Mig/Flanker and even the A-10 (CCRP).

 

So what I am saying here guys is that there are no stupid questions. It only seems simple to you because you know the answer and have probably known it for years. Some people dont know a damn thing about modern fighters and dont know what a CCRP or EWS is. Take the time to answer them and eventually they will be the ones to answer the questions for the next guy with questions.

 

Here is an example of frustration. I like flying the Su-25T so I jump on a server yesterday and load one up to do SEAD (I later discover I cannot use SEAD weapons to keep it fair for the A-10 guys and I respect that). Well the server is highest difficulty with no labels, no map, no external views. But the problem is I have no idea what airfeild I am at, and no idea where I need to go. I see some guys take off in a couple of Su-27's (I think) so I follow in their general direction. They leave me in their dust of course, but they dont have TS and are typing messages so at least I dont feel totally alone. I am not very good with the message interface so I am being rather silent. Eventually one is hit and destroyed and he tells the other that "there are alot of SAM at Waypoint 3". I inform them that I am trying to do SEAD but I have no idea where WP3 is. All I see are mountains and I have no idea where I am, how to find the SAM, or even how to get back to the airfield. I get locked up a couple of times (by enemy aircraft) but I pop ECM and dive between mountains. I never see any SAM, did see a bandit just as he blew up the other guy but I was too far and ill equipped to do anything about it. Eventually I ran out of fuel and crashed.

 

In any case I think I will take Mr.Wolf up on his offer and see if I can master online flight.

[Gazehound]

Here is an example of frustration. I like flying the Su-25T so I jump on a server yesterday and load one up to do SEAD (I later discover I cannot use SEAD weapons to keep it fair for the A-10 guys and I respect that). Well the server is highest difficulty with no labels, no map, no external views. But the problem is I have no idea what airfeild I am at, and no idea where I need to go. I see some guys take off in a couple of Su-27's (I think) so I follow in their general direction. They leave me in their dust of course, but they dont have TS and are typing messages so at least I dont feel totally alone. I am not very good with the message interface so I am being rather silent. Eventually one is hit and destroyed and he tells the other that "there are alot of SAM at Waypoint 3". I inform them that I am trying to do SEAD but I have no idea where WP3 is. All I see are mountains and I have no idea where I am, how to find the SAM, or even how to get back to the airfield. I get locked up a couple of times (by enemy aircraft) but I pop ECM and dive between mountains. I never see any SAM, did see a bandit just as he blew up the other guy but I was too far and ill equipped to do anything about it. Eventually I ran out of fuel and crashed.

 

In any case I think I will take Mr.Wolf up on his offer and see if I can master online flight.

 

The breifing and map 'should' give you all the info you need about targets and waypoints, remember to check them out before hitting fly.

Online flight is great if communications are good. If the flanker pilots have different WP3 to yours there should be at least a shared bullseye WP to use to give a bearing and location of the ground threat, and also of course to communicate your position so they may help you out from air threats.

It is hard typing and flying sometimes though! :rolleyes:

[S77th-RYKE]

the MOST important for new people online is

 

LEARN TO IDENTIFY friend or foe , and when in doubt DO NOT TAKE THE SHOT

 

enough "accidents" happen because missiles start tracking another target on the path to the one you have locked :( so make sure what you are shooting at is ennemy and that no friendly is between you and your target .

 

Shooting down a friendly happens to the best of us still , it is courteous and polite to acknowledge the mistake and APOLOGISE , then being double carefull not to do it again . I you do it again , disconnect and reread the manual YOU ARE DOING SOMETHING WRONG.

 

Remember that in rus planes the radar/EOS system will try to track the target when it is losing lock by switching to the other mode , sometimes you think you still have the radar on and no "F" appears on the hud so you are thinking "this plane is ennemy" make sure by turning on your radar again ,ALWAYS turn it on again especially in a close combat mode . you will often be really surprised at the "F" appearing and realise you were about to shoot a friendly.

 

Read the briefing (in fact it would be cool if ED would replace the loading screen plane image with the briefing page while we load :) )

 

Don't take off from taxi way , act like you are flying a real plane and your enjoyment/immersion will double .

 

the Savage 77th have a help page for new pilot here

http://www.s77th.com/LomacHelp.php

 

And those of you who still don't fly online are missing out on a great time ...nothing compares to fighting a "real" virtual pilot .

 

C YAs up there

[S77th-konkussion]

Utilise the public TS channels that most of the hosts provide.. I've been thinking it might also be incumbent upon us to join those channels regularly to help, too. Admittedly, we don't do that often for various reasons, but maybe we should.

[NEODARK]

Hey guys, n00bs to LockOn specially... I might have a solution for some of you that might be interested.

 

First of all, I'm Neodark, "n00b to LockOn FC"

 

Let me tell you,

 

We have all been there at one point (I still am a n00b) and this is one thing many of the more experienced players tend to forget. Yes many do have an awesome attitude, but some get annoyed rather quickly when we ask the "n00b to them" questions, and you know who I'm talking about, yes you posted in this thread, but I wont say more...

 

I understand it gets old, but remember what is like to be a n00b, remember what you went trough. What's more, a n00b in your game will kick your butt in another game, just keep that in mind, in the end we are all n00bs at one point or another :tongue:

 

Now, enough of the banter.. Lets just get down to it: No ammount of offline training is going to be as good as a bunch of guys helping eachother out via TeamSpeak, a human will never be AI.... :cool:

 

As of last week, I found another person in the same exact position I'm in. That is.. Learning the ropes and having tons of fun while doing so. (I'm not posting his name, because I dont know if he'd mind) but let's just say that between me and him we have learned a ton of stuff about this awesome game, and we are more hooked than ever on it. More than anything I really thank him for sharing so much info and giving me help where I needed it.

 

There is NOTHING like having someone else to ask questions to, and share answers with (things a tutorial wont tell you). At least they won't get annoyed with the simple questions more advanced players think are common knowledge. (so how do I start my engine?) ;)

 

I have the means to setup a server for those of you interested in less than "ACE" level stuff, the ones that are just starting and have the questions, the ones that feel a bit affraid to jump in hyperlobby for fear of being flamed to hell and back for commiting a small "noob" mistake. Hell I dont care if you shot me down and are on my own team, we are learning and having fun doing so, after all this SIM is a GAME and GAMES are for FUN...

 

If anyone here wants to join a couple of other guys (it's 3 of us so far, but I can host at least 15 players) to just have fun and learn along the way, shoot me a PM. I will provide you with the necessary information to get started. There are only two requirements, TeamSpeak, and to have Flaming Cliffs, as the older versions are not compatible with my server.

 

My flying skills have come around tremendously with the help of the "other guys", with the help we have been able to share between us, and we'd love to have more people come over. Hey the more the merrier, right? the more we can learn from each other without being worried of getting flamed for asking a seemingly simple question in Hyperlobby.

 

As for the community,

 

Let me say I'm really happy to be part of this game and community (even though I just started) because all the resources and help available from each other. Yeah, even if you guys get annoyed with our "noob questions" sometimes :tongue:

 

cya around/.

-Neodark

[Maulkin]

Can someone show me what this 'F' looks like on the HUD (ie a screenshot)? Is there a russain HUD equivalent?

[S77th-konkussion]

Only the russian HUD does this- Currently the F15 displays IFF with shapes. Circles/dots for friendly, or rectangles for hostile be it jamming or a contact. The patch, when/ if it arrives, removes the ability of the F15 to distinguish jamming signals.

[S77th-RYKE]

Can someone show me what this 'F' looks like on the HUD (ie a screenshot)? Is there a russain HUD equivalent?

 

sure here you go :)

[Maulkin]

The breifing and map 'should' give you all the info you need about targets and waypoints, remember to check them out before hitting fly.

Online flight is great if communications are good. If the flanker pilots have different WP3 to yours there should be at least a shared bullseye WP to use to give a bearing and location of the ground threat, and also of course to communicate your position so they may help you out from air threats.

It is hard typing and flying sometimes though! :rolleyes:

 

Indeed the briefing does detail this, but it is including the briefing for everyone and I get confused with all the information cluttered in there. What would be nice is a way to view my briefing while in flight and see only my flights breifing and be able to filter in the other flights briefing as well. It was so cluttered I could not figure out where the Su-25T's were taking off from. I knew it was one of three airbases and with each I had to head basically north.

 

The problem with communicating my position is that I have no way of knowing what my position is. I see a whole lot of mountains in front of me and a big sea behind me and a little town down on the left. That is pretty much all I would be able to tell them....and later on all I could see were mountains and after evading 2 locks I had no idea where I was.

 

I agree it is hard to type while getting shot at. ;)

 

BTW the manual tends to concentrate on explaining how to fly each aircraft and use its different modes. The manual does not describe how to use the game interface. For example the briefing and debreifing screen; how to interpret it and use any of its functions. Another example is that I have been flying the Mig campain and I have no idea how to get the campain to record my results to the pilot career I have created. After each mission I click on the 'head' to see how I did and everything is still at zero.

[iceden]

Battles/Trackers idea of offering a chunk of server time for all to enjoy is a good idea for I think is obvious reasons. I know myself, and am by no means an expert, must answer many many questions everyday; some of these questions are questions people should have answered by themselves training single player, for example. Fact of the matter is, LockOn is not a arcade style game but more a sim and can be very challenging. Throw in the fact that many things are happening at high speed and throw in a bug or two with some of the technicals, it is a very challenging atmosphere. But there is no way anyone is going to learn what they need to fly on the servers by just flying single player. The training tracks, missions and manual .pdf's, for example, as good as they are, do not tie everything together for you and you are not going to learn what you need unless you are flying with experienced people. Without some server time set up for training, you will get those who are going to ask you questions everyday which will make you take focus away from your game which is not fair to the guys who are relying on you to do your part right here right now on the server mission you are on. It would benefit everyone to have somewhere they could go to ask and learn, without taking away from those who are in to fly and are trying to achieve a goal or win a battle and are relyed upon for doing their part. Even the Goyas, Ices and others in HL like Tracker etc sometimes want just to fly but must change focus or stop helping the team to give focus to someone that is probably not ready to be on that server, but understandably, want to fly with the guys. The hundreds of learnings that are scattered on forum posts or web sites could maybe be pulled together to a single or at least fewer place of learning and I bet even the muck mucks would learn something new...

[Weta43]

First a bit of a rant..

It's all very well whever it was above telling the SU25 pilot about receiving positions relative to the bullseye & waypoints, but I've read the thread about the bullseye system that s/one has set up & I still wouldn't have a clue how to actually use it online.

Also - if that guy was flying a 25 around - it's a very sparse cockpit. You can't even flick to navigation mode to get your bearings from airfields. Once he's lost he's got to either RTB or fly all the way back to the last waypoint he missed & follow the waypoints like a slave with no idea where he's going.

Given that in real life a pilot would actually have access to a map to compare with what they see out the window, & (correct me if I'm wrong but my understanding is ) that serverside you can filter on & off what displays on the map, why would servers disable the ability of the pilot to see their own position & any fixed targets/waypoints from F10?

Or are you telling me that real su25 pilot briefings consist of pilots being shown a map, being made to memorise it & then eat it...

 

Or is it just a bit of elitism?

 

Now what I was actually going to write..

I know it's probably a bit of a chore for whever ends up doing it, but the idea of rotating the running of a noob server is a very good idea.

Missiles on 50%, map view enabled. No external views.

I don't know if the server can define label states or just enable or disable labels, but if they can define them then making both team colours the same & setting the labels to something like:

 

AirFormat = {}

AirFormat[750] = ""

AirFormat[6500] = "%N"

AirFormat[15000] = "-'-"

AirFormat[22000] = "-"

AirFormat[32000] = "."

 

WeaponFormat = {}

WeaponFormat[500] = " "

WeaponFormat[3000] = "%D"

WeaponFormat[9000] = "-"

WeaponFormat[12000] = " "

 

ColorAliesSide = {125, 0, 125}

ColorEnemiesSide = {125, 0, 125}

 

 

would be a way to make them check friend or foe & make them keep their eyes open to wean them off labels.

The "let them learn the hard way like I did" thing is all very well if what you want is to keep the game for all the "Real Men" out there, but that's also a very good way to keep this a game with a limited number of players.

[Weta43]

See - now I've just looked at the next thread up (vvs504 noob day) & I just look stupid...

[S77th-RYKE]

Or there's an idea .......the new flyers could just learn to ID friend or foe

 

anyway... if you haven't flown online don't bother giving advice to those who do ... and I don't mean 10 or 20 hours worth.

 

don't get me wrong , I still respect those who don't . so no flaming please but look at it this way , it's like a person commenting on a restaurant who has only heard about it from forums or ordered take out from it once or twice ...

 

GET IN THE RESTAURANT AND SPEND SOME TIME THERE BEFORE YOU JUDGE IT

 

LOL :)

[GGTharos]

It isn't about elitism; people who are expereinced like to fly this way.

 

It also so happens that these people own and pay for various servers (non-owners aren't a consideration in this discussion) ... they will thus run it the way they want to run it - the way THEY enjoy flying. That's simply not something you can argue with.

 

Now, some have kindly offered their services (like vvs504) and others do not - that's their choice, and neither's wrong.

 

If you want to play online with labels on, find a server that has them on -or- run one yourself ... those are the two viable solutions - nothing elitist about it.