DCS Combined Arms; will there be logistics?

[NineLine]

Adding resource management is one step closer to "Dynamic" Campaigns...

 

I dont think if they add resource management, that you will have to become a bean counter in order to fly your A-10, but it can add dynamic situations to your missions...

 

of course I dont know how it will all work, but thats one possibility...

[Intruder_360]

Logistics, maybe a great idea for a further module. One Transport aircraft, one transport helicopter, fuel trucks, repair trucks, munition trucks and medics for to support troops and supporting helicopters near the battlefield without a Farp. :music_whistling:

 

regards Intruder

[Sparker]

I think It's a good idea. Including logistics will probably cause players to value their supply vehicles more because otherwise there will be lack of resourses.

[Cadmium77]

Logistics, maybe a great idea for a further module. One Transport aircraft, one transport helicopter, fuel trucks, repair trucks, munition trucks and medics for to support troops and supporting helicopters near the battlefield without a Farp. :music_whistling:

 

regards Intruder

 

 

 

And trains too. Tanks are brought to the front by trains..The Crimea in DCS is a huge theater; imagine interdicting a train of flatcars with BRDMs on it in transport with a wing of A10s

 

 

 

A Digitalized Transport Network

 

A railway bridge was destroyed by enemy missiles, blocking the route of a military train.

 

On receiving the report, the military transportation command center ordered the military train to run back on to another route.

Seven teams of rival military representatives in the drill immediately used the DMIS railway system to locate the train. Within three minutes, they found the best alternative route with a military transportation database, digital maps and the military railway distribution system.

 

It was a military transportation exercise with modern digital technology.

 

 

Click here to view the original image of 800x707px.

 

Digital military transport systems such as the Military Transport Planning Management System, the Military Transport Loading and Unloading System and the Military Transport Loading and Unloading Video System were employed. With a few clicks of his mouse, the officer on duty could see all the personnel and supplies on thousands of kilometers of track.The digitalization of China’s military transport system has developed tremendously with the support of the railway authorities. Basic networking and visualization have been realized in the command and organization of China’s military railway transport, making it more convenient and efficient to distribute and coordinate operations.

Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/chinese-defence/62935-china-s-military-railway-transport.html#ixzz1xjaG6CUL

 

 

 

 

As for the time frame...let's look at the most recent local war...

 

2008 South Ossetia War or Russo-Georgian War (in Russia also known as the Five-Day War)

 

Seems to me that would be the ideal time frame for the kind of war scenarios that we will be able to act out in the Crimean map space in DCS..

 

In a 5 day war, logistics will indeed be of the utmost importance. Tank wear and helicopter turbine wear might be a wee bit excessive though. I was always thinking more in terms of mobilized reinforcements, fuel, food and ammunition supplies with medivac thrown in too...it definitely adds an interesting element which can be tied to morale statistics

 

 

I've always felt that the most tiresome thing in computer war games is to have the battle begin with both sides already squared off like football teams in a scrimmage. That's what Total War does its battles and the boredom of it is one of the main factors contributing to me giving up on it even though I adored Shogun Total War. The real contest, history shows, is the mobilization of resources and the ability of one side to get those resources to the front, deploy them, then keep them running efficiently through the entire conflict, like the Germans winning the Franco Prussian war with meticulous mobilization schedules tied to rail schedules. They learned that by having observers present at key Civil War battles where Grant was pioneering the technique.

 

 

Logistics will thus strongly shape the battle, compelling the general to consider more closely how he stages an attack, how he deploys and defends his resources and even how he runs a fighting retreat or rear guard action.

 

DCS CA should be so much more than just blowing stuff up as cool as that may be. War is industrial..

 

That's what I'm hoping for ultimately from DCS CA...the simulation on a grand scale of modern industrial digitized military systems of war..in the end it should be a living textbook on the subject where we can immerse ourselves in its full potential in a vivid 3d world of the utmost complexity.

Edited June 14, 2012 by Cadmium77

[Wags]

DCR Combined Arms is a fascinating concept on many levels. Currentlly I'm an ARMA2 kind of guy but back in the 80's I was deep into SPI wargames by Dunnigan.

 

This Combined ARms promises warfare on a grand scale but you can't really simulate that without logistics.

 

Will there be supply? And not just the concept of "in supply" with available road and rail and airbases but actual supply columns and vehicles and bases etc?

 

As for running this battlefield, will we be able to act as general staff in AWACs and command aircraft? That would be very cool..

 

No, not for the first iteration of CA.

[djembe]

I do not understand the concept of logistics in DCS.

If you mean to manage resources (fuel & ammo) why only in CA?

I think it should become a stardard of DCSW, because we all fly in the same world, and we use the same mission editor.

 

It would be interesting to select at each airport to a maximum of liters of fuel and weapons to be reload to ground or air units also

 

regards

[159th_Viper]

I think it should become a stardard of DCSW.....

 

That is the plan.

[Akheron]

Logistics could bring this to the next level. If you don't protect your supply roads(convoy), the airport cannot resupply itself and runs out of ammo for aircrafts.

[Silver_Dragon]

Military trains has present on DCS:W but we have no control or edition over there.

 

[NineLine]

I do not understand the concept of logistics in DCS.

If you mean to manage resources (fuel & ammo) why only in CA?

I think it should become a stardard of DCSW, because we all fly in the same world, and we use the same mission editor.

 

It would be interesting to select at each airport to a maximum of liters of fuel and weapons to be reload to ground or air units also

 

regards

 

I believe that is what everyone is hoping for, limited resources and equipment, the ability to resupply, the ability to cut supply lines, etc.

 

This would put us a step closer to more dynamic scenarios, provided the results from Mission A could be passed to Mission B, etc...

[Nate--IRL--]

...... provided the results from Mission A could be passed to Mission B, etc...

 

If that happens - you have a dynamic campaign. I hope it does.

 

Nate

[NineLine]

If that happens - you have a dynamic campaign. I hope it does.

 

Nate

 

Seems like such a simple request doesnt it LOL.....

[chromium]

If that happens - you have a dynamic campaign. I hope it does.

 

Nate

 

I'm trying to understand what it takes to "transport" few information like

-ground units position (coordinates);

-ground units state (alive/dead);

-warehouse load

 

And since now I'm trying to build a layout of a project that should do those things in steps (manually aided):

 

1. Parse the "mission.lua" and the "warehouse.lua" file contained in the (missionname).miz, extrapolating some tables in access format that will lead to produce sitrep briefing pdfs for pilots and create a "starting situation" for the mission;

2. Parse a log file produced by the sim or by SLmod (thanks to Moa this could be the very first attempt that I could do) to extract a "units dead" table and a "units last position" table, obviously I can't understand now if it's possible. Also, this could extract some "summary debrief" for pilots.

3. Elaborate the data of the tables by point 1 and 2 to obtain a "end mission state", and... most difficult... convert it in a new mission.lua.

 

I believe that point 2 is possibile and simple, point 1 is difficult but maybe possibile, point 3... :S

 

I do not know ANYTHING about lua and parsing text/lua files, so I'm trying to understand step by step and grabbing all the help possibile by other... hoping to obtain something useful.

[NineLine]

Yup, its quite the undertaking I think.

 

Its not just transferring the info from Mission A to Mission B, its updating Mission B's objectives based on that passed info, tasking all elements based on that information... its somewhat mind boggling... although the ability to pass that information would be a step in the right direction...

 

It would have to be randomly generated missions based on previous mission information passed forward. The newly generated missions would need some sort of Main goal carried over mission to mission to best generate objectives to focus forward on that main goal.

 

or something like that :)

[chromium]

Its not just transferring the info from Mission A to Mission B, its updating Mission B's objectives based on that passed info, tasking all elements based on that information... its somewhat mind boggling... although the ability to pass that information would be a step in the right direction...

 

I agree, but in my ideal enviroment we will have two coalitions commander that provide this live between one mission and another ;).

 

I don't aim to a dynamic countinoous campaign environment, but at a manually-edited sequential missions campaign (maybe 24/48 hours mission timing), aided by the ability to retain infos between missions.

 

PS: I hold here my hopes, or I will be "moved" to another thread ;).

Edited June 14, 2012 by chromium

[NineLine]

I agree, but in my ideal enviroment we will have two coalitions commander that provide this live between one mission and another ;).

 

Even the commander would need the info displayed for him. Updates of remaining units and supplies, etc.... If that info could be exported and then imported to new missions the commander could task new objectives, or the ai commander could, I dont think you would want a continuous mission unless we got a save function... wars take a long time :)

[chromium]

Even the commander would need the info displayed for him. Updates of remaining units and supplies, etc.... If that info could be exported and then imported to new missions the commander could task new objectives, or the ai commander could, I dont think you would want a continuous mission unless we got a save function... wars take a long time :)

That it's exactly what i meant :)

[NineLine]

Makes me wonder now how the random generator works and if it pulls the info for available units from somewhere, and if thats true if that source for telling the random generator what is available could be manipulated...

[Nate--IRL--]

Makes me wonder now how the random generator works and if it pulls the info for available units from somewhere, and if thats true if that source for telling the random generator what is available could be manipulated...

 

There is a document describing in detail how the Mission Generator operates - I'm not sure if I can release it though - I'll ask.

 

Nate

[djembe]

For me the concept of dynamic campaign is not interesting.

I want to have total control over the campaigns that I develop.

What I find very important is the option to save the development of the mission during a MP game.

With this option for save the development of the mission during a MP game, and the CA, I can edit a mission of 12 hours and fly it into sections of 2 hours. After each mission just save game.

In this way the whole development of the campaign is controlled directly with the CA

Edited June 14, 2012 by djembe

[NineLine]

There is a document describing in detail how the Mission Generator operates - I'm not sure if I can release it though - I'll ask.

 

Nate

 

Thanks Nate, let me know...

[Nate--IRL--]

Well - it was already released, I didn't know, see -->

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=84601

 

Nate

[NineLine]

Thanks Nate, missed it as well :)

[Azazel]

Well - it was already released, I didn't know, see -->

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=84601

 

Nate

 

Nate,

Could you sticky that fella in the mission builders corner. I'm sure there are plenty of people that could use it :)

[Silver_Dragon]

What is the logistic improvement on FC3/DCS:World 1.2.2?