DCS SA342 Gazelle Project

[ruso]

Hi, I've been looking for a few videos Gazelle combat. As seen from the outside, there is no significant movement, but I can not believe that from within not even notice a slight rocking. I'll try to keep looking.

 

min 0:10

 

min 2:10

Edited November 8, 2013 by ruso

[Fifi]

Is this awesome project still on the road?

[Flagrum]

Is this awesome project still on the road?

Regarding the videos that he posted a few days ago, yes. :o)

[Fifi]

Regarding the videos that he posted a few days ago, yes. :o)

 

That very good news so! :thumbup:

 

That was always my favorit helicopter ever since i was young in France (maybe with the Huey, but for others reasons) and if this one is made with equal details level as the Huey module (FM included), it's gonna be a blast :clap:

[Flagrum]

That very good news so! :thumbup:

 

That was always my favorit helicopter ever since i was young in France (maybe with the Huey, but for others reasons) and if this one is made with equal details level as the Huey module (FM included), it's gonna be a blast :clap:

The very same is true for me and the BO-105 (http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=109055) :o)

 

But I will get both once they are released. :-D

[Kuky]

I am pretty sure there should be no recoil when launching these missiles... recoil you get when you fire a shell/bullet because the casing that provides active force to the projectile stays within the weapon in the barrel, hence the reactive force (recoil) exists... but with missile, the active force comes from rocket engine that stays withing the projectile... so there should be no recoil on the aircraft. Only the rocket engine fumes would exert some (minor) force on the aircraft.

[Flagrum]

I am pretty sure there should be no recoil when launching these missiles... recoil you get when you fire a shell/bullet because the casing that provides active force to the projectile stays within the weapon in the barrel, hence the reactive force (recoil) exists... but with missile, the active force comes from rocket engine that stays withing the projectile... so there should be no recoil on the aircraft. Only the rocket engine fumes would exert some (minor) force on the aircraft.

There was a similar discussion some weeks ago about the Huey and rockets. The conclusion of the thread was ... inconclusive (and the Huey still experiences some sort of "recoil" ...)

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=107312

[Kuky]

Should be nothing inconclusive... it's simple physics

 

To get recoil you need force to act on the object... as I said, bullet gets force to push it forward that comes from the shell casing, which stays inside the barrel... law of action/reaction means the shell must be pushed in opposite direction from bullet... and as shell is still inside the barrel and weapon, hence the recoil to the barrel and the weapon... remember that with firing bullet from a gun, the only place gases can come out is from the barrel itself, at the front... so bullet and gases have to come out the front... and opposite force is the recoil.

 

With these rockets and missile, the force comes from rocket engine which stays within the projectile... so action/reaction forces act only on projectile and not the tube from which projectile was in, because gasses that create the pressure have hole on the back to exit out... well there will be some force once the rocket is out of the tube, but this should not be much.

 

There is really nothing complicated to figure this out.

Edited November 8, 2013 by Kuky

[gabuzomeu]

There still may be some effect as the rocket is not frictionless in the tube. And there may be a system locing it in place? And gases can have aerodynamic effect on the tube .

So mostly no recoil but some friction left?

[Fifi]

Yes, but then why P51 has that much wing move when firing rockets?

[kobac]

During missile launch no significant recoil helicopters, as is well explained by Kuky, but you can hear a lot of loud noise like a powerful punch to the hull and wheezing (tracer), which is slightly muted as missile leaves. It would be very nice if be able to make that effect, a sound artist Diveplane.

 

As I said I am talking about Missiles 9M14-M (2T)

[Flagrum]

Should be nothing inconclusive... it's simple physics

 

To get recoil you need force to act on the object... as I said, bullet gets force to push it forward that comes from the shell casing, which stays inside the barrel... law of action/reaction means the shell must be pushed in opposite direction from bullet... and as shell is still inside the barrel and weapon, hence the recoil to the barrel and the weapon... remember that with firing bullet from a gun, the only place gases can come out is from the barrel itself, at the front... so bullet and gases have to come out the front... and opposite force is the recoil.

 

With these rockets and missile, the force comes from rocket engine which stays within the projectile... so action/reaction forces act only on projectile and not the tube from which projectile was in, because gasses that create the pressure have hole on the back to exit out... well there will be some force once the rocket is out of the tube, but this should not be much.

 

There is really nothing complicated to figure this out.

School physics would suggest that, yes, and I would believe the same. But read that thread - I can't decide if they are right or not. (and perhaps we also should keep this discussion in that other thread to not derail this further?)

[Galwran]

There still may be some effect as the rocket is not frictionless in the tube. And there may be a system locing it in place? And gases can have aerodynamic effect on the tube .

So mostly no recoil but some friction left?

 

This. Also, the helicopter gets lighter, etc. Even though the projectile is recoilless, it doesn't just teleport away. Having fired a live LAW I can guarantee that the event is pretty "dynamic" to say at least :) So I would go with a gentle nod of the helicopter instead of full blown recoil.

[ruso]

Hi. This is the best video I've found. Visually from outside may not appreciate a slight movement to launch a rocket, but from within, which is what I really care if would have to be noted. What's more, would have to be more pronounced if launched by hover (hover making the sim is too static, right?). This is not destructive criticism. I understand that the project is in alpha stage and there are many things to debug, but I would love it to be the best hard sim created so far. Greetings.

 

[riboyster]

You guys are neglecting the increased drag on the leading edge caused by supersonic gasses emanating from the rocket motor.

[Flagrum]

You guys are neglecting the increased drag on the leading edge caused by supersonic gasses emanating from the rocket motor.

could you explain this a bit further? I think, I know what you are implying (i am a total layman in this area!), but if I am right, a hovering helicopter should not be affected by the effects you mention?

[Shadow714]

It is clear that there is no significant effect on helicopter while firing Hot missile during a hover as it is obvious in this video

(1:19 min) maybe just some slight vibration :) cheers

[diveplane]

Honestly, you guys are seriously splitting hairs...

 

yes I agree, some of the comments in these forums are unreal at times.

many have little or no idea the giant work tasks at hand to create such modules code and sound production.

[ruso]

Yes, I also believe that there are people with bigger egos, who can not accept criticism. Nice heli arcade, for now ...

[Shadow714]

A little "consulting" for a better simulation is not so bad I think, as long as it is for that purpose only :)

[Pat01]

small update,

Finally I decided to make a "Viviane" first, then an export version with gun and rockets, and then a "Mistral" one.

Here are some screenshots of the first 3D screws and rivets ... still a lot of job to do.

[Darkwolf]

Thanks PAt !

[diveplane]

small update,

Finally I decided to make a "Viviane" first, then an export version with gun and rockets, and then a "Mistral" one.

Here are some screenshots of the first 3D screws and rivets ... still a lot of job to do.

 

awesome work

[Fifi]

Wow, nice! Good luck with this hard work :thumbup:

[RagnarDa]

Looking good!