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Random failure? My guns jammed my engine?


JozMk.II
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  • ED Team
At about 17:19:40 in the uploaded track, I'm inverted, pulling some positive G's, firing at an adversarial Mustang with my .50s. Suddenly, my engine instantly comes to a dead stop.:huh: Can someone tell me what happened here? This has me scratching my head.

 

What power rating you used and how long?

Ніщо так сильно не ранить мозок, як уламки скла від розбитих рожевих окулярів

There is nothing so hurtful for the brain as splinters of broken rose-coloured spectacles.

Ничто так сильно не ранит мозг, как осколки стекла от разбитых розовых очков (С) Me

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I've had that happen. It's not fuel starvation, engine doesn't sputter or prop windmilling, it a full seizure, prop is locked in place. Sounds more like oil pressure, redlining MP, WEP, or some kind of combination with Hi-G.


Edited by Tailgate
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Lots more to consider now that temps effect engine performance. You can't just run the engine and RPM full blast 100% all of the time I noticed that the oil tends to overheat pretty quick if you do. Up into the redline in less than 2 minutes. Backing off the RPM and throttle just a little bit and oil temps come down to normal pretty quickly. You must watch these in dogfights now, it's a whole different ballgame.

 

Edit: just did a quick test - at 100% throttle and RPM if you are pulling high G's the oil temp goes up. Prolong maneuvers doing this will overheat and sieze.


Edited by Slayer

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Putting throttle and RPM to lowest setting and doing a 300kts dive for about 15-20 seconds will cool the engine, or at least the oil, very quickly but I wonder if this is actually enough or will the reading just drop temporarily?

 

I had mysterious engine seizures a lot when doing automatic ramp starts. I could lose engine in a dogfight (no damage to the plane from gunfire) sometimes only after 5 minutes. With airstart I only got one engine stoppage because of running out of fuel in the selected tank but otherwise was able to keep flying normally and even with using WEP for 10-15 minutes. Is there some engine control the autostart doesn't set properly that you are supposed to do on your own?

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  • ED Team
I was using max RPM while maneuvering as well as when pointing the nose up a pretty good amount of the time. I was only really using max throttle when pointing the nose up.

 

Did you operate with rpm and throttle during the dogfight or you set max rpm and operated only with throtle?

Ніщо так сильно не ранить мозок, як уламки скла від розбитих рожевих окулярів

There is nothing so hurtful for the brain as splinters of broken rose-coloured spectacles.

Ничто так сильно не ранит мозг, как осколки стекла от разбитых розовых очков (С) Me

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Did you operate with rpm and throttle during the dogfight or you set max rpm and operated only with throtle?

 

That is what I used to do with the beta P51. Haven't dogfight with 1.2.1 and I'm curious what has changed.

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I've just had this a second ago. There was a loud cash and the prop stop dead.

I had engine rpm set to just over 3/4, and the throttle was just over half. I was in a free flight with no enemy getting ready to land-bounce-land-bounce-land.

 

On the briefing screen it said 'engine failure', then on the next line it said 'engine shut down'.

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I'm curious what has changed.

 

This will kill your engine now. ;) Limit for 3k RPM and 61 inHg is 15 mins. Max continuous is 46inHg@2,7k RPM

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Okay, I'm seeing now that one really needs to keep an eye on the engine management gauges throughout operation of this aircraft, as temperamental as the engine seems to be.

 

I was just flying the challenge campaign mission in which you are tasked with navigating hundreds of miles from one airbase to another over the Caucasus mountains. I was at about 15,000 feet, flying with my RPM, Manifold pressure, fuel pressure, oil pressure, and oil temperature in the green areas, when seemingly for no reason my engine seized, just as it did in the previously discussed dogfight mission. My oil temperature had been above the green zone at times, particularly when my airspeed was around 150-175mph in climbs, but (I think) not for too long of periods.

 

What the heck is going on here? Does going above the oil temperature's green zone cause irreversible damage to the engine, regardless of how much and for how long??

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What the heck is going on here?

 

And how exactly are we to provide you with anything vaguely resembling an intelligent answer without a track to look at?

 

Tracks tracks tracks :)

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And how exactly are we to provide you with anything vaguely resembling an intelligent answer without a track to look at?

 

Tracks tracks tracks :)

 

In my defense, no one, including yourself, gave any indication of looking at my prior track. Aside from that, however, the track file in question is simply too large to upload onto here.

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They also seem to be able to pull more G's than me without ripping off their wings.

 

I don't think so. I can follow the A.I. in any high-G turn without tearing off my wings--moreover, I can often pull a high-G turn that the A.I. can't follow. (I can't match his energy management & sustained turns, but that's because I still need a great deal of improvement in that area. However, I'm talking strictly of high-G turns.)

 

One of my friends whom I dogfight with frequently is constantly over-G'ing his wings near the end of our fights. I don't have a problem following his turns without harming my own wings. The trick? Lag turn instead of following exactly. You're probably lead turning, which might cause you to be pulling more G's than the guy you're chasing.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by 159th_Viper viewpost.gif

And how exactly are we to provide you with anything vaguely resembling an intelligent answer without a track to look at?

 

Tracks tracks tracks smile.gif

Originally Posted by JozMk.II

In my defense, no one, including yourself, gave any indication of looking at my prior track. Aside from that, however, the track file in question is simply too large to upload onto here.

Hmm, and it seems that the track itself is broken. Upon takeoff, it depicts me having nosed over and exploded after veering off the runway; I most certainly did not do any of that in the mission.
Edited by JozMk.II
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  • ED Team

Gentlemen, even if you have no track your memoirs sharing your flight profile, power rates (rpm, MP) are priceless for us.

The catch could be the following: if you hurt your engine before overusing WEP or overheating it, the engine can seized later even if it is in safe conditions.

Ніщо так сильно не ранить мозок, як уламки скла від розбитих рожевих окулярів

There is nothing so hurtful for the brain as splinters of broken rose-coloured spectacles.

Ничто так сильно не ранит мозг, как осколки стекла от разбитых розовых очков (С) Me

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Okay, I'm seeing now that one really needs to keep an eye on the engine management gauges throughout operation of this aircraft, as temperamental as the engine seems to be.

 

I was just flying the challenge campaign mission in which you are tasked with navigating hundreds of miles from one airbase to another over the Caucasus mountains. I was at about 15,000 feet, flying with my RPM, Manifold pressure, fuel pressure, oil pressure, and oil temperature in the green areas, when seemingly for no reason my engine seized, just as it did in the previously discussed dogfight mission. My oil temperature had been above the green zone at times, particularly when my airspeed was around 150-175mph in climbs, but (I think) not for too long of periods.

 

What the heck is going on here? Does going above the oil temperature's green zone cause irreversible damage to the engine, regardless of how much and for how long??

 

It does seem that the automatic oil cooler control tends to keep the oil temperature rather high, so I've taken to just manually controlling it if it gets above the green arc. I'm not sure if it's actually a problem however, perhaps it's perfectly normal and safe for the oil temperature to hover near the red-line, I don't know.

 

As far as having the engine seize up, running at low RPMs can be tricky unless you are really careful with the throttle and manifold pressure. The green arcs on the RPM and MP gauges are more for cruising, and on that particular mission you have to climb pretty steeply so you'd do better to run near the maximum continuous power settings of 2700 RPM, 46" MP.

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It does seem that the automatic oil cooler control tends to keep the oil temperature rather high, so I've taken to just manually controlling it if it gets above the green arc. I'm not sure if it's actually a problem however, perhaps it's perfectly normal and safe for the oil temperature to hover near the red-line, I don't know.

 

As far as having the engine seize up, running at low RPMs can be tricky unless you are really careful with the throttle and manifold pressure. The green arcs on the RPM and MP gauges are more for cruising, and on that particular mission you have to climb pretty steeply so you'd do better to run near the maximum continuous power settings of 2700 RPM, 46" MP.

 

I just looked at the manual for A2A's Mustang for FSX, and it says something that supports your statement: that running the engine on high manifold pressure with a low RPM setting is quite hard on the engine and should be avoided. I even loaded up a quick mission for testing purposes, putting the RPM and MP on the lowest and highest settings, respectively. Sure enough, the engine seized within a minute or two.

 

Alright, it sounds like I simply had my RPM too low for what I needed the airplane to do. I shall try the mission again, this time only using the green settings for RPM and MP while cruising...

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Okay, I successfully got through all the airborne gates without seizing my engine by using a healthy amount of RPM...only to have my engine seize as I was descending en route to the destination airbase!! mad.gif Lord, this bird will really bite you if you don't treat her as she's designed to be treated!

 

As for details, I was descending with the RPM and MP each around the bottom of the green arcs. The engine seized when I was at around 15,000 ft, going 400 or more MPH. The oil temperature was a bit below the green arc. Throughout a good deal of the flight, the oil pressure was in the green arc, while the fuel pressure stayed around the bottom red line(the minimum limit).

 

Sigh...Can someone refer me to some specific limitation information in the manual or elsewhere for this bird that might be of some use for myself? I myself can't seem to find a great deal of information for my troubles in the manual.

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  • ED Team
Okay, I successfully got through all the airborne gates without seizing my engine by using a healthy amount of RPM...only to have my engine seize as I was descending en route to the destination airbase!! mad.gif Lord, this bird will really bite you if you don't treat her as she's designed to be treated!

 

As for details, I was descending with the RPM and MP each around the bottom of the green arcs. The engine seized when I was at around 15,000 ft, going 400 or more MPH. The oil temperature was a bit below the green arc. Throughout a good deal of the flight, the oil pressure was in the green arc, while the fuel pressure stayed around the bottom red line(the minimum limit).

 

Sigh...Can someone refer me to some specific limitation information in the manual or elsewhere for this bird that might be of some use for myself? I myself can't seem to find a great deal of information for my troubles in the manual.

What exact value were rpm and MP set to?

Ніщо так сильно не ранить мозок, як уламки скла від розбитих рожевих окулярів

There is nothing so hurtful for the brain as splinters of broken rose-coloured spectacles.

Ничто так сильно не ранит мозг, как осколки стекла от разбитых розовых очков (С) Me

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