Hawkeye_UK

Hard to define this statement and thankfully it was never required. Rest assured though im pretty confident if going through Defcon 1 with an imminent soviet bomber hoard coming over the polar circle would the tomcats have launched with 6, absolutely. The load out wasn't used as it was during times of peace, thus returning to the boat and being overweight. However the military test things for a reason and still do, to know what is possible when the time is needed. As for the loadout on the Viper i'm rather suspecting its because people will want to take 2 harms and 6 mavericks lol - let's just hope the associated drag model (esp high altitude) has some resemblance to real life as those 16 wings are small with not much lift capability lol.

Hi Elmo, First point is definitely not delete, this would not be good for referencing back and on that alone i voted to keep it the way it is purely for this reason. I am of the opinion that a more efficient and concise list of all bugs need's to be tabled, something along the community bug tracker which was great, or for that matter the original Razbam one, albeit the latter this time needs to be filled with the actual issues. Doesn't have to be rocket science however need to be able to see; Date reported | Issue | Razbam receipt | Coder assigned and date | Feedback /development notes | Released to OB Date | Resolved confirmation from community | Stable release/Closed date. Theoretically this is something ED should be looking at also for the core, plus other modules. It would save a lot of repeated and painful communication of threads and questions on discord etc.

Hi Elmo, thanks for the quick response and welcome to your new role. Understand and will await until after the next OB for a statement on where we go from here. I'd recommend if not already done so when you get the time to read through the long running posts raised in the last week or so if not familiar with the nature of the issues you are having to pick up. It might give some useful insight into the situation. Did i miss you position being announced somehow? Lastly good luck i wish you well.

I see reference by Nineline that we should wait for the new Razbam CM to clarify Harrier issues. Have i missed something, have Razbam announced that they have employed a new CM? If so on what date will that person be operational ?

@Pikey you are not the only sane person, couldn't agree more i have said the exact same thing on numerous occasions, even prior to this blowing up last week. I'm still trying to confirm a date when the module was put into release version but that's also mission impossible. Early Access is about trust, not necessarily time taken to complete and over the last 2 years Razbam have consistently ignored their customers and been strangely rude at times resulting in a serious fracture of this relationship. Some of the communique released by Razbam right upto the CEO has been nothing short of jaw dropping. I have no issue with buying into EA from ED, as i have confidence and trust that despite their stumbling blocks that they will encounter at some stage they will bring the project to a satisfactory fruition, just like the A10C / Blackshark. This also goes for Heatblur and Deka who have communicated well and without hesitation i would buy from them tomorrow, especially Deka new to the scene to support them. There workrate on bug fixing for a new module was spectacular and a credit to the whole team. I see less experienced players all preaching for the F15 also, it's painful to watch and short sighted. It's a probably fair assumption at this state that Razbam customer retention amongst the more mature and serious players is also dead in the water. Any company that has censorship and ignorance of its customers at its core you just know things are not going to end well. I think many had given them another chance after the PR and performance disasters over a year ago, for many it was the last chance.

For the pragmatic and mature players patience is never the issue and we will continue to promote this among the forums and our servers. Its been noted and i often repeat how hard you guys are pushing tirelessly and its an unenviable position currently. Doesn't matter if a project is EA for 3 years if the trust is there for it to be completed. Its why people repeatedly invest. This whole Razbam discussion however that's the core issue, trust isn't there, it's been seriously fractured born out of mistakes made by them in how they approach their operation and customers. Putting yourself and bignewy, despite the excellent job you will do is a sticking plaster it doesn't address the issues of people wanting to invest in a company with the ethics displayed. This whole sage is like pushing water uphill re moderation and Razbam are not making your lives any easier. As i said it's been educational, sadly for Razbam the actual conclusion of this will be a lack of customer retention.

Both will be finished to a good state re F14/F16, the community has trust in this, not sure why people are trying to diverge the conversation

What's 6 months between friends lol ;-)

Thanks Nineline, if you can check on the above with Razbam would be good to know. Lucky you and big newy lol having to pick up, you will however will be treat with sympathy and hopefully the respect you deserve for being the untenable "person in the middle". Basically what it says however is that Razbam have no interest in dealing with customer feedback, only interacting with the parent company ED. Personally i have no issue with that and the whole episode has been educational, it allow's me to make an informed decision on future releases. Thanks for both of your hard efforts in trying to resolve.

PS - Do we even know what date our purchase moved from EA to Release status? I cannot seem to get an answer for some reason? Be good to know every other module you can list when this happen's?

A few things come to mind on the statement. Out of touch with frustrated customers and the community. Arguably arrogant and defiant in context of the status of a thread with 67,000 views and 632 replies prior to being closed. No acknowledgement of the faults and mistakes made by Razbam, which generally starts with an admission and an apology - effectively a basis for any human interaction on this planet whether it be in a highly developed tertiary economy or the most basic, indigenous tribes. Doesn't actually address many of the core issues raised in the closed discussion thread which is the focus of what people are concerned about. One can only surmise that this didn't even get read by Razbam in its entirety which is a missed opportunity. Whilst many users will be appreciative of the new texture code, many will also see this as just a deflection tactic. Point is no one knew including ED by all accounts. Does this justify basic keybinds missing 3 years later (because even basic users would like to see some clever coding on these). Quintessentially and of higher importance is that Razbam still appears not have comprehension of the anger within the community caused by the dismissive and insulting tone of that communique (aka swearing and glass of water comment) combined with being ignored for so long. This is what most serious players, who are not trolls, some with real world and/or 30+ years of sim experience have taken personal offence at. For that one comment alone i think consumers of all ages and experience are deservedly right to wish for a sincere apology with reassurance of how the mistakes made over the last 2 years in communication are going to be rectified. Also given that ED employees where insulted publicly, that should have also been addressed publicly. You could actually take this whole episode as a casebook and teach on how not to interact, its been embarrassingly that poor. I'm sure consumers want to know what structural changes is the company going to make. If players are to make any future investment in products from this third party then trust needs to be restored that their investment will not be met with the same ignorance when issues are raised or there objections censored. Let's be brutally honest, this is not the first flare up, this is not the first PR disaster, this is not the only situation or module that the exact same issues are evidenced. Customer service and communication is a common issue. Not listing but facts are facts. I made a post in the last thread in an attempt to help, and someone referenced it as a link earlier in this thread, i am of that same opinion. The problem here is a culture that needs to be changed and resource allocation. Razbam need to hire someone that has the right skill set and can understand customer relationships who is removed from the actual development architecture as otherwise the situation will get worse for their business, on that i am confident, which is a shame as it's unsustainable long term which is what none of us want.

+1 i think what is being meant is that nothing has been posted about from Razbam with any substance, and nothing from the management. We have a few words from the ex moderator on why he chose to leave, which in fairness if we are evaluating why we are here then he himself has to own and take responsibility as part of that process on failed communication. You can find a post i put out in June of this year alerting to the fact of growing resentment and that things had to improve. Nothing was done, infact you will note Decoy posted nothing at all throughout July. This is not being critical, its just stating the facts as they are. Anyway history is done, it was good to see him post something however it didn't really provide anything just a statement blaming these forums for being toxic as a reason for him leaving. I do not see how this will engage the genuine concerns and zero customer support received. Nineline and Bignewy as you can tell your efforts are always appreciated, but it really is for Razbam management to come to the support forum, as per the link in the sales page and discuss with the community. They however seem to be beyond that. It is becoming farcical. How they cannot apologise for the comments they have made is beyond any logical reasoning.

Easy just turn off all the Computers and bomb manually with iron bombs, problem solved lol. I cannot see why DCS would model the A10A when they already have the later version, wouldn't be commercially viable.

Decoy was the old community manger that was managing these forum's upto 3 weeks ago. No clarification of his exact role within Razbam has been made that i'm aware of.

I Believe the map is named after the Islands that are there, the Falkland's Map, its listed as a thread on the Razbam main forum page not South Atlantic, that's a huge area and the map is all about the Falklands hope that helps if your looking for info on it.

Hi decoy, good to see you post, although i appreciate its in an unofficial role given your statement 3 weeks ago. Nothing can justify the lack of addressing the community in the place that is specified for doing so. Reporting genuine bugs and not receiving a response, for months and months on end is not toxic so please do not try and make that as a pretex or justification. The leadership is out of touch completely. Yes there are toxic elements of the community, we know that but there is also very experience people, that have real world experience and also over 30 years experience in this sector, they are also banned for raising justified concerns. A CEO stating this is s**tstorm in a glass of water (55,000 views in 5 days suggests otherwise and one of the highest ever on these foums for the Harrier) and the internal disputes of who is Nineline, oh he's a moderator, a nobody its pretty unprofessional and quite frankly disgusting as i'm sure you will agree given your former position. The countless requests for support ignored on the link followed from the sales page for the module, over years, the complete refusal for the CEO to post anything that he cannot control direct access to. There are serious issues here and some of us are trying to help. That will not happen unless Razbam stop burring their head in the sand or attempting to silence connected and well respected members of the community. This has gone way past a set of specific features missing or bugs now its actually the ethics of Razbam themselves, the inadequacies revealed and the management team's approach. You may wish to suggest to the Razbam management team that they take a few hours and read fully thought this post if customer retention forms part of their business plan. As for other third party developers i'm surprised you commented on them but appreciate its like us from a customer perspective. They do not receive this level of criticism because they bring modules to a good fruition point but more than anything they COMMUNICATE on these forums, look at cobra's posts or UBoats etc to name a couple. They sell modules that are in line with the sales expectation, plus do not attempt to have X number of other asset artworks being teased. They also don't get teased as it's fair to say the artwork for example on some of their modules is probably the best within the game regarding say the F14, and Deka don't get grief because just look at their workrate this year since release (of which its a damn fine product, systems also). Ed got met with hostility last year as we all know but guess what they communicate, big newy and nineline constantly plus senor management. It stops things getting out of hand. I tried to warn you of this back in June. Compare there approach to Razbam's and you will see why we are in the position we are. So i would say with the greatest of respect Decoy that constructive critique does not have to stop, nor should it. I think after 2 world wars and countless regional conflicts i think we can safely conclude that censorship and ignorance is a bad thing.

Nothing worse than someone pulling one line, twisting a context for their own personal gain against a background of lots of messages to try and make a unjustified point and personal attack on someone. I suggest you spend a good hour and read the full thread, at the same time attempt to understand other people's viewpoint not just your own, those of experience users of the Harrier, that have genuine concerns. Maybe the user should reflect on himself whether he likes to pull nonsense out of thin air and attempt to belittle users of this forum. I don't see how your comment add's to the context or is anyway related to the Harrier issues specified in this thread and is totally unjustified and irrelevant.

We won't be here again re Mig23 & F15E and whatever other module because the community has got tired and lessons this time are being learnt. I know many people that did't buy into the Harrier after Mirage issues, i know of people that gave them another shot with the Harrier and well, enough said. If Razbam do not alter their approach and soon within the community, combined with negative feedback as word spreads of their business practices, which it is now rapidly doing, they will have near zero customer retention and low influx of new customers. Aka their business will collapse and their won't be these modules.

I think it's a credit to the WW2 team and to be fair in my humble opinion one of the best ED releases for some time. Look forward to the DM model update and the cooling and engine management to be completed along with rockets but for an initial EA product its a great plane and the cockpit is a work of art. Credit where credit is due, if in any doubt and you like warbirds buy this module you will not be disappointed. As for not much interest in online, obviously you don't play on storm of war, there is always P47's up in the air. There is also interest from my regular server i play on, which is for experience players that enjoy dynamic groud battles to form a WW2 server, we have been waiting on certain things within the ME and WW2 that have and are being resolved. The Jug is a new module and just released and its EA, it will only go from strength to strength. Also @Reflected have enjoyed your content thus far, if you need any apha/beta test's then feel free to PM, always happy to assist and will add it to the other beta's looking at.

I'm well aware i have no relationship with Razbam. My post wasn't about me, I was purely clarifying this very fact to another user who that i quoted in my original post. I even referenced directly this to state the dispute is legally with ED which serious players would not want so i don't quite understand the context of your post, all good though. The fact that on the sales link and product specification sheet to buy the module it links direct to this forum for support then we will agree to disagree on what is implied to the consumer as part of the sales process :-)

Both of these legislation's have great and far reaching power's within the UK legal system, even down to software damaging consumers hardware. However the EULA agree's that you will find resolution through the Swiss courts (which is interesting). That in itself is not a dead end however as they have in the last decade brought in greater protection for consumers. Equally i was under the impression of swiss law that if there is a dispute between parties that they can seek resolution either by the sellers place of residence, or the buyers however the choice of that is the customers, an oddity but it exists. An international business in swiss law cannot insist on jurisdiction as part of the contract process i believe. The issue is whether they have breached their own EULA that you made the sale's transaction through and specifically 3.3. Whether the product now that it's in its released state can be demonstrated that these are not minor issues and therefore a breach of contract leading to a dismissing of section 5. That is realistically what this boil's down to plus combined with if specification is missing which would be based on the following list; Highly realistic modelling of the aircraft systems including electrical, fuel, hydraulics, lighting, engine and navigation that includes: Digital Engine Control System (DECS) Automatic Fuel System Air Refueling System Electrical Power System External Lighting Internal Lighting Hydraulic Power Supply System Flight Control System (FCS) Head-Up Display (HUD) Up-front Control (UFC) Option Display Unit (ODU) Multipurpose Color Displays (MPCD) VREST Computer (for jet-borne flight) Air Data Computer (ADC) Environmental Control System (ECS) On-Board Oxygen Generating System (OBOGS) Detailed Operational Manual and Pocket guide Also Razbam have protection, which they will be all to well aware of in the fact that it would be ED that would be taken to court not Razbam of which it's not something that serious players would wish to see. Draining their limited resources with legal fee's isn't exactly going to help anyone in this community. This is something i would recommend to ED in that the liability is on the third party they sub contract if they fail to deliver, not them and this be reflected in future sales contracts. Anyway, more importantly and that aside how do customers that Razbam have barred from their own discord through raising legitimate questions now keep abreast of Razbam information releases if they refuse to use the official forums. Instead releasing information on a media that is not an acceptable location that everyone has access to its pathetic. It is released on there as they can control and remove any discussion they don't agree with. It can be demonstrated that the forum whilst not covered in the EULA is where support is received. Indeed on the sales page that we all purchased this module the link for Razbam support comes straight to these forums! And so the charade goes on......when will Razbam acknowledge the sales agreement they entered into and provide support on these forums, when will ED force them to before it becomes to late, some of us have had enough of their continued behaviour. We do as a community need confirmation of when the release date was? I cannot get an answer on this and don't understand why it can't be confirmed.

Not much use for those that do not use facebook. Not posted here in the official forum because? Statement on actually sorting out the module when, with something of substance content and workflow wise?

Hi Razbam, Quick clarification on 2 points. 1) What is the agreed and official date that the Harrier AV-8B Night Attack V/STOL sold under the Eagle Dynamics Digital Combat Simulator E Shop was converted from Early Access to a release version. 2) Are you intending to release a statement on the concerns raised or clarification within the next 14 days? Just trying to seek clarification on the position as i note nothing in the weekly newsletter to highlight the move. Many thanks.

The reality is that Razbam are reviewing constructive criticism as a personal insult which is why they seek refuge on their own discord, they are clearly feeling insecure and its the classic head in the sand tactic. I can only perceive that they feel out of their depth. This is not that we don't like the guys, nothing is personal as we don't know them. This is a business and we are the paying customer, it's actually that simple. It's time for some honesty. Making comments of its a "sh*tstorm in a glass of water" from the CEO, not instructing his staff on a media blackout when this blew up until he can draft a holding statement to acknowledge things have gone wrong. Anything like "we are sorry, we are working hard and i will release a full statement on the xx of September" etc etc. However what we can ascertain is that we are dealing with someone that hasn't got that large organisational background or experience. Here lies the problem not everyone has the right skill set for running a public facing organisation, especially one that is highly specialised. But it has helped as we are now more aware of what we are dealing with. At the end of the day it's common that businesses can outgrow the founder operationally, perhaps that's the issue. As a community we should probably reflect on our own expectations, this is not a large organisation and i for one I am historically guilty of judging them perhaps at a level above what they actually are, which on reflection is actually a really small setup. Even our beloved ED is a small business and we should be mindful of this. There are larger start's up's for example in the tech sector in all honestly. That aside, there is no room for ignorance or excuses for some of the content posted by Razbam employees of late. It's been stated that Razbam are mad, again this is just going to annoy customers further. At least Razbam are being paid to be mad, people have been trying to talk to them, and warn them even things are going south. I personally have done so, alerting them to growing discontent. If your reading this Razbam (which i know you do) imagine from another perspective of you being mad because you are being treating rudely, ignored, long standing issues not resolved and failing to reply to any of your questions, all the time paying for this displeasure. You may think you have a horrendous pressure on you currently or whatever but come and talk to the community you may be surprised to find that despite well respected members of the community being highly critical towards you, its because we care, are passionate and want to sort this out. The serious players recognise that is something that can only be done with you. Sometimes the only way for that to happen is to be brutally honest and direct with each other. As i've said previously Razbam need to take a long hard look internal and strategically assess what they are good at and what their weaknesses are individually. What is clear is that none of them have the right skill set for dealing with the outside world and customers. That isn't a matter of debate its just an observational fact. It's also not a personal criticism, its just part of being human we are all good at something's and bad at other things. The key is working out what your good at and being mindful of the things you don't do well. To these ends as i have mentioned previously i don't think the EA process is a good fit for Razbam currently with the culture they have. I for one do not want Razbam to fail, but i have to state that this is very much an issues of their own making and without a dramatic cultural change they will fail, and fail ED. It's not even about what the module is anymore and what's missing, its gone beyond that. The inadequacies are all to apparent. We also need to be honest, this is not a new problem. There are instances of absolute PR disasters over a year ago and discontent (which i will not list or rehash). Say they had allocated 15 mins a day just to read new posts on the forums and even replied one lines saying, thanks noted its been added to the list to check or we don't know of this thanks etc, its better than nothing and would not of lead to this complete breakdown. What we have had, pretty much in the last year is silence, no responses for the EA aspects being raised, Razbam not keeping to their end of the deal. Silence will be interpreted by the many as not caring. You need to read how people think. Probably the best thing they could do, is to restructure the business. The CEO picking up on what he is good at and enjoys (excellent artist/creator), take a step back, delete his discord log in and employ a COO who has some pedigree who can organise the business/output and structure/staff. Obviously as part of this process ensuring access to their social media channels are tightly controlled going forward to ensure people operating within that area are trained in customer service. Also have a culture that encourages 360 feedback internally within Razbam. He cannot delude himself however and i would encourage him to be honest and look inwards if he want's this to work, and equally to be happy. As a tip this can only happen by being truly honest and embracing what your bad at. This is not meant if your reading this Prowler which im pretty confident you will at some stage in the next day said as an insult, its food for thought and sent to assist and support. Life is to short and i'm guessing this isn't making you happy right now, or your brother Zeus, which is sad. There is a way forward, people will support you if you ask for help but think very clearly on making your next steps - being defensive and attempting to make excuses will not assist. Please take this message with the good intentions it's sent as sometimes it difficult to see the wood for the tree's when tensions are high. Personally i would recommend this; 1) Apologise - Sincerely, not with excuses and be specific, not just sorry. Own it. State you need our help and why, re-enage. Hell even ask for forgiveness whatever it takes. Remind us why you started this, what drives you? Be humble we all make mistakes people get that. People cannot see your passion, neither are they telepathic. Yes pitchfolks are out, but they can be lowered. 2) Move the module back into EA to reduce the immediate pressure on you so that customer's cannot argue that this is now a release build and all that entails (I wont go into detail here as will not encourage discontent, happy to PM you if you request it but there are some dangers with your current strategy - some people have the right day job and are pretty annoyed as a point in principle). It's also what customers appear to want by reading this forum it would seem. Now is clearly not the time for the move given the discontent and non minor bugs. If it was my business and employees jobs i was trying to safeguarding and own livelihood, i would be looking for a low risk mechanism to defuse the situation. This is a zero cost, immediate,easy, high impact guaranteed win by putting it back to EA. 3) Buy yourself some time for a proper review (point 2 greatly helps you with this). State over the next 2 weeks we are working with ED, internally and the community to agree to what level things will be modelled. Build a final specification architecture. 4) Announce the plan - with schedule. Provide absolute clarity. Sometimes bad news is better than inconclusive news. If you can't do one aspect or have no intention, be it cashflow, resource, skill set then state what cannot be done (please do not use incorrect classification issues as there are people within the community that have relevant clearances and you will be caught out and made to look foolish - not everyone is 13 on their first flight sim so think on). 5) Consider further feedback post plan. Publish your summary finding's of consultation with the community. 6) Action, do not be diverted, focus on the plan - provide 2 weekly updates on what has been worked on, what hasn't. Be honest, discuss problems as you face them, do not hide them. Manage expectations. 7) Be active on these forums. Do not hide on your own Social media, head in the sand isn't going to work, or being mad. 8) If mad at any point do not post on social media!! Honestly delete your discord and do not attempt to silence constructive criticism. One post can ruin your entire business and everyone remembers them, never the good. Always remember prior to hitting send in today's world of integrated Social Media any business is never more than a few hours away from being strangled leading to an utter catastrophic collapse! 9) Do not release further modules or be posting new artwork on anything other than the Harrier, Mig 19 or Mirage during this Intensive Care time. It does more damage than good. 10) Complete internal review / resource allocation, consider senior management roles, what makes them happy, what are they not good at, how can they be supported better. Know your limitations. Lastly It's is too late to change the past, what is said and done is now history. However take a reality check, 45,000 views in 4 days is not a s**tstorm in a glass of water as you called it. You can however decide on your future, if you want to change perception, there is still find a way forward and i would suggest something along these 10 points. You might just find a whole ton of pressure gone and people wanting to help you and your team again. Good luck i hope you make the right decisions for yourself and the community.

Having the EHSD come up on the correct MFD would be a start from the Hotas function.