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What exactly is FC3?


imacken
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I know that sounds like a stupid question, but as a relative newcomer to DCS, I am confused by FC3.

For the past couple of weeks, I have being using the A10C module, happily doing the training missions, learning the cockpit layout, making references to the manual as I go along, etc. and I can see how that all fits together nicely with training, missions and campaigns.

I purchased FC3 largely to have ago at the F15C.

When I go into the Training section for FC3, there are only SU27 options, and if I go into Missions, there is a file dialogue with nothing much showing. I clicked on the only option, which then showed 3 folders - EN, Quick Start and Single. The last 2 were empty, and EN contained several subfolders. I eventually saw something like FC3-F15C-00, so I loaded that.

I was faced with a cockpit half in sunshine and half in (almost) darkness! Almost impossible to see a lot of the controls.

My question is, what is FC3 all about? How do I become familiar with the aircraft, e.g. F15C like the A10C or KA50?

I just don't see the structure for this at all! If the F15C separate module was purchased, would that have training sections, etc.?

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My question is, what is FC3 all about? How do I become familiar with the aircraft, e.g. F15C like the A10C or KA50?

A-10C and KA-50 are individual modules and not part of FC3

 

FC3 is a collection of aircraft (A-10A, F-15C, SU-27, etc) with a varied level of modelling. All FC3 aircraft have simple systems, but some have advance flight model (at different stages of development) except the Mig-29 (all versions) and the SU-33.

Here are FC2 training videos, that cover many of the basics

 

Also look for Flankertraining

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCU1LW888jCR6IZ7crfdZxDg/videos

 

Both of these are old videos, but they help understand many of the simple systems.

 

Edit:

Keep in mind, the video will have some small differences, but I think they will get you started, if you have further questions once you watch those, there are many very eloquent guys here that can help further. (not me, I am the village idiot) :D


Edited by mvsgas

To whom it may concern,

I am an idiot, unfortunately for the world, I have a internet connection and a fondness for beer....apologies for that.

Thank you for you patience.

 

 

Many people don't want the truth, they want constant reassurance that whatever misconception/fallacies they believe in are true..

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Why is the cliff on fire? Someone should put it out.

 

It is on fire because you crash and we have not put it out because it is cold and we need a fire for the s'mores.

To whom it may concern,

I am an idiot, unfortunately for the world, I have a internet connection and a fondness for beer....apologies for that.

Thank you for you patience.

 

 

Many people don't want the truth, they want constant reassurance that whatever misconception/fallacies they believe in are true..

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FC3 is the easiest module for new players to learn, the planes do not include a clickable cockpit so the learning curve is very small. All FC3 aircraft start up the same, so does the F-15C.

 

The learning curve for FC3 is not "very small." It is smaller compared to modules like the A-10C.

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Thanks a lot, guys.

I don't think I've put my question very well from what I can see in your responses.

What I was saying is that I can see the structure of modules like the A10C and KA50, with their training missions, normal missions and campaigns backed up with reference to manuals etc.

I am struggling to understand what FC3 is all about. I thought it would be a collection of aircraft bundled together so that each could be selected like in A10C etc., for training and missions.

But, what I have found is that - despite what was said further up this thread - that ALL the training missions are using the SU27, and that the missions are confusing as per the description in my OP.

Also, someone said further up that all FC3 aircraft were the same, but I can't really see that. The A10A seems very different to the SU25 for example.

I'm clearly missing something fundamental here.

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Getting to single missions is tricky. Click on untitled folder. then click on EN folder. Then on single to open up list of single missions for all FC3 planes . Theres only a few for most of the aircraft. Controls are identical for all planes, although certain planes have additional things you can program. Tailhook for SU33, dropping bombs in pairs or single in A-10, A laser for SU25 are a few examples.

 

EDIT;" Controls are SIMILAIR for all planes...."

Poorly worded. All I mean is you can set up a basic FC3 controls profile, copy that to each plane in FC3 and easily tweak from there.


Edited by cthulhu68

 

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Thanks a lot, guys.

I don't think I've put my question very well from what I can see in your responses.

What I was saying is that I can see the structure of modules like the A10C and KA50, with their training missions, normal missions and campaigns backed up with reference to manuals etc.

I am struggling to understand what FC3 is all about. I thought it would be a collection of aircraft bundled together so that each could be selected like in A10C etc., for training and missions.

But, what I have found is that - despite what was said further up this thread - that ALL the training missions are using the SU27, and that the missions are confusing as per the description in my OP.

Also, someone said further up that all FC3 aircraft were the same, but I can't really see that. The A10A seems very different to the SU25 for example.

I'm clearly missing something fundamental here.

 

In attempt to further clarify;

People say; "is the same" and Eagle Dynamics only use the SU-27 for training (I am assuming) because the electric power button is the same for all FC3 aircraft, same for turning left and right engine, turning the radar, switching weapons etc.

 

Now, as stated above by cthulhu68, each aircraft may have some idiosyncrasies, but I read of the manual will cover some of these.

To whom it may concern,

I am an idiot, unfortunately for the world, I have a internet connection and a fondness for beer....apologies for that.

Thank you for you patience.

 

 

Many people don't want the truth, they want constant reassurance that whatever misconception/fallacies they believe in are true..

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Thanks a lot, guys.

I don't think I've put my question very well from what I can see in your responses.

What I was saying is that I can see the structure of modules like the A10C and KA50, with their training missions, normal missions and campaigns backed up with reference to manuals etc.

I am struggling to understand what FC3 is all about. I thought it would be a collection of aircraft bundled together so that each could be selected like in A10C etc., for training and missions.

But, what I have found is that - despite what was said further up this thread - that ALL the training missions are using the SU27, and that the missions are confusing as per the description in my OP.

Also, someone said further up that all FC3 aircraft were the same, but I can't really see that. The A10A seems very different to the SU25 for example.

I'm clearly missing something fundamental here.

 

To understand what FC3 is, I guess you have to know the history. What is now known as DCS started as a cell-shaded flight sim called simply "Su-27" back in about 1995. That then evolved in to a fully textured sim, again just including the Su-27. As time went on more flyable aircraft were added - the F-15C, the Su-25 (A and T variants), the MiG-29, A-10A and Su-33. None of these aircraft had or have clickable cockpits, and all have more basis system modelling, though some like the Su-25T have slightly mode advanced system modelling.

 

Then the Ka-50 came along with it's clickable cockpit. Initially it was actually a separate game from the base sim, though used the same engine etc. The came the A-10C with it's very advanced system modelling and fully clickable cockpit. This was also technically a separate game, though I think it was with A-10C that multiplayer cross-functionality was first brought in so that people could fly the original simple-systems-modelling aircraft along side the Ka-50 and A-10C.

 

Eventually the core DCS World module was developed, and all the previous aircraft became essentially plug-in modules. This is the situation we have today.

 

It appears that the current policy of ED is that for the future all modules, i.e. new aircraft, will be at the full "DCS" standard, i.e. clickable cockpits, full systems modelling and professional flight models.

 

With the exception of the MiG-29 and Su-33, all the Flaming Cliffs aircraft also now have advanced flight modelling. Apparently the flight models have been tested and signed off by real-world pilots. The F-15C and Su-27 flight models in particular are arguably amongst the most sophisticated in the game, though both are tweaked occasionally.

 

Unfortunately, it seems at the moment that none of the FC3 aircraft will be updated to full DCS module status, i.e. with clickable cockpits and advanced systems modelling, though I think that most fans of the FC3 aircraft wish that they would be.

 

Anyway, hope that helps to illustrate what FC3 is. It's true to say that the FC3 aircraft don't have the same complexity of systems modelling as some of the full DCS modules, however learning to fly them and employ them effectively is not much less a challenge.

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Thanks for that.

There is still the issue that there is no Training for any plane except the SU27, which I am disappointed about.

What if the F15C is purchased as a separate module. Are there training missions there?

So, is FC3 just a few missions with pre selected planes, or how is it best to be used?

Not trying to be awkward, just don't quite get the FC3 thing at the moment.

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What if the F15C is purchased as a separate module. Are there training missions there?

.

No. Think of FC3 as a no-frills bargain considering how many planes you get and A-10,F-15 being sold separately as just a cheaper way to get into the sim. As far as training goes it would be pointless to have training for SU33 or Mig as most controls are similar however like you say no training for A-10 or SU-25 is an issue. I don't know much about air to air combat but it looks like the F-15 uses the same modes as the Russian planes . Many of the Single Missions for SU25T are basically training missions for weapon use.

Perhaps you can find what you're looking for here...

https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/index.php?arrFilter_pf%5Bfiletype%5D=1&arrFilter_pf%5Bgameversion%5D=87&arrFilter_pf%5Bfilelang%5D=&arrFilter_pf%5Baircraft%5D=&arrFilter_DATE_CREATE_1_DAYS_TO_BACK=&CREATED_BY=&sort_by_order=TIMESTAMP_X_DESC&set_filter=Filter


Edited by cthulhu68

 

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To understand what FC3 is, I guess you have to know the history. What is now known as DCS started as a cell-shaded flight sim called simply "Su-27" back in about 1995. That then evolved in to a fully textured sim, again just including the Su-27. As time went on more flyable aircraft were added - the F-15C, the Su-25 (A and T variants), the MiG-29, A-10A and Su-33. None of these aircraft had or have clickable cockpits, and all have more basis system modelling, though some like the Su-25T have slightly mode advanced system modelling.

 

Then the Ka-50 came along with it's clickable cockpit. Initially it was actually a separate game from the base sim, though used the same engine etc. The came the A-10C with it's very advanced system modelling and fully clickable cockpit. This was also technically a separate game, though I think it was with A-10C that multiplayer cross-functionality was first brought in so that people could fly the original simple-systems-modelling aircraft along side the Ka-50 and A-10C.

 

Eventually the core DCS World module was developed, and all the previous aircraft became essentially plug-in modules. This is the situation we have today.

 

It appears that the current policy of ED is that for the future all modules, i.e. new aircraft, will be at the full "DCS" standard, i.e. clickable cockpits, full systems modelling and professional flight models.

 

With the exception of the MiG-29 and Su-33, all the Flaming Cliffs aircraft also now have advanced flight modelling. Apparently the flight models have been tested and signed off by real-world pilots. The F-15C and Su-27 flight models in particular are arguably amongst the most sophisticated in the game, though both are tweaked occasionally.

 

Unfortunately, it seems at the moment that none of the FC3 aircraft will be updated to full DCS module status, i.e. with clickable cockpits and advanced systems modelling, though I think that most fans of the FC3 aircraft wish that they would be.

 

Anyway, hope that helps to illustrate what FC3 is. It's true to say that the FC3 aircraft don't have the same complexity of systems modelling as some of the full DCS modules, however learning to fly them and employ them effectively is not much less a challenge.

 

Thanks Darkfire, that info was very enlightening. I guess I was just expecting too much of FC3. With no training for the F15C or A10A, I might just park it for the moment and just concentrate on learning the A10C and KA50.

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you want training? go read the manual.

Didn't think it would be long before we got a RTFM post! Of course that is an option, but I tend to read the manuals in conjunction with training missions. I find it a very useful way to learn. Reading manuals cold without any kind of initial guidance is very hard going, and is difficult to put into context.

If manuals were the complete answer to training, all instructors would be out of a job!

All I was trying to do is understand why FC3 is different to other modules I have used in DCS. Fortunately, various people here have given informative responses.

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Learning any FC3 plane without training missions would be much easier than learning A10c with training missions. Even when you eventualy set up and get used to controls, to actualy employ it in battle without frustration it might take you monts :)

 

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Thanks Darkfire, that info was very enlightening. I guess I was just expecting too much of FC3. With no training for the F15C or A10A, I might just park it for the moment and just concentrate on learning the A10C and KA50.

 

Depends on what your preference is really. In the absence of dedicated interactive training missions for aircraft such as the F-15C, A-10A and Su-25, the best way to learn those aircraft is to construct training missions for yourself so you can practice what you want, and at your own pace. There are also a decent number of training missions in the user files section of the DCS site itself.

 

I guess the challenge with the FC3 aircraft is less learning to operate the various systems and more learning to effectively employ the systems that are modelled. And in the case of the Su-27, learning to fly the thing at all. Not particularly forgiving for new pilots, though much better than it used to be.

 

If you enjoy the challenge of learning very detailed systems and spending hundreds of hours reading the manual and practicing to get the very best out of the aircraft, though I don't fly it myself I'd definitely recommend either the A-10C or if choppers are your thing, the Ka-50.

 

Something to bear in mind is that most multiplayer squadrons tend to focus on the arguably more glamorous A-A stuff, making competent ground pounders very valuable assets. Another reason to go for the A-10C I guess.

 

Something to realise about DCS level aircraft in general though is that they all reward patient, diligent learning with much referring to the manual. Due to the level of detail in which they're modelled, expect to spend the same amount of time mastering them that a real air force pilot would spend. Expect frustration, confusion and setbacks. That being said, when everything does click in to place it's incredibly satisfying and a huge sense of achievement.

 

Never be afraid to ask a question here on the forum. For the most part this forum is one of the most informative and friendliest that I've ever encountered as far as internet gaming forums are concerned. No matter how dumb you might think a question may be, chances are there are many others who also wonder what the answer is.

 

If the A-10C is going to be your thing, I'd thoroughly recommend watching Bunyap's videos on the subject. Most informative.

 

https://www.youtube.com/user/4023446/search?query=A-10C

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Depends on what your preference is really. In the absence of dedicated interactive training missions for aircraft such as the F-15C, A-10A and Su-25, the best way to learn those aircraft is to construct training missions for yourself so you can practice what you want, and at your own pace. There are also a decent number of training missions in the user files section of the DCS site itself.

 

I guess the challenge with the FC3 aircraft is less learning to operate the various systems and more learning to effectively employ the systems that are modelled. And in the case of the Su-27, learning to fly the thing at all. Not particularly forgiving for new pilots, though much better than it used to be.

 

If you enjoy the challenge of learning very detailed systems and spending hundreds of hours reading the manual and practicing to get the very best out of the aircraft, though I don't fly it myself I'd definitely recommend either the A-10C or if choppers are your thing, the Ka-50.

 

Something to bear in mind is that most multiplayer squadrons tend to focus on the arguably more glamorous A-A stuff, making competent ground pounders very valuable assets. Another reason to go for the A-10C I guess.

 

Something to realise about DCS level aircraft in general though is that they all reward patient, diligent learning with much referring to the manual. Due to the level of detail in which they're modelled, expect to spend the same amount of time mastering them that a real air force pilot would spend. Expect frustration, confusion and setbacks. That being said, when everything does click in to place it's incredibly satisfying and a huge sense of achievement.

 

Never be afraid to ask a question here on the forum. For the most part this forum is one of the most informative and friendliest that I've ever encountered as far as internet gaming forums are concerned. No matter how dumb you might think a question may be, chances are there are many others who also wonder what the answer is.

 

If the A-10C is going to be your thing, I'd thoroughly recommend watching Bunyap's videos on the subject. Most informative.

 

https://www.youtube.com/user/4023446/search?query=A-10C

Thanks again, Darkfire. I have spent a number of weeks on the A10C, and I love it! I'm becoming reasonably confident in the cockpit now.

Yes, Bunyap's videos are really useful. I have watched a good few of them in the last few weeks.

Re this forum, yes, I have found it to be very friendly and helpful - 99% of the time!

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  • 4 weeks later...

I personally have relied on YouTube tutorials for most of my training. The amount of content out there is great.

 

That said, if you're already into the A-10C, I think you're right to park FC3 for now. Maybe it's something to do if you want a change of pace.

 

I don't play FC3 modules any more as I want nothing less than an immersive experience with full systems and flight modeling. I get the impression that the FC3 modules are predominantly used by people who want to be competitive in multiplayer.

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I personally have relied on YouTube tutorials for most of my training. The amount of content out there is great.

 

That said, if you're already into the A-10C, I think you're right to park FC3 for now. Maybe it's something to do if you want a change of pace.

 

I don't play FC3 modules any more as I want nothing less than an immersive experience with full systems and flight modeling. I get the impression that the FC3 modules are predominantly used by people who want to be competitive in multiplayer.

 

Indeed, the FC3 modules (mainly F-15, Su-27 and MiG-29) are mainly used in multiplayer, where they are the most competitive fighters and have been the only modern fighters for many years.

 

That beeing said there are some great campaigns for FC3:

- https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/products/campaigns/f-15c_16-2_red_flag_campaign/ (if you have the Nevada map)

- https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/products/campaigns/su-27_the_ultimate_argument_campaign/

 

Regarding training missions: The main reasons why there are no training missions is, that these aircraft have been around much longer than training missions exist in DCS and because FC3 aircrafte are so simplified, they don't really require training missions. A quick glance at the manuel should really be sufficent. It's nothing like the high fidelity modules (A-10C, KA-50, ...).

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