Should I buy the MIG-21?

[Reflected]

Yet another "should I buy" thread, sorry folks. But I've been eyeing the MIG-21 for a long time.

 

Pro:

I love cc. 60s jets.

I've heard it's one of the most realistic modules in DCS

The Hungarian air force flew these birds (and I'm Hungarian)

Looks cool

 

Con:

I strongly dislike the USSR related technologies, unless they are in my gunsight

The cockpit looks very complicated, messy, and to make matters worse: Cyrillic (although I can read Cyrillic, but not THAT fast.

The plane looks pretty useless against everything.

I really love flying the F5E, and shooting down 21s, and never really considered joining the red side.

 

So now it all looks like spending a lot of money on a sports plane with an afterburner that requires an awful lot of studying. Can you talk me into buying it nevertheless? (Please don't! :D )

[milit]

In my opinion you're wrong about 21's uselessness.

The rest items you have to decide by yourself.

[Reflected]

In my opinion you're wrong about 21's uselessness.

 

What makes you say that? Also, please share why you're happy you bought it

[Art-J]

Ehm... Realism-wise, the module does contain various compromises and "gamey" features about weapon and navigation systems, plus the ever-evolving flight model still doesn't seem to be quite finished yet after two years of development. Whether these are deal-breaking issues or not depends on one's subjective opinion.

 

It's still a cool module, though, and we've been told further fixes and improvements are being made for it.

[milit]

What makes you say that? Also, please share why you're happy you bought it

You can watch the stream from the event with Migs https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?p=3084756

 

Mig-21 is a strong fighter-interceptor and useful against ground targets as well (ex. tanks). It needs to be learned a bit more than fc3 crafts, but then it brings a fun. )

 

Also I love USSR planes.

 

Отправлено с моего GT-I9082 через Tapatalk

Edited March 20, 2017 by milit

[Bogey Jammer]

Con:

I strongly dislike the USSR related technologies, unless they are in my gunsight

 

It's quite a handicap for you, but it's part of your country's history you can't avoid that. Anyway weapons can be turned against their genitor :P

The cockpit looks very complicated, messy, and to make matters worse: Cyrillic (although I can read Cyrillic, but not THAT fast.

There is an english panel version. I ended up to leave authenticity for it because it's so much more convenient. Not all buttons and switches are used in flight, and the MiG-21 is basically very simple. It's just a matter of neglecting harmony of cockpits parts and placements in that era, and lack of modulable architecture among versions. The next soviet generation of aircraft seemed to correct this problem. Anyway 1 switch = 1 function there is no mistake possible. I found it easier to use than the F-5E overcrowded with worthless switches as usual in US aircrafts, and The Mirage 2000 is much more difficult to remember for me for configuring the systems.

The plane looks pretty useless against everything.

It depends on tactics and experience. The MiG-21bis actually enhances the gameplay compared to the FC3 simplest F-15 because of the constant search of workarounds and exploitation maximization of the plane. This is where the fun is.

 

I really love flying the F5E, and shooting down 21s, and never really considered joining the red side.

Red/blue sides are just academic aspects. The world and civilizations are much more complex. Eastern Europe is extremely complex for me…

So now it all looks like spending a lot of money on a sports plane with an afterburner that requires an awful lot of studying. Can you talk me into buying it nevertheless? (Please don't! :D )

The MiG-21bis turns to be the favorite of many people. Admit it, you already like it :devil_2:

[humptydumpty]

No second thought buy it

[OnlyforDCS]

Question: Do you like study sims?

 

If the answer is yes, then yes: Buy it!

 

I hardly fly it these days, but I don't regret buying this plane. It's a lot of fun, and I will be going back to it after I get tired of my current go to "jet".

 

It's probably a bit more hands on than the F5, but in retrospect it's not a difficult plane to learn to operate.

 

Also what's not to like about it? It goes Mach2+, It looks awesome, it carries a ton of weapons for such a small plane, and in great hands will make F5E drivers cry in frustration :D

[MAD-MM]

MIG-21bis is one of the first Sovjet revisited layouts, older MIG Generation the switches was not in order and all over the Place, as example in the BIS you have your Navigation equipment on the left, Fuses all on the right...

MIG 21 have many switches thats correct, but the start up is not more complex then a F-5 as example.

And the Radar is easier to operate as the F-5 ones, because you dont have to scan manual the Horizon...

Would say from the dogfight cababilty the MIG is like 190 against P-51, even the MIG provide much more powerfull weight to Thrust Ratio then the F-5, the MIG dont have to fear the F-5.

Like Soviet much more then anything else (Jet Area), and i never come in contact with the Russian Country :)

[firmek]

I love cc. 60s jets.

Well, then you don't have much of options in DCS at the moment. Another module from this era will be MiG-19 by RAZBAM. Really, the MiG-21 is great. I think the best single word that was found in this thread describing it is that it feels "alive". Personally I could say that MiG-21 is one of those few modules which causes a smile on my face every time I come back to it after a break.

I've heard it's one of the most realistic modules in DCS

I don't know what are the criteria for judging that but MiG-21 bis is one of planes for which I've got a real manual. Actually in my native langague. It did match quite well with what is implemented in the module. There are a few discripancies but at the same time they are known and confirmed by MM3 as planned to be fixed.

The Hungarian air force flew these birds (and I'm Hungarian)

What you're waiting for then :doh:

 

Looks cool

It does look great. Even standing still on the ground it looks like going supersonic.

 

Con:

I strongly dislike the USSR related technologies, unless they are in my gunsight

MiG-21 was used all arround the word. Plus it's good to have a different look to see if other tehnologies are so good as they are advertised.

I can tell you that I can also read Cyrillic, thoug it hasn't been exactly my choise to learn it soo you could imagine that I generally also prefer to see the USSR stuff in my gunsight. But thinking this way lacks perspective. Don't limit yourself. You'll loose oportunity to experience such great modules as MiG-15bis, MiG-21bis, Mi-8 and L-39.

The cockpit looks very complicated, messy, and to make matters worse: Cyrillic (although I can read Cyrillic, but not THAT fast.

Please correct me if I'm wrong - silly but I can't tell from my memory but the module comes with english cockpit. If not for sure there are mods arround. The amount of switches can be intimidating at first but actually the cockpit is outlined in logical way and quite easy to learn.

The plane looks pretty useless against everything.

It's as much applicable as F5. The challange is the overall DCS environment and most MP server setup putting MiG-21 side by side with F-15. Being serious, if you look from it's native times:

- it's all weather and night flight capable - you'll have a lot of great time and fun learning the navigation in it. It's much more capable in this aspect than F5.

- it has a BVR capability as also capability to engage from the front aspect - first eastern 3'rd gen jet.

- though it hasn't been designed for this role it has quite good air to ground capabilities. It can be equipped in quite a big variaty of air to ground ordinance

- "bis" variant has onboard guns

- it has a nuke

Shortly, without going into discussion about flight performance etc, just feature and potentiall whise MiG-21 bis beats F-5E heads down. Don't take it as a point of "pride". It just means that in DCS you can get more time doing different things with it.

I really love flying the F5E, and shooting down 21s, and never really considered joining the red side.

I fully get you as I initially had the same approach. On the other hand it's only a game and those few eastern block modules that we have are among the best! After all, flying a soviet made equipment in a video game doesn't make you a communist :) Edited March 20, 2017 by firmek

[snowsniper]

Pro

 

Awesome nice vintage cockpit with a bit of sun on it. My best screenshot so far on early sunset

Love how it is binded on real stick do the same in sim. It s so clever

The recovery buton is so cool. So does the ap engage desisengage

Easy to cold start and take off

Challenging and rewarding landings

Rsbm navigation box so nice feature on caucasus

Very clever part of russian aviation history

 

Const

 

Poor radar

At hight aoa sometimes feels unrealistic

Engine restart in flight

Starforce sensitivity is awfull on this one

 

 

For sure one of the best module. A must have I think if you re in vintage jets

[Reflected]

DAMN YOU ALL!!!! :pilotfly:

 

Thanks a lot for your input, this bird really is something! I can now start her, take off, land (sort of). I'm nowhere near using any armament yet.

 

 

Also, I downloaded an English cockpit mod from the user files section, but it seems that the switches are still in Russian :(

[cthulhu68]

l:Also, I downloaded an English cockpit mod from the user files section, but it seems that the switches are still in Russian :(

Under Options/Special there's a box to check for custom cockpit liveries

[Reflected]

Under Options/Special there's a box to check for custom cockpit liveries

 

I installed the mod via JSGME, then checked that box, but the switches are still in Russian. Only the gauges are in English.

[cthulhu68]

Options / Gameplay/Avionics language-English should do it then.

This is what you get with no mod

[gavagai]

Good choice Reflected.

 

I don't think you need a mod for the English language cockpit. There's an option for that in the settings.

 

Don't mess around with the campaign that comes with the module. I found it pretty bizarre because you're flying the Mig-21 alongside western fighters like the F-15 against other Mig-21s.

 

Instead, look up the Guardians of the Caucasus campaign from mbot. Good luck!

[grunf]

DAMN YOU ALL!!!! :pilotfly:

 

Thanks a lot for your input, this bird really is something! I can now start her, take off, land (sort of). I'm nowhere near using any armament yet.

LOL

Welcome to the club. :D

 

Also, I downloaded an English cockpit mod from the user files section, but it seems that the switches are still in Russian :(

No need for a mod, it comes with the English cockpit (mostly, some text remains in Cyrillic).

[Xxx]

On your right side you have 73 switches and circuit breakers.

In front of you you have a combination of 97 switches, circuit breakers and instruments.

On your left side you have 77 switches and circuit breakers, including your throttle and engine controls. Nearly all of these have functionality.

 

I bought this aircraft in the recent Fatherland sale. I haven't been able to stop flying it!:D

 

Totally addictive!:joystick:

 

As a historic aircraft it perhaps has no equal. Designed over 60 years ago and capable of Mach 2+ on a single engine!

 

If you like challenging flight simulations (as well as all the features of the DCS Mission planner) then this is one for you. Plan some missions with the GCI units and you can recreate some accurate scenarios. Even test the theory that it only takes 60 seconds from entering the cockpit to scramble.;)

 

Regards,

 

David

[Sarraceno]

This mod is actually what decided me to get into DCS (well, the module and a brand new PC), fun as hell and hard hitting, it has some bug, but besides that this is awesome made plane.

[Schmidtfire]

It is a rocketship with wings! I still remember my first merge with one in multiplayer on the 104th. High above the thick cloud layer in my Su-27, friendly contact on my radar but my RWR going crazy. And as we merged in full burner, I could clearly see the iconic MiG-21 silhouette sizzling past me. Turns out he had mistaken me for a bandit. To see that MiG-21 at high altitude trying to turn with my Flanker was really cool and quite an unusual sight in multiplayer. He gave up pretty fast and when I didn't fire he realized his mistake and dove away. One of the coolest encounters I've had in multiplayer.

Edited March 21, 2017 by Schmidtfire

[Axion]

Great anecdote, Schmid!

 

The '21 is worth every penny, IMHO.

[javelina1]

Congrats Reflected! as noted, welcome to the Club! :-) She's an awesome bird.

[Reflected]

Hahaa, the cockpit now works, it's all in English. I feel comfortable starting it and taxiing, but for some reasons landings are still a challenge. It seems that even at 100% throttle I can't control the sink rate. Am I too heavy or what?

 

Also it seems that the 21 is very unstable around its longitudinal axis at low speeds such as landings. Very hard to keep the wings level.

 

Next step is to learn how to use the radar and the missiles. Seems very counter intuitive, having to flip 15 switches before firing...

[humptydumpty]

Hahaa, the cockpit now works, it's all in English. I feel comfortable starting it and taxiing, but for some reasons landings are still a challenge. It seems that even at 100% throttle I can't control the sink rate. Am I too heavy or what?

 

Also it seems that the 21 is very unstable around its longitudinal axis at low speeds such as landings. Very hard to keep the wings level.

 

Next step is to learn how to use the radar and the missiles. Seems very counter intuitive, having to flip 15 switches before firing...

 

Yeah since the last of couple of updates i find her sinking when on approach, i try to keep her @400 km/h and try a touchdown @320 but strangely i have this pitching moments which seem difficult to control her nose, i can say it could be the stick but can't too sure.

 

the wingz rocking on approach / landing was an issue but i don't see it happening now. If you want switch off the Aileron Booster and try. The lateral seems much better

[milit]

Hahaa, the cockpit now works, it's all in English. I feel comfortable starting it and taxiing, but for some reasons landings are still a challenge. It seems that even at 100% throttle I can't control the sink rate. Am I too heavy or what?

 

Also it seems that the 21 is very unstable around its longitudinal axis at low speeds such as landings. Very hard to keep the wings level.

 

Next step is to learn how to use the radar and the missiles. Seems very counter intuitive, having to flip 15 switches before firing...

 

Keep 360 km/h on final, vertical speed initialy 8m/s then reducing to 5, and only 1 m/s over the rwy. Don't forget to trim. It is controllable. Landing will be smooth. Don't be shy to use breaks on the rwy.

And yes, he asks much thrust.

 

Mig is waddling a bit, but we are used to it. :) (I dont know about real behaviour)

Edited March 22, 2017 by milit