How does trim operate in the Hornet?

[Grippen7]

Hi all

 

Can someone explain the pitch and roll trimming system.

It is not working all the time and I see no correct information on the cockpit display.

Also no animation of the trim switch on the flightstick.

Is this real or just a bug, because it is so slow wenn it is working sometimes.

 

Best regards Grippen7

[El Bastardo]

The trim is VERY slow compared to other aircraft. This way you can precisely trim the aircraft for an approach for example and be hands off.

 

Only thing I noticed, if you hold the trim for more than ~45sec, it doesn't trim any further until you release the trim and hold it again. But if you need to trim it that much you probably have much bigger problems ;)

 

To trim a full deflection you'd have to hold the trim and "rehold", due to the issue mentioned before, for ~2min.

 

Sadly, as far as I can tell none of the HOTAS buttons and switches are animated at the moment.

[Grippen7]

The trim is VERY slow compared to other aircraft. This way you can precisely trim the aircraft for an approach for example and be hands off.

 

Only thing I noticed, if you hold the trim for more than ~45sec, it doesn't trim any further until you release the trim and hold it again. But if you need to trim it that much you probably have much bigger problems ;)

 

To trim a full deflection you'd have to hold the trim and "rehold", due to the issue mentioned before, for ~2min.

 

Sadly, as far as I can tell none of the HOTAS buttons and switches are animated at the moment.

 

Is this like the real aircraft, so slow?

The plane flies down and you can not trim it up within a few seconds, that cant be real.

 

Best regards Grippen7

[El Bastardo]

No idea, I'm just an armchair pilot.

I've just read in another thread, that it is supposed to be slow.

 

Just hold the aircraft where you want it to go and while you trim, slowly release pressure on your stick. Takes some practice to get it just right.

[Grippen7]

No idea, I'm just an armchair pilot.

I've just read in another thread, that it is supposed to be slow.

 

Just hold the aircraft where you want it to go and while you trim, slowly release pressure on your stick. Takes some practice to get it just right.

 

Thanks

[Crickett]

I have the same issue and in my humble opinion, the trim is barely practical and urgently need a readjustment.

[LeCuvier]

my first impression was that the trim wasn't working; but I guess it's just slow.

But then I saw that once you have trimmed it, it stays on that attitude for a long time, almost as if you were on autopilot. What I miss though is some visual feedback. Is there any?

[Mr_sukebe]

On reflection, I’d love for there to be a DCS video explaining the use of the FCS.

Would hopefully resolve pilot confusion

[DDSSTT]

How do you reset the trim? I trim the plane to land on a carrier, I land, flaps to auto, line up to take off, flaps to half, press and hold the T/O trim, and I am always getting Check Trim caution...

[Dronin87]

after you do the FCS bit test your surfaces will be at 0's with 12's at the bottom. if you hold the trim button nose down for a loooooooooooong time. like a really long time you will see the 12 start to descend. try this and you will get an idea of just how slow it is.

[maquez]

Hi all

 

Can someone explain the pitch and roll trimming system.

It is not working all the time and I see no correct information on the cockpit display.

Also no animation of the trim switch on the flightstick.

Is this real or just a bug, because it is so slow wenn it is working sometimes.

 

Best regards Grippen7

 

read from here onwards: https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=3516973&postcount=26

[maquez]

How do you reset the trim? I trim the plane to land on a carrier, I land, flaps to auto, line up to take off, flaps to half, press and hold the T/O trim, and I am always getting Check Trim caution...

 

never ever use T/O trim in air !!!

T/O trim = take off trim, you shoud only use when plane is on ground

 

there is no trim reset you have to reset it manually using trim buttons and DDI page FCS

[alfredo_laredo]

never ever use T/O trim in air !!!

T/O trim = take off trim, you shoud only use when plane is on ground

 

there is no trim reset you have to reset it manually using trim buttons and DDI page FCS

 

T/O trim Botton in the air does nothing for the trim. You need to have Wight On Wheels for it to work in the air it only centers in MECH control column and thats for emergencies when using MECH instead of CAS

 

Ill try explain the trim...

 

The flight Control Computers have different modes of operation, the normal inflight one its called CAS, Control Augmentation System.

 

What this does it tries to zero the trim for whatever Joistick Input you set, so if you go 5° up with the joystick the CAS wil ZERO the trim at the needed position so you can fly off hands at 5° up, different things work at different rates for landing and TO mode, but they are basically the same.

I found out that I dont need to use manual trim. For anything.

[Growling Sidewinder]

I have the same issue and in my humble opinion, the trim is barely practical and urgently need a readjustment.

 

99% of the time its so slow it might as well not work. like i'm trying to decrease a 1000 foot per second climb I don't time to wait 2mins for the damn trim to respond

[Mule]

99% of the time its so slow it might as well not work. like i'm trying to decrease a 1000 foot per second climb I don't time to wait 2mins for the damn trim to respond

 

Changing that amount of descent rate requires a power change not the use of trim. It won’t be a big change but it will get that rate sorted out very quickly. Reading your other posts it sounds to me like you’re over relying on trim.

 

I would setup a simple scenario where you fly an altitude of say 1000 feet at on speed 8.1 degrees with flaps down gear down and practice that. Don’t do anything else until you can get that nailed. Concentrate on holding that altitude first then adjust power then start to trim. In that order. You will soon get a feel for it. I use very small amounts of trim when I have flaps down gear down. Once I’ve used trim to get into that place I don’t need to use it anymore for the rest of the approach it’s all set.

 

Can you send me a track file?

 

Keep at it and good luck.

Edited June 5, 2018 by Mule

[Growling Sidewinder]

Changing that amount of descent rate requires a power change not the use of trim. It won’t be a big change but it will get that rate sorted out very quickly. Reading your other posts it sounds to me like you’re over relying on trim.

 

I would setup a simple scenario where you fly an altitude of say 1000 feet at on speed 8.1 degrees with flaps down gear down and practice that. Don’t do anything else until you can get that nailed. Concentrate on holding that altitude first then adjust power then start to trim. In that order. You will soon get a feel for it. I use very small amounts of trim when I have flaps down gear down. Once I’ve used trim to get into that place I don’t need to use it anymore for the rest of the approach it’s all set.

 

Can you send me a track file?

 

Keep at it and good luck.

 

thanks man, i'll have a go at making that scenario you said. I tried to post a track file yesterday but the guy said he couldn't open it. so I might be doing something wrong. none the less I'll post a track file within the hour hopefully it works for you. thanks for your feedback.

 

 

edit.

 

trk file attached hope ur able to open it.

f18LevelFlightTEST.trk

Edited June 5, 2018 by Growling Sidewinder

[Archer_111]

On reflection, I’d love for there to be a DCS video explaining the use of the FCS.

Would hopefully resolve pilot confusion

 

Second on that :) .

[Mule]

thanks man, i'll have a go at making that scenario you said. I tried to post a track file yesterday but the guy said he couldn't open it. so I might be doing something wrong. none the less I'll post a track file within the hour hopefully it works for you. thanks for your feedback.

 

 

edit.

 

trk file attached hope ur able to open it.

 

Unable to open.

[Growling Sidewinder]

Unable to open.

 

god damn it. I duno what it is with them, I posted another one yesterday and someone managed to open it. I duno man. I did what you said tho tried to maintain 2900 feet flaps down gear and hook and managed it for the most part. was fluctuating about +-40 feet at times +- 0 and then once I lost concentration it went to +- 600 lol. shes a hard bird to keep level I dont know what else to say.

[mjolner]

T/O trim Botton in the air does nothing for the trim. You need to have Wight On Wheels for it to work in the air it only centers in MECH control column and thats for emergencies when using MECH instead of CAS

 

Ill try explain the trim...

 

The flight Control Computers have different modes of operation, the normal inflight one its called CAS, Control Augmentation System.

 

What this does it tries to zero the trim for whatever Joistick Input you set, so if you go 5° up with the joystick the CAS wil ZERO the trim at the needed position so you can fly off hands at 5° up, different things work at different rates for landing and TO mode, but they are basically the same.

I found out that I dont need to use manual trim. For anything.

 

You will get plenty of manual trim response in landing config, ie. gear and flaps down. Hornet has trim it is not used in a normal flight regime. I highly recommend you use manual trim to achieve on speed level flight when on approach. The amount of trim will depend on stores and fuel remaining.

[Steel Jaw]

There's no need to trim in normal flight rigjt? It automtrims in normal 1G flight.

[mjolner]

There's no need to trim in normal flight rigjt? It automtrims in normal 1G flight.

 

Yes more correctly I should have stated that there is no need to "manual" trim in normal flight.

[_SeaFox_]

T/O trim Botton in the air does nothing for the trim. You need to have Wight On Wheels for it to work in the air it only centers in MECH control column and thats for emergencies when using MECH instead of CAS

 

Ill try explain the trim...

 

The flight Control Computers have different modes of operation, the normal inflight one its called CAS, Control Augmentation System.

 

What this does it tries to zero the trim for whatever Joistick Input you set, so if you go 5° up with the joystick the CAS wil ZERO the trim at the needed position so you can fly off hands at 5° up, different things work at different rates for landing and TO mode, but they are basically the same.

I found out that I dont need to use manual trim. For anything.

 

You need the trim for asymmetric payload, which even autopilot cannot compensate (speaking of ATTH, HSEL is capable to deal with it). You need to trim the aircraft once you fire a missile or drop a bomb. And then, once you fire/drop another, you need again to look for center position. Which is annoying and difficult without visualization on controls display. Found that FCS page has way too low precision to serve for that. It is annoying when aircraft is still slowly banking on one or other side. In Harrier for example, the autopilot will find and set the balance position for you, trim the controls and then when you release autopilot, aircraft fly perfectly straight. I miss that greatly in Hornet.

[cdrkrotchetyusn]

Once I've dropped ordnance, I've found it's fairly evident the Hornet is out of trim. It's been easy so far to bump in a couple ticks of aileron, and that levels her out.

 

 

But just as Sea Fox mentions, that's the only time in normal flight that I'll touch the trim.

 

 

However, when coming into the break over the carrier, I'll:

 

 

Flop - Roll into 3g break turn

 

Chop - Throttle to idle

 

Boards - Speedbrake full extend

 

Drop - Gear & Flaps passing below 250kn, check Tailhook down

 

Boards - Speedbrake retract

 

Trim Trim Trim - On-speed AOA amber donut

 

 

Properly done, then from the 180 abeam the LSO platform to trapped in the wires on deck, I don't touch the trim again until I unfold my wings at the catapault. From there I use T/O trim half flaps for the cat shot.

 

 

Climbing to 600' pattern altitude, I drop my flaps to full, drop the hook, and

 

 

 

Trim, trim, trim to onspeed AOA amber donut. I'll turn downwind then at my interval (assuming others are in the CVN pattern), and not have to trim again until after the next cat shot.

 

 

Hope that helps.

 

 

Regards,

Curveball

VFA-113 STINGERS #302

[Ri0T]

Takeoff trim is for land use only. For cat shots, you will trim up from t/o (12) to 16,17, or 19 depending on a/c weight.