fixed P-51 Carb Air Controls

[chris455]

I have been away from DCS for some time, I understand the P-51 had a problem with it's carb air controls not working properly (lack of animation/ had to bind to an axis only, etc.).

Has this been corrected yet? 
many thanks for any helpful answers-

Chris

[razo+r]

No, still bugged.

[chris455]

Thank you. Have you heard anything as to whether they intend to fix this? 

[razo+r]

I'm sure they do intend to fix it. Question is "when".

[grafspee]

That is one good question.

[Mr_sukebe]

Can someone explain the benefits of the carb controls, ie implications on cooling and power, when to use?

[Doughguy]

vor 9 Minuten schrieb Mr_sukebe:

Can someone explain the benefits of the carb controls, ie implications on cooling and power, when to use?

that topic has been done to death on the last few pages.

to be blunt it gives more power. especially in greater heights.

one reason people complain the mustang is crap because this is not fixed. theres a .lua fix on around here. works like a charm.

 

Edited December 20, 2021 by Doughguy

[razo+r]

35 minutes ago, Mr_sukebe said:

Can someone explain the benefits of the carb controls, ie implications on cooling and power, when to use?

Basically, in DCS, you only have to move the cold air one to ram air. This gives maximum possible MP as opposed to the other setting with MP loss due to filtering.

 

Icing and dust is not modeled in DCS as of now, so any other setting is useless.

 

But you should also take a look at the manual. It's explained there to some extend.

Edited December 20, 2021 by razo+r

[Mr_sukebe]

Thanks chaps 

[grafspee]

When handle is moved forward it opens air scoop under the prop's hub,  at speed this scoop increases air pressure so it act like compressor, at 0 speed it does nothing.

So it increases max throttle height for Low and High blower speeds.

Here i am cycling RAM air handle back and forward.

You definitely want this to work if you are fighting high, or in gap between low and high blower switch.

 

Edited December 20, 2021 by grafspee

[BM357_TinMan]

Still broke

Very frustrating that DCS either doesn't believe it's broken, or doesn't think it is a high enough priority at the moment.

If the first, they are wrong and need to take note

If the second, I understand that there are plenty of things that need attention but, this was working and was broken in the 2.7 "Update" several months ago and has received absolutely no obvious attention from DCS.

It is a pain to deal with when doing instant action when you start a mission, in the air, with the engagement happening within a few seconds.

If you do NOT get these levers set correctly, you will blow up your engine (it presents like an oil overheat, but in reality, the engine just blew up).

[grafspee]

 I thought that this is only ground spawn problem since air start should have those levers set all way forward.

[chris455]

I am unaware that these levers cause overheat.

I thought overheat problem was caused by a bug with the cooling model. The workaround being to set both oil and coolant radiators to manual "open."

This should result in significant drag but at least you won't overheat.

The "levers" problem pertains to Ram Air vice Filtered Air and Carb Heat vice no Carb Heat. Shouldn't cause engine to "blow up" unless I am missing something.

Whatever it is ED needs to fix it soon. 

[Art-J]

The relevant thread in the Bugs section got "reported" status and closed long ago, so devs seem to be aware, but when is the bug going to come up higher on fixing priority list - is anyone's guess. 

Not sure if the bug makes overheating faster, but it sure does limit MAP at mid-to-high altitudes. 

Oh well, at least we have Dawger's mod available to fix the issue ourselves for the time being (I don't know if it's allowed in multiplayer though). Still works in 2.7.9. 

Edited December 30, 2021 by Art-J

[grafspee]

If levers are in unarmed position and hot air, first thing what happens is that fuel/air charge density will decrease due to higher temp this makes engine less power full and higher chance of detonation occure, and according to the manual operating hot air above 12k ft interfere with carb alt compensator which lead to leaning mixture too much which again make engine even less powerful, makes engine hotter and higher chance of detonations occure. 

And the most noticeable effect is lack of ram air boost as @Art-J said, which i tested, higher/faster you are, the more boost you get from ram air at alt around 28k you are looking at almost 10" boost from ram air alone

And if someone is unaware of this, it changes P-51 in to flying crap

Edited December 30, 2021 by grafspee

[Doughguy]

yup. and if the modded lua doesnt make it past the integrity check no wonder no one flies the mustang online... its not competative as its bugged..

the stang does have a slight edge over the k4 in level speed or turnfights if flown fast. but hows that gonna work if its crippled by default...

in regards of the oil cooler. i open them mainly if i know im about to engage in excessive turnfights or down on the deck. the drag is neglegible in a turnfight. its a mere 2 -3 knots really. more noticable if you want to run....

[razo+r]

Only the cockpit switch is bugged, but you still can use ramair. So it has not lost any functionality, not a single bit. And there are still plenty of people flying it. 

[grafspee]

7 minutes ago, razo+r said:

Only the cockpit switch is bugged, but you still can use ramair. So it has not lost any functionality, not a single bit. And there are still plenty of people flying it. 

100% right there. This why i say ppl who are unaware of this issue. Fix is very easy just assign spare axis or use modifier to cold air control bind

[Art-J]

@razo+r To avoid confusion, I'm talking strictly about using mouse to operate the ram-air and carb-heat levers. They're non-functional in that scenario, leaving the plane stuck in filtered and heated state.

I believe they're supposed to work correctly when assigned to analog axes, but are you saying they'll work if someone assigns them to keyboard commands? I personally don't care, as I'm strictly offline player, but it might be important info for online guys who cannot pass IC with modded files.

Edited December 30, 2021 by Art-J

[grafspee]

@Art-J as far as i know only axis command works. Keyboard binds moves levers but with no effect

[razo+r]

36 minutes ago, Art-J said:

@razo+r To avoid confusion, I'm talking strictly about using mouse to operate the ram-air and carb-heat levers. They're non-functional in that scenario, leaving the plane stuck in filtered and heated state.

I believe they're supposed to work correctly when assigned to analog axes, but are you saying they'll work if someone assigns them to keyboard commands? I personally don't care, as I'm strictly offline player, but it might be important info for online guys who cannot pass IC with modded files.

 

Yes, with mouse only it will lack a bit performance. 

But since you only operate the handle once and then leave it, I'm sure you will find a spare axis with a modifier to "work around" this issue. 

[Doughguy]

gonna suck big time if you only have a joystick....

and pretty crappy if you play online and start in the air. on the ground yeah well fine.. one can hassle with assigning axis and modifiers on the fly... but whats the point of that... 

its not a trait of the stang... its a known bug that spoils alot.

[razo+r]

1 hour ago, Doughguy said:

gonna suck big time if you only have a joystick....

and pretty crappy if you play online and start in the air. on the ground yeah well fine.. one can hassle with assigning axis and modifiers on the fly... but whats the point of that... 

its not a trait of the stang... its a known bug that spoils alot.

You only have to bind it once, which can be done in the main menue of the game too. Or do you always delete the bind again once you pushed the lever?

You can also use a joystick only for it, absolutely no problem, even when spawning in the air.

Is it annoying? Yes. Does it make life harder? Not really.

Edited December 30, 2021 by razo+r

[Sacarino111]

HI.

In my side, they don't move at all with a joystick assignement. Only movement is from 0 to 100 if I bind them to a button; no way I can make it work with the axis.

Saludos.

Saca111

Edited December 30, 2021 by Sacarino111

[razo+r]

9 minutes ago, Sacarino111 said:

HI.

In my side, they don't move at all with a joystick assignement. Only movement is from 0 to 100 if I bind them to a button; no way I can make it work with the axis.

Saludos.

Saca111

 

The animation is currently bugged. Using a key or mouse will move the lever, but not actually engage the function of the lever. Using an axis is the opposite. The lever will not move, but it will actually do the function that the lever is supposed to provide.

Best way to show: Go to a high altitude just below second gear kicks in. Move the lever with the mouse or keys and see the effect on Manifold pressure. Now do the same but by moving the lever with an axis.

You will see it won't do anything with mouse and keys, but it will work, despite no lever movement, when using an axis.