F-15E vs. F-18C

[Cunning_Raven]

It seems like we are forgetting about the AGM-130

[WinterH]

25 minutes ago, Spurts said:

AFAIK nothing on the F-15E module will have more standoff range than a Maverick or GBU-24 (both avail on Hornet as well).

AGM-130 is going to be Strike Eagle's standoff missile, with a similar "man in the loop" guidance like the SLAM-ER, however, latter being a lot more modern a weapon, has longer range. But AGM-130 is going to be a lot longer ranged than a Maverick. Its unpowered old brother, GBU-15, can also glide a fair distance more than Paveway IIs, but maybe not more than Paveway IIIs.

Also, I'm not entirely sure, but I think later updated Strike Eagles also had the ability to employ JSOWs. Strike Eagle's current long range stand-off part trick is SDBs, of which it can carry about half a million  but don't know if we'll have them in the module at any point.

Overall, Hornet has more variety in air to ground weapons with things like Harpoons, HARM, and for those of us who care about those (myself included) rockets. However, Strike Eagle can, unlike Hornet, happily loiter up high, or haul-ass down low for a long time/distance with an insane amount of JDAMs and LGBs, has a better night capability, a lot more powerful air to ground SAR capability where you can use the radar more or less like a TGP, through cloud cover and all, and can still carry at least 4 AMRAAMs at the same time just in case.

IMO, they both offer different pros-cons and sim experiences.

Also, PGMs aren't the only thing these birds are designed to use. When I get Strike Eagle, I know I'll do A LOT of toss bombing for example, where it'll be more interesting than Hornet due to its insane payload, and even more insane acceleration/speed to throw them sticks away  High altitude CCRP through clouds thanks to its crazy radar will also be a semi unique thing for Strike Eagle. Theoretically yes, other radars may also be able to pull it off sometimes, but their resolution isn't anything like Strike Eagle's APG-70.

[Steel Jaw]

One fundamental issue not discussed here is that the Hornet is single seat so you’re able to do everything whereas the Mudhen is gonna need 2 humans to be really effective.  Which is why I don’t fly the longbow I bought.

[WinterH]

4 minutes ago, Steel Jaw said:

One fundamental issue not discussed here is that the Hornet is single seat so you’re able to do everything whereas the Mudhen is gonna need 2 humans to be really effective.  Which is why I don’t fly the longbow I bought.

AFATIK, this is a bit of an overstatement. F-15E isn't quite like an F-14, F-4, Tornado, or MiG-31, where both seats are essential and do very different things simultaneously.

With F-15E, second seat is there to alleviate load, but both seats have access to almost every feature the other has, including flying the aircraft, and using pretty much any onboard sensor/weapon. If you want, you should be able to use Strike Eagle quite easily from just front seat.

[tusler]

Steel Jaw

One fundamental issue not discussed here is that the Hornet is single seat so you’re able to do everything whereas the Mudhen is gonna need 2 humans to be really effective.  Which is why I don’t fly the longbow I bought.

From what I have read in the F15E forum, the pilot will be able to do everything the wiso can do. So unlike the Ah64 and the F14 I will be able to solo fly the Strike Eagle effectively without needing another person..

Scott56

Not even that. RAZBAM have confirmed that the handful of startup functions that have to be performed by the WSO will have pilot seat keybinds.

Full functionality will be available from the pilot seat. This is a massive difference between the F15E and other two seat modules which YoYo keeps avoiding.

Edited February 19, 2023 by tusler

[Steel Jaw]

Damn it, stop making this a viable purchase for me...

[Nahen]

2 hours ago, Spurts said:

The Hornet has better standoff options: JSOW, HARM, Harpoon, SLAM, SLAM-ER.  AFAIK nothing on the F-15E module will have more standoff range than a Maverick or GBU-24 (both avail on Hornet as well).  That said, I am not a fan of those munitions in most cases, but you cannot say the loadouts are equivalent when only one has standoff capability.

Do You hear about JASSM-ER?

1 hour ago, Steel Jaw said:

One fundamental issue not discussed here is that the Hornet is single seat so you’re able to do everything whereas the Mudhen is gonna need 2 humans to be really effective.  Which is why I don’t fly the longbow I bought.

One pilot... when i hear/read comparisons of the F-15E to the F-14 in terms of a two-person crew, i basically know right away that the person who writes/speaks has no idea about the F-15E.

Edited February 19, 2023 by Nahen

[Spurts]

4 hours ago, WinterH said:

AGM-130 is going to be Strike Eagle's standoff missile, with a similar "man in the loop" guidance like the SLAM-ER

I was not familiar with AGM-130.  Thank you.

 

3 hours ago, Nahen said:

Do You hear about JASSM-ER?

 

I have not heard that ED is adding it to the game, only the GR mods.

[Steel Jaw]

6 hours ago, Nahen said:

Do You hear about JASSM-ER?

One pilot... when i hear/read comparisons of the F-15E to the F-14 in terms of a two-person crew, i basically know right away that the person who writes/speaks has no idea about the F-15E.

 

Well there you're wrong I know plenty about the Mudhen, going back to Microproses seminal Strike Eagle 3.

[JB3DG]

8 minutes ago, Steel Jaw said:

Well there you're wrong I know plenty about the Mudhen, going back to Microproses seminal Strike Eagle 3.

I don't think you can compare those old simulators which heavily limited functionality to the real deal. From those of us with -1s and -34s and other reference material, there is a reason we keep saying that everything the rear seater can do, the front guy can as well, with the exception of turning on the TGP and the countermeasures panels which are in the rear and only have to be touched once at startup. We would show the proof but ED has rightly restricted sharing such things, so you will have to take our word for it.

Edited February 20, 2023 by JB3DG

[Cab]

12 minutes ago, JB3DG said:

I don't think you can compare those old simulators which heavily limited functionality to the real deal. From those of us with -1s and -34s and other reference material, there is a reason we keep saying that everything the rear seater can do, the front guy can as well, with the exception of turning on the TGP and the countermeasures panels which are in the rear and only have to be touched once at startup. We would show the proof but ED has rightly restricted sharing such things, so you will have to take our word for it.

 

I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that @Steel Jaw was being sarcastic.

[Nahen]

9 hours ago, Steel Jaw said:

Well there you're wrong I know plenty about the Mudhen, going back to Microproses seminal Strike Eagle 3.

Since you are comparing the F-15E's weapon using capabilities from the front seat to the F/A-18C through the prism of the F-14, I'm sorry but you have no idea what you're comparing.

11 hours ago, Spurts said:

I have not heard that ED is adding it to the game, only the GR mods.

Up until a year or so ago, the F/A-18C had nothing but stupid bombs and Mavericks. So let's get back to the discussion one year after the F-15E comes out. Somehow I'm strangely confident that the F-15E will easily replace the F/A-18C in everything except the dubious pleasure of taking off and landing on a boat.

And he certainly won't run away from enemy fighters with a squeak

[davidrbarnette]

23 minutes ago, Nahen said:

 

And he certainly won't run away from enemy fighters with a squeak

Ahem… the F/A-18 has approximately two more real-world air to air kills than the F-15E. Kills on helicopters with bombs don’t count. ;)

[Nahen]

2 hours ago, davidrbarnette said:

Ahem… the F/A-18 has approximately two more real-world air to air kills than the F-15E. Kills on helicopters with bombs don’t count.

And do you know why?

By the way, if you write F/A-18 and not F/A-18C, it's tempting to ask if you forgot to count the F-15C?

 

And the F-15 in the E like and C version still has a clean slate which can't be said about the F/A-18

 

And one more: F-15E have shot down a Mi-24 Hind with a LASER in Iraqi, what do you think?

Edited February 20, 2023 by Nahen

[Nahen]

One more thing I remembered - One MiG-29 was destroyed by the so-called "manouver kill", the other managed to escape from the Sidewinder. So we have 2 F/A-18 kills vs one Mi-24 kill (by laser) one manouver kill for F-15E. It's just that no F-15E was shot down and the F/A-18 was

[Steel Jaw]

The question for this single seater remains can this Mudhen be effectively employed with one human ?

[Nahen]

17 minutes ago, Steel Jaw said:

The question for this single seater remains can this Mudhen be effectively employed with one human ?

Maybe read a bit about him?
Yes maybe. Therefore, the successor of the E - F-15EX is produced as a two-seater, but in principle does not need a second crew member for "standard" use. The pilot is able to perform 90% of tasks related to attacking ground targets. Of course, the second person - WSO facilitates, extends and makes the Strike Eagle a much more effective strike aircraft. But this is not an F-14 in which you can't do anything without RIO...

[AhSoul]

I think the answers is, yes you can do it on your own, but doing it with someone else will be better.

Like many things in life

Edited February 20, 2023 by AhSoul

[Catseye]

 

[JB3DG]

On 2/20/2023 at 7:36 AM, Nahen said:

Since you are comparing the F-15E's weapon using capabilities from the front seat to the F/A-18C through the prism of the F-14, I'm sorry but you have no idea what you're comparing.

Up until a year or so ago, the F/A-18C had nothing but stupid bombs and Mavericks. So let's get back to the discussion one year after the F-15E comes out. Somehow I'm strangely confident that the F-15E will easily replace the F/A-18C in everything except the dubious pleasure of taking off and landing on a boat.

And he certainly won't run away from enemy fighters with a squeak

It would be cool to pair the 10 AMRAAMs of the Hornet with the APG-70 of the Eagle....

[Spurts]

8 AMRAAMs and the speed and fuel to employ them is plenty

[Nahen]

43 minutes ago, JB3DG said:

It would be cool to pair the 10 AMRAAMs of the Hornet with the APG-70 of the Eagle....

F-15EX  

It's enough for me, as on a PvP server for one flight with 6x120 and 2x9 I come back with 2-3 kills and two-three AMRAAMs, two Sidewinders under the plane. I consider this a successful flight. But if you manage to come back with 5-6 kills and without AMRAAMs, I'm not complaining either I don't know what I would do with 10 x AiM-120 there probably wouldn't be enough fuel to use them

[Coole28]

20 hours ago, Nahen said:

[…]there probably wouldn't be enough fuel to use them

Thats what the CFTs are for

[shaneduce]

l0l, I'm waiting for the 15 to be released and will test it my self.

[JB3DG]

On 2/20/2023 at 1:58 PM, Steel Jaw said:

The question for this single seater remains can this Mudhen be effectively employed with one human ?

The front seat HOTAS controls make it an equivalent workload to that of the hornet or F-16 when operating things like the FLIR, A-G Radar, and A-G weapons in general. Same for A-A modes.